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Topic: 100% Exact CD Duplication (Read 13374 times) previous topic - next topic
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100% Exact CD Duplication

This is what I want.  I want to create an exact flawless copy of one of my cds.  It's a rare cd that I have gotten signed by the band (mindless self indulgence - tight for anyone who cares) and i want to make a copy of it and store the original away forever (i might have it shrinkwrapped).  I want to be able to store the img on my hard drive and store it as a data cd also.  I was hoping to use flac.  Gaps and everything should be in this image (cuesheet is fine as long as it's compatible with nero).  Can anyone help on this?

100% Exact CD Duplication

Reply #1 –
You will probably want to use EAC for the ripping stage 

100% Exact CD Duplication

Reply #2 –
yes I planned on using EAC with secure mode + test and copy.  Basically I need to know about cuesheets and flac's built in cuesheet feature.  Then after I have one giant flac file how i should go about burning EXACT copies of the cd.

100% Exact CD Duplication

Reply #3 –
Quote
yes I planned on using EAC with secure mode + test and copy.

paranoid? :-)

100% Exact CD Duplication

Reply #4 –
Quote
yes I planned on using EAC with secure mode + test and copy.  Basically I need to know about cuesheets and flac's built in cuesheet feature.  Then after I have one giant flac file how i should go about burning EXACT copies of the cd.

IMHO You can use EAC to create the .cue file and then extract the whole disk to a single .wav.
Since I never used FLAC, I have no idea about its built-in cuesheet feature.
I'm not sure of any burning software wich can handle flac files directly(maybe dBporwerAmp does)

For backup purposes, I've been using EAC+Monkey dll, to individual tracks(no cuesheet) and it works fine.
I hope it helps.


LIF
"Jazz washes away the dust of everyday life" (Art Blakey)

100% Exact CD Duplication

Reply #5 –
So if i..

1. Detect Gaps
2. Have Proper Offset
3. Use a single wav and cue sheet
4. Rip with secure + test and copy

I should have an exact duplicate?

and one more thing.  When I burn it do I have to have the correct write offset?

100% Exact CD Duplication

Reply #6 –
you sure do

100% Exact CD Duplication

Reply #7 –
so can anyone knowledgeable confirm this as being an exact duplication?

1. Detect Gaps
2. Have Proper Offset
3. Use a single wav and cue sheet
4. Rip with secure + test and copy
5. Have the correct write offset

Of course this wouldn't be an exact copy of a cd extra...but atleast the audio would be exact.

100% Exact CD Duplication

Reply #8 –
You can confirm yourself: Rip the original + the copy you burned each to a single wav file and let EAC (or something you trust) do a wav compare.
Let's suppose that rain washes out a picnic. Who is feeling negative? The rain? Or YOU? What's causing the negative feeling? The rain or your reaction? - Anthony De Mello

100% Exact CD Duplication

Reply #9 –
works for me

100% Exact CD Duplication

Reply #10 –
If you're going to rip it as one wav (which you should), detecting the gaps is not necessary IMHO.  I've had a few experiences where detecting gaps made more problems, as I unintentionally added them to the wrong part of the track (the end of the track before them).  Here's some info that somebody posted a while ago on this board (I don't remember who):


A pregap can be something different according to different people.  I think that officially, it is a hidden part before a session.

EAC calls "pregaps" the "gaps" of the tracks because CDRWin used a command called "pregap" to create them in the cuesheets.  They were 2 seconds long silences marked with indexes.  Nero and EasyCD creator call them "pauses".

Now, what EAC calls "pre-gaps" are the audio data at the end of tracks that are between the index marker 0 of next track, and the index 1 of next track (that marks the actual beginning of next track).

EAC is the only program I know that enables handling them, and I think it's the most confusing thing in this program after offsets.  When you don't detect gaps, EAC will work like any other ripper and copy all the audio data.

Problems begin when you detect gaps. EAC now handles them separately. It can append them to previous track, as should always be done, since they are the end of previous track.  It can append them to next track. I don't know the hell what for.  It can leave out them, cutting your tracks before they finish !

I don't know if I should say they are "useful". The data they contain are part of the CD, and often part of the music (classical recordings, live recordings...).  Their detection is seldom useful. The only case I heard of usefulness is if the gaps actually mark silence between separated tracks (not always the case), and if you want to rip MP3s from the copy, and use the leave out gaps option is order to have the MP3s of your playlist play right after each other with no silence between them.  It will always work from the original, but it will only work from the copy if you used the copy CD and create cuesheet action. Otherwise, the gaps won't be marked on the copy.  The gaps are always copied. If you don't detect them, they are copied all the same, they're just not marked.

100% Exact CD Duplication

Reply #11 –
yup...


padus:  Discjuggler.

Will make a exactly copy.. of what you feed it.

but are your cdrom. or burner. capable ??

