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Re: UPnP MediaRenderer output | discussion

Reply #352
Tried
  • supports-FLAC=false,  and
  • preferred-format=WAV
Both trials result in WAV output.

Together with (1) above I added:
#supports-WAV=false
These two together resulted in error, and no playback.

If it helps, there is also a Whitebear log, but cannot see how it can be uploaded here.

 
 



Ran a series of tests, with findings as follows (Media Renderer setting, Bit depth):
LPCM, 16
No sound output. Console logging attached.
Looks like Foobar is streaming L16 that is not accepted. The only thing that I can suspect is that foobar sends this:
ContentFeatures.dlna.org: DLNA.ORG_PN=LPCM;DLNA.ORG_FLAGS=01000000000000000000000000000000
while supported formats list refers to this:
http-get:*:audio/L16:DLNA.ORG_PN=LPCM;DLNA.ORG_FLAGS=8D100000000000000000000000000000
Maybe flags used make a difference.
LPCM, 24
Playback reverts immediately to FLAC, and plays fine.
Not sure why this happens; maybe because L24 is not reported and FLAC is the global default by Peter.
Supposedly, this model accepts up to 24bit, 96000Hz. Do not know if specs can differ between wired and wireless.
WAV, 16
Playbacks in WAV as expected, and plays fine. Dithering is also accepted, and plays fine.
WAV, 24
Playbacks in WAV as expected, and plays fine.

FLAC works fine with all 16, 16 dithered and 24.
Watching the network traffic volume, seems that bit depth settings (16.vs.24) have the expected impact. Don't know of course, what really the soundbar is doing when receiving 24 bits (accepts all or discards 8 ).
Other observations:
  • Content Type is not reported in Console when FLAC, but reported for LPCM and WAV.
  • Detailed content type (rate, channels) is reported only for LPCM; would be nice to have it also for other formats (if possible).

So, perhaps some tinkering with LPCM flags can have a result. Found some (very scarce) traces on that in google, but all these discussions is well above my pay grade ::) .


Re: UPnP MediaRenderer output | discussion

Reply #353
Hi,

UPnP renderer version 1.3.1 does not recognize my Devialet 250 Pro anymore, where versions up to 1.2.1 did. I'm also unable to find its (1.3.1) settings under Avanced>Playback. Using Foobar v1.4.4.
Am i overlooking something?


Re: UPnP MediaRenderer output | discussion

Reply #355
Found the TAB, but no devices in there. Also no option to manually add one.

Re: UPnP MediaRenderer output | discussion

Reply #356
Look for your device as in the photo.
It must be already there; you cannot add manually.
If not found, check that is connected to your network (use your router app). 


Re: UPnP MediaRenderer output | discussion

Reply #357
My player's simply not there anymore after upgrading renderer from version 1.2.1 to 1.3.1 and the player is connected to the network. When i switch back to version 1.2.1 it's visible again.
I can reproduce this thing by switching back and forth (copy the right dll back to user-components folder) between 1.2.1 and 1.3.1

Re: UPnP MediaRenderer output | discussion

Reply #358
In such case you will have to wait for higher authorities (Peter that is).


Re: UPnP MediaRenderer output | discussion

Reply #360
(...)
FLAC works fine with all 16, 16 dithered and 24.
Watching the network traffic volume, seems that bit depth settings (16.vs.24) have the expected impact. Don't know of course, what really the soundbar is doing when receiving 24 bits (accepts all or discards 8 ).
Other observations:
  • Content Type is not reported in Console when FLAC, but reported for LPCM and WAV.
  • Detailed content type (rate, channels) is reported only for LPCM; would be nice to have it also for other formats (if possible).

So, perhaps some tinkering with LPCM flags can have a result. Found some (very scarce) traces on that in google, but all these discussions is well above my pay grade ::) .



Detailed console reporting of sample rate & channel count was added in the current beta.

The sample rate & channel count info is reported in content-type of LPCM because that's how the other end knows the specifications of the stream being sent. FLAC and WAV streams carry FLAC or WAV file headers that already hold this info; there's no need (and probably no standard defined way) to give this info in content-type.

24bit LPCM (audio/L24) is not supported by anything that I've encountered - even though it was apparently standardized long ago.

I still have no idea why L16 doesn't work for you, everything seems OK from the console log. If an old version of foo_out_upnp allowed it, you're welcome to try the old version archive: https://www.foobar2000.org/temp/foo_out_upnp/
If you find which exact update broke it (newest version in which L16 is possible to get working / oldest where it no longer is), I'll pinpoint which changes in my code broke it and correct them.

Re: UPnP MediaRenderer output | discussion

Reply #361
Thank you for the update and the valuable insight/explanations!!!

Really beats my logic why L24 is not used; looks perfect from "engineering" point of view  (have a powerful pc doing all the footwork of decoding+upsampling (if needed), and give pure ready-made LCPM24 to a DAC to do what it knows best).

I can certainly go through older versions to see when things changed.
The previous version used for me was 1.1.
Just allow some few time.

PS: is there any component/tool that can display what format is exiting foobar (dlna or not)?

Re: UPnP MediaRenderer output | discussion

Reply #362
Console logs should reveal what format is being actually sent. Amount of debug information varies between versions; some versions predating 1.3 had a verbose debug log toggle in advanced preferences.

Re: UPnP MediaRenderer output | discussion

Reply #363
Tried version 1.1 (stable),  which I was using and believed as "OK".
But in reality is same behaviour as current version. I was only thinking that it was sending LPCM (because I never checked, just trusted the settings).
Also tested all available back-then options "LPCM streaming tweaks" (no difference).

