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Topic: Equipment advice to listen to 0hz to 20hz CD (Read 21885 times) previous topic - next topic
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Equipment advice to listen to 0hz to 20hz CD

Hi all,

I was hoping if anyone can give advice.

1. I wish to listen to an audio CD. The frequency ranges from 0hz to 20hz. I need 0hz to 20hz (not 20Khz).

2. Most CD players , headphones have a range from 20hz to 20Khz.

3. Can someone advice me of what brand+model that can allow me to "listen" to 0hz to 20hz for this CD.

ALSO,

If I convert this CD to MP3, would I lose the 0-20hz range (since most equipment are rated at 20hz-20Khz). If so, what equipment would you recommend please.

Thanks ALOT

Equipment advice to listen to 0hz to 20hz CD

Reply #1 –
HERE YOU GO!!!

Equipment advice to listen to 0hz to 20hz CD

Reply #3 –
Isn't it exactly that what the OP intended to do?!?

Equipment advice to listen to 0hz to 20hz CD

Reply #4 –
Quote from: micmac888 on
If I convert this CD to MP3, would I lose the 0-20hz range

I've found that MP3 preserves low frequencies very well, both 0 Hz DC offset and rumble from a misconfigured radio. But that was Fraunhoffer encoder I used back then.

Equipment advice to listen to 0hz to 20hz CD

Reply #5 –
Quote from: micmac888 on
Hi all,

I was hoping if anyone can give advice.

1. I wish to listen to an audio CD. The frequency ranges from 0hz to 20hz. I need 0hz to 20hz (not 20Khz).

2. Most CD players , headphones have a range from 20hz to 20Khz.

3. Can someone advice me of what brand+model that can allow me to "listen" to 0hz to 20hz for this CD.

ALSO,

If I convert this CD to MP3, would I lose the 0-20hz range (since most equipment are rated at 20hz-20Khz). If so, what equipment would you recommend please.

Thanks ALOT

Most audio amplifiers have an internal protection against DC on output (like a little capacitor in series) so getting out anything under 5 Hz at reasonable amplitude will be quite hard.
It could also be dangerous to a loudspeaker which would operate more like an electromagnet and you could tear the surround or burn out the voice-coil.

Equipment advice to listen to 0hz to 20hz CD

Reply #6 –
Well there are some subwoofer/transmission lines that go down to about 17 Hz. But those are already massive and huge. More than hear you may feel these sounds with a bodyshaker attached to your chair.

Equipment advice to listen to 0hz to 20hz CD

Reply #7 –
You'd only be able to hear the sympathetic vibration of others materials resonating at some multiple of those 0-20Hz waves. 

And good luck reproducing those frequencies.  Even a high-end studio monitor subwoofer, such as the Mackie HRS-120, only goes down to 20Hz.

You would need special equipment to reproduce those frequencies at any significant amplitude.  Like Martel mentioned, most equipment has electronic circuitry that acts as a high pass filter.

Equipment advice to listen to 0hz to 20hz CD

Reply #8 –
I'm not sure if you all are getting at his question...

Very briefly, perfect human hearing is ideally from 20 hz to 20,000 hz (or 20 khz).  1 hz = 1 hertz = 1 cycle per second. 

Many people cannot hear the full range.  After 30 years old, the high end starts to drop off.

Most hifi equipment is designed for the frequencies we can hear.  In other words, most stuff is not designed to go down to 10 hz or up to 40 khz.  Only very good systems, primarily with very good subwoofers, get down to 20hz.  The difference in frequencies a piece of hifi can reproduce, or in a piece of music, is called the frequency range.

All cd players are 97% alike, IMHO, and all have a 20-20 frequency range.  So that doesn't really matter.  Speakers/headphones are a matter of taste, but the more expensive ones (especially headphones) generally "sound better", in that they can produce a broader range of sound more completely.  But they all also all tend to sound different.

Listen to a lot of speakers and headphones, using your own CDs in the stores, and pick what you like.  Poke around here for recommendations.  I prefer Grado headphones.

___________________________________________________

The MP3 codec does not exactly copy the original - you lose some info.  But it has no effect on the frequency range of the music.  Because MP3 is not an exact copy, it is called "lossy" because some info is permanently lost.  But the whole idea is to get the file smaller via compression.

There are some lossless codecs, including flac and shn.  However, these do not compress as much as MP3.

Most audiophiles will not listen to MP3 on their home systems, because it is not an exact copy of the original piece.

