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Topic: Sennheiser Hd570 Vs Hd590 Vs Hd600 (Read 19589 times) previous topic - next topic
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Sennheiser Hd570 Vs Hd590 Vs Hd600

Hello all,

I will get a chance to sell off my HD570, and I'm considering doing so and upgrading to a pair of HD590 or HD600's. The HD570 were nice, but they were a bit overbright on the high end and this has been bothering me.

I wonder if anyone has got experience with the HD590 and/or the HD600 and can comment on the quality.

Are there any really audible differences between the HD590 and the HD600?

The upgrade to the HD590 will cost about 100 Euros, and I'm willing to spend the money, but not if it is only a marginal improvement. I have the same question about the HD600's, which would cost an additional 200 Euros.

My SB128 card can feed the HD570's (64 Ohm) without much problems.  I suppose it'll barely make the HD590 (120 Ohm) as well? The HD600 (300 Ohm) is probably overkill I guess.

Sennheiser Hd570 Vs Hd590 Vs Hd600

Reply #1 –
I haven't listened much to the HD590 yet, maybe someone with more experience can comment, but from what I've heard:
If I remember correctly, the HD 590 is quite different from the HD 600, the first is "boomier", while the second's sound quality is deemed far superior. The HD 580 on the other hand is very similar to the HD 600, mainly older and usually cheaper.
For more information, visit http://www.headwize.com (or http://headwize.powerpill.org ).

Sennheiser Hd570 Vs Hd590 Vs Hd600

Reply #2 –
I can't answer your question exactly, because I own the 580's. But I can tell you that I found a headphone amp to be a worthwile investment (Musical Fidelity X-Cans). I doubt you'll get 200 euros worth of improvement from plugging in a pair of HD600's into your SoundBlaster. I'm no audiophile, but a SB128 will simply not do the 600's justice.

They're seriously great headphones, but in my experience both the 580's and the 600's require a decent source and a powerful headphone amp (/jack) to really shine. I had the same feeling as you about the brightness, but the amp did away with that completely.

So in essence: perhaps the extra 100 euros is better spent on a better soundcard or something. Lots of more headphone related stuff @ www.head-fi.org and www.headwize.com, in case you missed them. =)

Cheers,
Uosdwis

Edit: btw the 580's are as Continuum points out very similar to the 600's. They use the same driver, but are built using different material. That's basically it.

Sennheiser Hd570 Vs Hd590 Vs Hd600

Reply #3 –
The 570's sound is more similar to the 590 than the 600.

The sound of the 590 is bright but supposedly more refined than the 570.

The 600 on the other hand is much more 'polite', you'd like these if you don't like an aggressive sound.

Usually I won't post this, but I bet you guys here must love it  :
http://www.headphone.com/graphCompare.php?...pare+Headphones

It's a graph comparing the frequency response of the 3 phones.

You can see that the differences are mostly in the upper frequencies.

I also own the 580, not the 600, and the descriptions of the 570 and 590 are from hearsay. But where I live I've heard a hundred people expound on the relative virtues of each phone a hundred times, so I think my descriptions should be quite accurate 

I don't think you'd have too much trouble driving the 600 to volume with your sound card, but you would want a dedicated amp for better sound quality.

Sennheiser Hd570 Vs Hd590 Vs Hd600

Reply #4 –
I own the 600's and can only recommend them ... superb frequency response over the whole spectrum, wonderfully detailed mid-hi sound and a well-balanced bass (not boomy at all, but powerful) are the main characteristics ... voice reproduction sounds great to me, too.

Although these headphones are kinda big, the use of carbon-fiber material makes them really lightweight ... and the ear-cushion makes them somewhat sweaty to wear in summer (they keep nice and warm in winter, though )

The 600's are 120 Ohm-Headphones (kinda low impedance) so they will perform reasonably well (overall loudness as well as sound quality) on a portable device with a suitable headphone amp, too (tested with Sony MZ-R30, Archos Jukebox Studio 20, TerraTec M3POGo) and they have a 3,5 mm jack that is sourrounded by a 6,3 mm adapter (both gold-plated) so there is no need for external stuff.

As ususal with Sennheiser, all components can be replaced seperately from one another and as a person that knows their support ... you will still get spare parts in 2015 ... so this could really be a long-time investment.

My suggestion would be to get to a local retailer and give them a try (bring some of your own CD's with you) ... there are models from other manufacturers that are comparable in price and sound quality, too 

And, one unsignificant, but important (to me) thing ... they are "made in the EU" as well ...
The name was Plex The Ripper, not Jack The Ripper

Sennheiser Hd570 Vs Hd590 Vs Hd600

Reply #5 –
Quote
I don't think you'd have too much trouble driving the 600 to volume with your sound card, but you would want a dedicated amp for better sound quality.