So the findings are exactly the same as currently (see last test report).

I suppose that I can perfectly live with WAV and FLAC. :)) :D

PS:

  • Is there any way to capture the .xml's of my renderer, in case you can make something out of them?
  • Did not try versions in between 1.1 and 1.3.1, as there is no point.


Re: UPnP MediaRenderer output | discussion

Reply #365
Tried version 1.1 (stable),  which I was using and believed as "OK".
But in reality is same behaviour as current version. I was only thinking that it was sending LPCM (because I never checked, just trusted the settings).
Also tested all available back-then options "LPCM streaming tweaks" (no difference).

So the findings are exactly the same as currently (see last test report).

I suppose that I can perfectly live with WAV and FLAC. :)) :D

PS:

  • Is there any way to capture the .xml's of my renderer, in case you can make something out of them?
  • Did not try versions in between 1.1 and 1.3.1, as there is no point.

OK, noted.

Device XML is probably not relevant here, it's only relevant in case of total failure to list some device.

You should be happy with FLAC mode if it works, even if it seems like pointless compression / extra complexity. The point here is that device makers just use libFLAC instead of inventing their own demuxer/decoder - like they typically do with WAV or LPCM.

Re: UPnP MediaRenderer output | discussion

Reply #366
New beta version: 1.3.2 beta 2
https://www.foobar2000.org/temp/foo_out_upnp-1.3.2b2.fb2k-component

Fixed 1.3 regression causing some devices to be no longer seen ( thanks @ Tropoje )
Other issues are being looked into.

It is there again. Thank you
Regarding to things mentioned above: is there a way to test my player's abilities and test
 what's really playing?

Re: UPnP MediaRenderer output | discussion

Reply #367

 OK, noted.

Device XML is probably not relevant here, it's only relevant in case of total failure to list some device.

You should be happy with FLAC mode if it works, even if it seems like pointless compression / extra complexity. The point here is that device makers just use libFLAC instead of inventing their own demuxer/decoder - like they typically do with WAV or LPCM.
 
 I think that I will stick with WAV for the moment, since it is working ok.

PCM shortcomings is a very dark mystery to me. The renderer is a Samsung soundbar, whose main target is Samsung TVs. Samsung TVs (as every other tv I believe) have a setting for their Digital Output Audio Format; PCM and DD are always included in available options (with maybe some more per case). The PCM setting on tv is indeed working fine. Not being workable from other sources is strange.
Maybe there are things here to be taken over with Samsung support (seemingly "mission impossible" with the customer support experience from this kind of companies).
   

Re: UPnP MediaRenderer output | discussion

Reply #368
Various popular devices come with somehow broken reading of PCM-over-HTTP streams. It doesn't mean that they cannot process PCM (as they have to decode every other format to PCM pretty much), but just fail to correctly interpret audio/L16 HTTP streams one way or another.

Regarding testing of player capabilities, I'll consider adding a test tool for a future update, to probe what formats produce audible output - similar to test jingles in Windows audio control panel.
For now, the verbose console log contains info about what format is being streamed. Perhaps I'll add a line just what format gets sent in non-verbose mode to make the info easier to filter out from all the other diagnostic lines.

Re: UPnP MediaRenderer output | discussion

Reply #369
...
For now, the verbose console log contains info about what format is being streamed. Perhaps I'll add a line just what format gets sent in non-verbose mode to make the info easier to filter out from all the other diagnostic lines.

 It would be very nice to have this in separate text box at the top or at the bottom of the console window. :-[

Re: UPnP MediaRenderer output | discussion

Reply #370
Hi.
I'm not sure if this has been discussed so far.
I tried this before (1-2 years ago) and I faced the same problem.
I want to use a Kodi machine (server with Server 2016) in my network which has an amplifier attached to it, from foobar2000 installed on my desktop.
I install the component, it finds it and it plays well. BUT if I leave the foobar player idle (not playing) for about 5 minutes, and then try to play a file, it fails and opens the config dialog to choose a valid output. Kodi is still there and if I choose it again, it plays well again, until the next occurence of the same bug.
Kodi 16.1 (using it because of a conservative IPTV which plays well only with 16).
It seems Kodi changes some ID or something and foobar2000 (and the UPNP component) fails to register the change or something.
Now with all the latest versions of both (foobar and component) as of today (UPNP 1.3.2 and foobar 1.4.4), and it's the same as before when I tried. This is a great annoyance so I stopped trying to use such setup for network play then.
It seems to behave well when I direct foobar's output to my phone's renderer (Bubbleupnp) - I waited for 6 minutes and it doesn't fail the next play.

Is this a known issue and could it be avoided?
Thanks.

Re: UPnP MediaRenderer output | discussion

Reply #371
Tested new MediaRenderer Output 1.3.2 with Pioneer N-70AE, everything works as it should. Thanks Peter.

Re: UPnP MediaRenderer output | discussion

Reply #372
Peter, can you answer why there are two identical devices Volumio in the list?

Re: UPnP MediaRenderer output | discussion

Reply #373
Since latest beta, and with current stable version 1.3.2, streaming pauses every appr. 2hrs.
Console reports:
[UPnP] HTTP request #12 finished
[UPnP] HTTP concurrency: 0

I think that this can be related to the transmitted :
[UPnP] Range: bytes=0-
when a new connection starts; which (again) I think that appeared since 1.3.2 (beta).

Re: UPnP MediaRenderer output | discussion

Reply #374
I still see the two volumio devices.

 
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