Equipment advice to listen to 0hz to 20hz CD

Reply #9 –
I'd like to know what audio CD is there that has ONLY the very low frequencies of 0 to 20 Hz.


However, the OP is looking for a CD player (and headphones?) than can handle <20Hz.

Well, here's one.  The audiophile-grade Onkyo CD player:

Onkyo DX-7555

http://www.us.onkyo.com/model.cfm?m=DX-755...%20Disc&p=s


According to the specs, it can handle 2 Hz to 20KHz.  Hopefully that's enough, unless you absolutely must have that 0 to 2Hz range.

It also has a built-in headphone jack, so you don't have to risk going through a separate amp/receiver that could possibly filter out <20Hz.


Now for headphones that can reproduce 0 to 20Hz, you might need to go after the "audiophile" grade headphones.  I'm talking about the ones that are $350 USD or more.

For example, the Denon AH-D2000 lists for $350 USD and according to the specs, has a playback range of 5 Hz to 45 kHz (according to the downloadable product sheet PDF);


Denon AH-D2000 general info on Denon's website:

http://usa.denon.com/ProductDetails/3463.asp


Denon AH-D2000 product sheet:

http://usa.denon.com/AH-5000_2000_1000-Lit.pdf



You might try ripping this CD to a lossless format like FLAC or WavPack to preserve the entire frequency range, and avoid the risk that a lossy scheme will "throw out" the extremely low and extremely high frequencies.

Whether or not the CD player and headphones in combination can actually reproduce most of the frequencies below 20Hz at a level loud enough for you to enjoy it is another thing.  I don't own either of the products so I can't say for sure.  I'm just going by their published specs, which can sometimes be exaggerated a little.

Equipment advice to listen to 0hz to 20hz CD

Reply #11 –
Quote
I'd like to know what audio CD is there that has ONLY the very low frequencies of 0 to 20 Hz.


However, the OP is looking for a CD player (and headphones?) than can handle <20Hz.


Yeah, I missed that.  I have no idea what he wants.

Equipment advice to listen to 0hz to 20hz CD

Reply #12 –
Quote from: WonderSlug on
According to the specs, it can handle 2 Hz to 20KHz.  Hopefully that's enough, unless you absolutely must have that 0 to 2Hz range.
It also has a built-in headphone jack, so you don't have to risk going through a separate amp/receiver that could possibly filter out <20Hz.

Are you sure this range applies to the built-in headphone amplifier as well? It could be just the spec on the line-out.

Equipment advice to listen to 0hz to 20hz CD

Reply #13 –
Quote from: seditious3 on
Yeah, I missed that.  I have no idea what he wants.

Presumably, he wants to induce irrational fear caused by infrasound.

Quote
Human reactions to infrasound

Infrasound has been known to cause feelings of awe or fear in humans.[9] Since it is not consciously perceived, it can make people feel vaguely that supernatural events are taking place.

Some film soundtracks make use of infrasound to produce unease or disorientation in the audience. Irréversible is one such movie.

In music, Brian "Lustmord" Williams is known to utilize infrasound to create these same feelings.

[/size]

Equipment advice to listen to 0hz to 20hz CD

Reply #14 –
Take a look at THIS!  They claim it goes to 1Hz, and in a small, nearly-sealed, room I don't see why it couldn't go to zero-Hz!  (In fact, their measured frequency response graph does show it going to zero!)

All "regular" (moving coil) speakers will mechanically go down to DC, but not acoustically.  You could probably build something with a small speaker and a pipe that would more-or-less directly-couple the speaker to your eardrum.  And, if you could seal this thing around your ear with (silicone seal or something    ), you could actually go to zero!

Zero Hz is just static air pressure.  You can feel an air-pressure change in your ears (i.e. when you go up or down in an airplane), but you can't hear it.  And, this sensitivity doesn't really go to zero-Hz, because after a while the pressure equalizes and you can no longer feel it...  You are feeling the change, and change isn't zero...    (We are probably talking about a frequency measured in cycles-per-hour.)

There are positively-pressurized clean-rooms rooms used in semiconductor manufacturing (maybe operating rooms too).  This is done so that  all of the air coming into the room has to pass through the filters, preventing dust & contaminates from  "sneaking around" the filters.

Equipment advice to listen to 0hz to 20hz CD

Reply #15 –
i believe every amp can do 0hz.
just turn it off... :-D
Sven Bent - Denmark

Equipment advice to listen to 0hz to 20hz CD

Reply #16 –
Humans cannot hear under 20 Hz. I think the OP wants to play music for his/her elephants. 