Peter P commented on IRC yesterday that he had no problem powering a pair of HD580 (300 Ohms) with the same soundcard as I use, so it seems that that is not a problem, although it does certainly surprise me.

The problem of buying an additional headphone amp is that it's an extra cost, an extra cable and that they're hard to come by.

Edit: Also, thanks for the tips about the HD580=HD600. For the price difference, I'll want to take the HD580 then

Sennheiser Hd570 Vs Hd590 Vs Hd600

Reply #6 –
I've also got a HD580 headphones, I've read too that they are the same as the HD600, but the later are more "beautifully" built, and the drivers are supposedly better matched in pairs.

The only problems you migh have driving them directly from your SB128 is that the volume may not be very loud, due to the high impedance of the headphones (but if Peter says it's ok, I guess there is no problem in that respect), and the (I guess) not very good quality of the output amp of the card.

You can overcome these problems using a dedicate headphone amp, as others have pointed, or using the speaker outputs of an integrated amplifier, or receiver. In my experience, even inexpensive amps are quite good for that purpose. The ony problem you might have is a too loud output level, including amp hiss. To solve this and reduce the output level while keeping a low output impedance, I've built a very simple voltage divider consisting of two low value resistors, for each channel.

If you want more details, just tell me here.

Sennheiser Hd570 Vs Hd590 Vs Hd600

Reply #8 –
Quote
Quote
Usually I won't post this, but I bet you guys here must love it  :
http://www.headphone.com/graphCompare.php?...pare+Headphones

Interesting graph. The HD570 is +12dB at 12kHz. No wonder I think it's overbright!

Hard to believe.  I tried adding a 12 decibel boost in this region with supereq, and the results were near unlistenable.

If that graph is correct, I don't think the new amplifier is going to solve the problem completely.

Do you use supereq?  You might be able to smooth out the response a bit with this, and save yourself some money.

I still can't believe such a quality product could be out this badly.?

Sennheiser Hd570 Vs Hd590 Vs Hd600

Reply #9 –
Quote
The only problems you migh have driving them directly from your SB128 is that the volume may not be very loud, due to the high impedance of the headphones (but if Peter says it's ok, I guess there is no problem in that respect), and the (I guess) not very good quality of the output amp of the card.

This is not such a big problem. In fact I feel that they are a bit too loud when I plug it directly in the line out.

A friend who bought HD570 had some problem pushing the volume up (using the same model of soundcard as I have) so he had to buy an amplifier.

It seems like the HD600 is easier to "drive" than the HD570. I have no idea why, but that is my experience.

/Erik

Sennheiser Hd570 Vs Hd590 Vs Hd600

Reply #10 –
Quote
Hard to believe.  I tried adding a 12 decibel boost in this region with supereq, and the results were near unlistenable.


Mmm. I dunno what to think of it. Are we misinterpreting the graph? Frank commented when I did ATH tests for him that the hearing curve was badly screwed on the upper end, so it could be due to those headphones and that the effect is so bad. Then again, it would be amazing that a pair of Sennheisers is that bad.

Quote
If that graph is correct, I don't think the new amplifier is going to solve the problem completely.


I'm looking for new headphones, not an amp, anyway

Sennheiser Hd570 Vs Hd590 Vs Hd600

Reply #11 –
I had a pair of HD595’s I thought they where quite power hungry, a bit weak on bass the biggest flaw IMO is that they are not enclosed.

But I thought the sound quality was very good for my ears.

Sennheiser Hd570 Vs Hd590 Vs Hd600

Reply #12 –
Don't analyze the graph without reading the experimental setup first

Sennheiser Hd570 Vs Hd590 Vs Hd600

Reply #13 –
I knew it had to be  something.

Sennheiser Hd570 Vs Hd590 Vs Hd600

Reply #14 –
Their ideal curve is formed by averaging the frequency response of the 10 phones that they consider to be the best on the market:

Senn HD600
AKG K1000
Sennheiser Orpheus
and 7 that I don't remember 

BTW, the HD600 are 300Ohms, not 120.

Sennheiser Hd570 Vs Hd590 Vs Hd600

Reply #15 –
Are people buying these expensive headphones for their sound cards and portable players?  If you're paying for more transparency, then past a certain point all you're paying for is to hear more of the hiss from your portable, the 'detail' of your sound card's noise floor, etc.  IMHO it's best to pair headphones with comparable quality gear... it would be silly to buy a Yugo and then have a Ferrari engine mounted in it (?).