100% Exact CD Duplication

Reply #12 –
Quote
Here's some info that somebody posted a while ago on this board (I don't remember who):

Yes, it was me, and it's in the FAQ (What is a gap and why detecting them is not necessary)

100% Exact CD Duplication

Reply #13 –
Exact Copy? Then you should be use CLONE CD
MPC: --quality 10 --xlevel (v. 1.15s) (archive/transcoding)
MP3:  LAME 3.96.1 --preset standard (daily listening/portable)

100% Exact CD Duplication

Reply #14 –
Quote
Exact Copy? Then you should be use CLONE CD

Do not!! It will "clone" read errors instead of trying to correct them.

100% Exact CD Duplication

Reply #15 –
Quote
Exact Copy? Then you should be use CLONE CD

IMHO, Clone CD is not the best for audio copying and/or imaging, because it lacks secure ripping.

LIF
"Jazz washes away the dust of everyday life" (Art Blakey)

100% Exact CD Duplication

Reply #16 –
Ehhh, regarding gaps...
'Pregap' is used in cue sheet when you choose to leave gaps out, so then EAC puts digital silence with same length, using 'pregap' comand. In order to create the same TOC as on original cd.
If you choose append gaps to prev or next track, then gaps are marked in cue sheet with 'Index 00' comand.
If you use 'append to prev track' then you'll have 'Index 00' before 'File name.ext' in cue, which confuses the burning apps (don't know whether it brakes the specs or not, but no program except EAC itself can handle such cue sheets, AFAIK).
That's why there's 'append to next track option', I guess.
Anyway, if you create cue sheet, gaps are being detected automatically in either way. Again in order to create the same layout as on original cd, if I get it right.

100% Exact CD Duplication

Reply #17 –
I'm only more confused now than before I started the thread.

100% Exact CD Duplication

Reply #18 –
1. Use a single wav and cue sheet
2. Have proper read and write offset
3. Rip with secure + test and copy

100% Exact CD Duplication

Reply #19 –
Quote
A pregap can be something different according to different people.  I think that officially, it is a hidden part before a session.

EAC calls "pregaps" the "gaps" of the tracks because CDRWin used a command called "pregap" to create them in the cuesheets.  They were 2 seconds long silences marked with indexes.  Nero and EasyCD creator call them "pauses".

A "pregap" (which is the correct name) is a space in the TOC before a track, and if it exists at all (it doesn't have to) it is always index 0 of that track. It can be as long as you like, and most importantly, it can contain audio. That fact is why calling it a "pause" is misleading.

I often master CDs which use pregaps containing audio - for example, a live CD where the singer's talk between songs is stuck in a pregap, so that those programming a particular song order or using shuffle play will be able to do so and only hear the songs, not the chatter.

The "hidden part before a session" is not hidden at all; audio sessions must have a 2 second minimum pregap on track 1, the only compulsory pregap in the red book standard. But that gap can be extended longer - long enough to fit entire songs in, songs which won't be heard unless the user rewinds past the start point of track 1. That's certainly an abuse of the standard, but most CD players handle it fine.

But back on topic; EAC handles track pregaps of all lengths fine, putting them in exactly the right place after it does its routine gap detection on extracting a disc image.

100% Exact CD Duplication

Reply #20 –
1. Rip with EAC using secure mode without C2. Use the correct offsets and also detect the gaps so they can be removed. If your burner supports reading into lead in/lead out, then enable it. Also, cue-sheets could be useful in the future, so you should generate them too with CD-text support...
2. Encode with FLAC and tag the files with the correct tracknames and such... (ReplayGain could be useful too...)
3. Use SmartPAR to create PAR recovery archives for all FLAC files...
4. Burn the files to a CD in normal Joliet format. Do not burn to Audio CD if you want perfect copies in the future...

Edit: You could also use DeGlitch to remove any ripping artifacts before encoding to FLAC...

100% Exact CD Duplication

Reply #21 –
no, never remove gaps - it's never recommended - append to previous (default) instead.
[TROLL]
And use something sensible like WavPack instead of FLAC (fuct lossless audio compression), :B
mwoahahaa
[/TROLL]

100% Exact CD Duplication

Reply #22 –
Quote
This is what I want.  I want to create an exact flawless copy of one of my cds.  It's a rare cd that I have gotten signed by the band...

What is your idea for "exact flawless copy" of a CD?
CDs are made for us, humans, to listen to them. Just copy your valuable CD, listen to it, and since there is no audible artifacts, you have a perfect, flawless copy. No matter what method you choose, since you don't hear any artifacts, you have THE PERFECT FLAWLESS COPY.
But there is no way to reproduce the authenticity of the band's signature you got.
And if you are so big fan to that band, buying  another copy of this CD should be the perfect solution. And you will give some extra money to your favorites. And your CD will last MUCH MUCH longer.
That's what I think.

100% Exact CD Duplication

Reply #23 –
Quote
And use something sensible like WavPack instead of FLAC (fuct lossless audio compression)

Please explain.

100% Exact CD Duplication

Reply #24 –
Quote
[TROLL]
And use something sensible like WavPack instead of FLAC (fuct lossless audio compression), :B
mwoahahaa
[/TROLL]

I agree! WavPack is THE way to go.