Equipment advice to listen to 0hz to 20hz CD

Reply #17 –
Quote from: ggf31416 on
Humans cannot hear under 20 Hz. I think the OP wants to play music for his/her elephants. 


Why did those organ builders include 32' stops in their instruments? Those go to 16.7 Hz and you most certainly can hear it and it's a wonderful sound. There are some excellent recordings of the organ at Ratzebug Cathedral played by Peter Hurford on London/Decca that have a lot of low-C 16 Hz material. I'm told the First Confregational Church in LA has added a 64' stop to one of the organs that goes to 8 Hz but I've never heard a 64' stop played. Maybe it's time to pay a visit again.

G²

Equipment advice to listen to 0hz to 20hz CD

Reply #18 –
at a certain point the sound is more 'felt' than 'heard'.

Equipment advice to listen to 0hz to 20hz CD

Reply #19 –
Quote from: Glenn Gundlach on
Why did those organ builders include 32' stops in their instruments? Those go to 16.7 Hz and you most certainly can hear it and it's a wonderful sound. There are some excellent recordings of the organ at Ratzebug Cathedral played by Peter Hurford on London/Decca that have a lot of low-C 16 Hz material. I'm told the First Confregational Church in LA has added a 64' stop to one of the organs that goes to 8 Hz but I've never heard a 64' stop played. Maybe it's time to pay a visit again.

G²


Would you not be hearing the harmonics rather than the tone itself (33.4hz) ?

Equipment advice to listen to 0hz to 20hz CD

Reply #20 –
maybe electrostatic drivers could be more suitable for reproducing the infrasound but still a capable cd player and amplifier need to be chosen.

Quote from: Glenn Gundlach on
organ builders include 32' stops in their instruments? Those go to 16.7 Hz and you most certainly can hear it and it's a wonderful sound

1.) Those pipes don't output clean sine waves. Your're hearing the higher frequency parts/harmonics of the sound.
2.) As it was already mentioned several times, the infrasound part of the sound is felt, not heared.

Equipment advice to listen to 0hz to 20hz CD

Reply #21 –
IIRC, the old ionic transducers could actually reproduce 0 Hz because they could induce a steady flow of air out of the enclosure.  I have no idea how many dB down the output was, and I'll bet there aren't many of these in service today - the degradation of the electrodes because of the high voltage and consequent evaporation (?) of the materials apparently shortened their service life dramatically.

On a slight tangent: if someone could mention catalog #s for those organ recordings (Hopefully on CD? PM me if it's too off-topic) I'm interested.  I love this sort of music and would like to try it on my subwoofer...

Equipment advice to listen to 0hz to 20hz CD

Reply #22 –
Thanks Guys (some of you) for the informative replies.

I know the human ear can hear *audibly* from 20Hz to 20KHz .

My interest was for the equipment to truly generate frequecies below 20Hz (preferably 0-16hz). It's for meditation purposes (Alpha, Delta, and the Theta brainwave frequencies).

And yes, it is just practically impossible to generate 0hz. But with the replies above, I will be scouting out those that can generate as low as possible.

Thanks again (some of you).

micmac

Equipment advice to listen to 0hz to 20hz CD

Reply #23 –
I had a system which went down to 1Hz. You could see the cones moving, but could not hear anything.

To get the cones coupling to the air and moving it effectively (i.e. setting up a longitudinal wave that could be "sensed" if anything was able to do so) would require much larger speaker cones, or a different enclosure design.

Just moving an 8" cone at 1Hz is about as effective as flapping your hand around slowly (i.e. not very!).

P.S. a log frequency plot can't show the response at 0Hz, unless there's a break in the scale.

Cheers,
David.

Equipment advice to listen to 0hz to 20hz CD

Reply #24 –
Will try it out. But I doubt I can duplicate what you achieved without more details.

I don't proclaim myself to know alot of audio-phile, but I've enough chums who are certainly more experienced than some here (and some of whom are developers of audio equipment that are already sitting in your expensive living/sound rooms). It's that my requirement simply stumped everyone I know.

Was told prolonged ultra low frequencies can cause resonance to materials visible to the eye. So the room I used for meditation has been converted to "frequency impenetrable" (no , not sound room) with help of my chums.

Was also told to best use headphones ("to minimise dissipation of energy, and, eliminate impact resonance on anything in the surroundings"). Didn't ask further, as it gets too confusing for me.

Was also told not to read into the brochures but to test using an acoustic measuring device in the demo room.

The above is the easy part. I'll be happy when I can achieve *real* 1hz-16hz.