Sennheiser Hd570 Vs Hd590 Vs Hd600

Reply #16 –
Quote
... it would be silly to buy a Yugo and then have a Ferrari engine mounted in it (?).

No, certainly not silly but absolutely cool. The Yugo weighs only about half of waht a ferrari weighs. This thing would go off like hell 
sic transit gloria mundi...

Sennheiser Hd570 Vs Hd590 Vs Hd600

Reply #17 –
Haha.. sure... While I lived in Yugoslavia (here is where famous  hehe Yugo is being made )    I knew few people that replaced the engine with stronger one (mostly from Fiat)  - and in the result you are getting seems to be very quick grave on the wheels - So the result might be very "cool" for you at the end



Regarding HD600,  I have a pair of them and attached to SB audigy platinum amp (on the front panel) they sound pretty decent to me

Sennheiser Hd570 Vs Hd590 Vs Hd600

Reply #18 –
Quote
in the result you are getting seems to be very quick grave on the wheels - So the result might be very "cool" for you at the end


Is there a typo here--a grave on wheels huh?

BTW, here's the 10 phones they use:

Sennheiser Orpheus HE-HEV90
Sennheiser HD 600
Sennheiser HD 580
Sennheiser HD 495
Beyerdynamic DT 250-80
Beyerdynamic DT 831
AKG K 1000
AKG K 501
Grado RS1
Sony CD3000

See http://headphone.com/layout.php?topicID=10...&subTopicID=122

Thanks to TravelLite at Head-Fi for pointing this out.

Sennheiser Hd570 Vs Hd590 Vs Hd600

Reply #19 –
Someone please correct me if i'm terribly wrong here, but isn't averaging(?)FRs of 10 subjectively good headphones and making the result the reference point for future measurements misguiding and not indicative of anything?

That said, you can probably still compare 'brightness' of different headphones looking at those graphs, if you happen to own one of the tested models.

Sennheiser Hd570 Vs Hd590 Vs Hd600

Reply #20 –
well you can always look at their raw frequency response curves...

Sennheiser Hd570 Vs Hd590 Vs Hd600

Reply #21 –
Quote
Quote

Hard to believe.  I tried adding a 12 decibel boost in this region with supereq, and the results were near unlistenable.


Mmm. I dunno what to think of it. Are we misinterpreting the graph? Frank commented when I did ATH tests for him that the hearing curve was badly screwed on the upper end, so it could be due to those headphones and that the effect is so bad. Then again, it would be amazing that a pair of Sennheisers is that bad.

Quote
If that graph is correct, I don't think the new amplifier is going to solve the problem completely.


I'm looking for new headphones, not an amp, anyway

The HD-570 headphones have much too much treble, so IMHO these headphones are only medium quality headphone. For modern pop music,
which also have too much treble, listening with the HD-570 is quite un-
comfortable. I would prefer all the other headphones Sennheiser
manufactured before: HD-520, HD-540, HD-545, HD-560, HD-565.

The HD-580 are well balanced headphones and sounding a little bit more
neural than the HD-50 II Ovation I own.

The HD-590 has the same problem than the HD-570. Too much treble.

A headphone with nice balanced treble is the Philips HP-890. But this
headphone has ca. 15 dB bass boost, so you need an amplifier with a
bass control to reduce the bass at medium and high listening levels.
--  Frank Klemm

Sennheiser Hd570 Vs Hd590 Vs Hd600

Reply #22 –
I've had the 580 through standard SB128, not too bad. Currently, a BeyerDynamic DT990 through an M-audio Delta 66. Sound is more balanced, neutral (and very quiet).
Good thing I never heard the 570, because I feel the 580 already has too much treble.

Sennheiser Hd570 Vs Hd590 Vs Hd600

Reply #23 –
Quote
I've had the 580 through standard SB128, not too bad. Currently, a BeyerDynamic DT990 through an M-audio Delta 66. Sound is more balanced, neutral (and very quiet).
Good thing I never heard the 570, because I feel the 580 already has too much treble.

Don't understand anything. The DT-990 has much more treble than the
HD-580.
--  Frank Klemm

Sennheiser Hd570 Vs Hd590 Vs Hd600

Reply #24 –
Quote
Quote
I've had the 580 through standard SB128, not too bad. Currently, a BeyerDynamic DT990 through an M-audio Delta 66. Sound is more balanced, neutral (and very quiet).
Good thing I never heard the 570, because I feel the 580 already has too much treble.

Don't understand anything. The DT-990 has much more treble than the
HD-580.

Huh? Not in my experience...