A newbie with some comments/questions...

2003-07-01 08:51:12

Hello, all.  I've been lurking for a few days now, as I've been developing a strong interest in high-end digital audio.  I'm VERY new to DAE...I ripped my first CD less than a year ago, and have only used PhatNoise and Windows Media Player (*GASP*) for digital audio extraction, compression/encoding and decoding.  I still haven't found out exactly what back-ends these products use, but I feel sure they're not up to par with some of the better stuff (LAME, EAC, foobar2000, Monkey's, etc.).  So...I guess you could say I'm just getting my feet wet when it comes to using "the good stuff".

A comment on the quality of the software I've found...I've been working in IT for 12 years now, and I've never found freeware/open-source that was as high-calibur as many of these tools are.  I've recently downloaded and used Exact Audio Copy v0.95 (pb3), LAME 3.90.3, RazorLame 1.1.5, and MP3Gain (1.2.0/1.4.1), among others, and I'm more impressed with them than a lot of the expensive, licensed software I've experienced.

So, I wanted my first posting here to be a big THANK YOU to the people who worked on the development/tweaking/testing of these tools.

Kudos to:

- Frank Klemm and the entire LAME development team
- Dibrom for making a great product sensational, and for creating this site!
- Andre Wiethoff and anyone else involved with EAC
- Chris Myden for providing thorough setup instructions that even a "digital audio dummy" like me could figure out
- Holger Dors for creating a fantasic LAME front-end
- Anyone else who has been instrumental in making digital audio extraction/compression/encoding/decoding effective and easy-to-use at the same time

And since I'm new to all this, of course I've got dozens of questions which I'll post in the coming days.  I intend to continue developing an understanding of digital audio extraction and compression and all of the techniques and tools involved with it, to provide whatever help I can as I learn more, and maybe to make some friends along the way.

My current setup is:

> Hardware:  Sony notebook PC (with stock sound card...ugh) connected to Klipsch THX 170w 2.1 speakers, a collection of cheapie headphones (which I plan on upgrading), a custom audio system in my car including a 20GB Music Keg (same thing as a Phatbox), a mid-range Sony/Bose home theater which is also in need of upgrading (but which I use my PC with to enable the use of extracted digital audio including FLAC and MP3), and a couple of portable MP3 players.

> Software: Windows Media Player (*gasp* again...moving out of it, though), PhatNoise Music Manager (needed for file management of the Phatbox's DMS, but I don't use it anymore for extraction or encoding), Exact Audio Copy (aaahhhh...finally, a nice extraction tool!), LAME (definitely the best MP3 encoder I've ever used), RazorLame to front LAME with, Monkey's Audio (just getting familiar with it), MP3Gain, WavGain, Renatager, and a few others.

> Formats:  WAV, MP3 and FLAC mostly, but wanting to try Ogg Vorbis, MPC, and a few others.

> Compression Details:  When I started last year, it was 128kbps CBR MP3...not bad for a "first format".  A couple of months ago, upgraded to 192kbps CBR...big difference!  Now, I'm right in the middle of experimenting with and comparing MP3 formats using --alt-preset standard, --alt-preset extreme, high ABRs and CBRs (256k and up).  I'm using WAV for reference baselines, and also considering FLAC for normal use (in case I decide on going lossless with all but the portables).


So, thanks to everyone here for unknowingly "training me" in the proper ways of digital audio compression!


///ScorLibran


P.S., how do I create a posting signature?

A newbie with some comments/questions...

Reply #1 – 2003-07-01 09:46:56

1) With EAC, try just using it to rip directly to MP3 instead of using razorlame to conver the ripped WAVs to MP3s, saves time . Hit F11 and configure it like so..

2) http://www.echoindigo.com , it's a real great card, I got to try it some time ago. Gets rid of the hissing and stuff when using it/minimizing/maximizing windows.

3) Headphones, I use these Aiwas(available in Best Buy) for home/when I want top notch quality, and these Sennheiser MX300s for portable use, awesome sounding buds, very high quality.  I dream of getting these if I become rich someday.

A newbie with some comments/questions...

Reply #2 – 2003-07-01 11:27:11

Actually, I do use EAC as my primary extractor and compression front-end to call LAME for MP3 encoding.  I only used RazorLame for encoding MP3s from existing WAV files into other formats and bitrates, until I found out how to use EAC to call LAME to compress existing WAV's the same way.  And I like working with only one interface whenever possible, so EAC is so far where I spend most of my encoding time.  I use RazorLame whenever EAC is "busy".

So for the LAME command, what is the %s and %d for?

I also like the way EAC uses freebd for tagging, rather than having to enter data and masks manually into RazorLame.  Alt-G and you're done!  (Easier to use than Renatager, too, IMO.)

I'll try setting up some other front-ends in EAC as well.  Haven't linked Monkey's into it yet.  I'll do FLAC also.

Checked out the Echo Indigo adapter, looks like a nice product for under $100.  Also heard lots of good things about Sennheiser, plus for portable headphones got some recommendations for Koss PortaPro.  I'd like to have some reference-quality Sennheiser's for home, then maybe the PortaPro's for travel and portable use.

Thx!


///ScorLibran

A newbie with some comments/questions...

Reply #3 – 2003-07-01 11:37:59

Im new here at hydrogen audio too, and i must say this place rocks 
The %s and %d is not needed if you selected Lame encoder in EAC and not the user defined encoder.
I have moved away from MP3 becus MPC ownz it 

A newbie with some comments/questions...

Reply #4 – 2003-07-01 12:00:14

Welcome to THE Forum people!!

I too started messing about with LAME (Xing......I thought it was brilliant), graduated to MPC (EAC for ripping of course) and have just got a masters degree in AAC (trying out PlexTools for ripping).

I still use LAME for portable and stand alone DVD player, but for archiving have been recently converted to AAC which transcodes "perfectly" to MP3 (aps).

I think the trick in this Forum is to keep a completely open mind as the quantity and quality of information which bounces about at HA is staggering.


Best,
auldyin

A newbie with some comments/questions...

Reply #5 – 2003-07-01 12:15:52

RaWShadow,

Thx for the info!

I haven't heard an MPC encoded file yet, but since everyone says it's higher fidelity per bitrate than MP3, I'm sure I'll agree when I get around to trying it out.

I have to stick with MP3's in the case of my portable devices, though, because they don't speak MPC    Nor does the Phatbox in my car       

But for listening from my PC, I'm considering MPC, FLAC, compressed WAV, or maybe the top quality setting for Ogg Vorbis since I understand they're using a completely different psychoacoustic model for compression than MP3 codecs.  One consideration for me is limited storage capacity.  I've only got 20GB on my PC's music partition (notebook PC = expensive to upgrade), and 20GB on my PhatNoise cartridge as well (cheaper to upgrade).  So I can't keep a bunch of my CDs in WAV *and* FLAC *and* MPC *and* MP3 formats.  I have to pick one primary, and one for my portables.

Until I get more HDD space, I foresee a world of FLAC for PC-listening and archival, and probably --alt-preset standard MP3's for my portables.  As it's been said many, many times, no lossy encoded format will ever compete with lossless, but if high-bitrate MPC can do anything close to FLAC with sound quality, I'll consider it as my primary.

A newbie with some comments/questions...

Reply #6 – 2003-07-01 12:22:02

People I want to add to the list ScorLibran started:

-Peter Pawlowski for foobar2000
-David Robinson for Replaygain
-Case for Tag and his plugins for foobar
-Max Bureck for Tagger (-the Tagger that uses Tag )
-Andree Buschmann for Musepack (MPC)

And everyone else making plugins for foobar2000.


Edit: Improved my english