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Drives without audio cache - still manufactured?

For all newer drives I bought over the last +-two years EAC reported that they where caching the audio data. As I fear that in the next years my drives which have C2+Accurate_Streaming/Overread abilities without caching audio either are worn out and/or IDE/SCSI ones, I was searching for modern drives with those DAE-Features.
All information I found is either of age itself (just look at the stickied topic here), or missing the desired Feature Information (In case of https://www.daefeatures.co.uk/search all newer drives seem to be reported via dbpoweramp with offset only). And Accuracy Lists as from the dbpoweramp forum are not helpfull (just as an example: the topmost drive of the 2019 list (Asus BluRay Burner) is caching audio data) here.

Does anyone know of a up-to-date DAE-Feature list for nowadays drives?

Re: Drives without audio cache - still manufactured?

Reply #1
You don't need cacheless drives, as secure rippers will defeat it by reading more than the cache can take.
High Voltage socket-nose-avatar

Re: Drives without audio cache - still manufactured?

Reply #2
Did I mentioned EAC? I am using it since 1998 (Andre got my postcard for it) and want to stick with it for times to come and: for EAC your comment ist only true for caches up to 64KB.

Quoting the WIKI
Quote
Tip #2: Tip #1 is all you need to know, but if you're still paranoid that your drive caches audio, feel free to try Feurio's audio caching test (Ctrl+Alt+P\Test device\Cache test) or spath's cache explorer. If either determine that your drive doesn't cache or caches less than 64 KB of data, then cache flushing isn't necessary (ignore the reported buffer size when using cache explorer). The reason for the 64 KB barrier is that EAC will never request less than this amount while ripping

All newer Drives I have are above that 64KB threshold, and as I appreciate your help -> I am not asking for recommendations about Applications, I've wanted to know where I can find reliable information about current drives DAE Features.

Re: Drives without audio cache - still manufactured?

Reply #3
for EAC your comment ist only true for caches up to 64KB..
What you said is only true if option "Drive caches audio data" is disabled. With this option enabled EAC effectively defeats cache. I don't know if there is maximal limit, but it definitely is much more than 64 KB.

Re: Drives without audio cache - still manufactured?

Reply #4
What you said is only true if option "Drive caches audio data" is disabled. With this option enabled EAC effectively defeats cache. I don't know if there is maximal limit, but it definitely is much more than 64 KB.

Ok, true - but that is taking ages with EAC compared to drives that don't cache audio data... not just a few minutes, where I get a clean disc with my older drives accurately ripped within a few minutes vs.  many minutes with a newer drive and with scratched discs it is really ages [1]. There was a reason why a decade ago drives which accepted -usefua (disabling cache for audio on (some) [plextor] drives) where AFAIK popular.

Boys, come on - I know you all want to be helpfull, but please understand that I just really want the information I've asked for. ...

(1) - just to back it up: I will do a quick comparisson now on two drives and report back in a few minutes with an example.

Re: Drives without audio cache - still manufactured?

Reply #5
...
Quote
and report back in a few minutes with an example.
Ok, it took me a while... It was just a rough test made on two systems with two different drives with EAC on same settings (PCM 44K16Bit to minimize encoding differences)...  And as the EAC LOG ain't incorporate timestamps I can just cite the filesystems timestamp from the written files (Last Track Time - First Track Time)....
System (1) Drive:  L-DT-STBD-RE  BH16NS55; System (2) Drive: TSSTcorpCDDVDW SH-224BB
1) A clean (21 Tracks) disc just bought made in fact no significant difference... (I apologize for my former comment)
 System 1: ~8 Minutes; System 2: ~8 Minutes
2) A somewhat scratched Disc (13 Tracks) from 1992 (bought in that year)
 System 1:  ~22 Minutes; System 2:  ~7 Minutes

Both rips where accurate with the ecxeption that for case 2 track4 couldn't be verified on both systems  and each system reporting a different CRC [1].
I haven't introduced any load on the systems whilst ripping and both systems are the same OS (Win7Pro)... nearly identical setup... So I (for myself) conclude on clean discs with EAC cache or not ain't a problem... on cases of reread-situations it is...

P.S.: The Test/Observation above is somewhat questionable and just an example for my systems and somewhat the reason of my questions (aka OP's Topic)... I am interested in an up-2-date database of modern drives features.... mostly the ability to not cache audio data, but besides that -of course- C2 capabilities and Accurate Stream is naturalness a viable information abou a drive (IMHO).
---
(1):Spoiler (click to show/hide)

P.P.P.S.: No, I don't want any real discussion about those different CRCs.... (and that on system 1 the CD was in EACs local DB and on system 2 not) It is just an observation... and discussions about it are a topic beyond my post/question....

Re: Drives without audio cache - still manufactured?

Reply #6
Boys, come on - I know you all want to be helpfull, but please understand that I just really want the information I've asked for. ...
If others read this thread, they should be informed that they can have their problems solved even if your preferred solution is not available.

There might still be forums where they know how to hack and flash firmware. Maybe you can try your luck making the physical cache invisible to the drive. Don't come complaining if you brick it.
High Voltage socket-nose-avatar

Re: Drives without audio cache - still manufactured?

Reply #7
Boys, come on - I know you all want to be helpfull, but please understand that I just really want the information I've asked for. ...
If others read this thread, they should be informed that they can have their problems solved even if your preferred solution is not available.

There might still be forums where they know how to hack and flash firmware. Maybe you can try your luck making the physical cache invisible to the drive. Don't come complaining if you brick it.

Well - But that information is to be found in other threads (As said, i searched for the information) and talk about ripping applications is, next to offtopic in regards to the threads title (hardware specific question)...

Re: Drives without audio cache - still manufactured?

Reply #8
Probably not much help but I remember there was a Cache Explorer (cachex.exe) tool by Spath which could thoroughly analyze drives' cache features. I wonder if it still works on modern systems...
Anyway I could check a couple of drives from last decade.

Re: Drives without audio cache - still manufactured?

Reply #9
..I remember there was a Cache Explorer (cachex.exe) tool by Spath..
You still have it?
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
your welcome :cheers: to post your observations, though it would be a plus if those drives are still available in stores ;) [or at least that information could be viable to me in hunting down B-Ware or refurbished Devices]


Re: Drives without audio cache - still manufactured?

Reply #11
A very quick try on up to date Win10 x64:
Code: [Select]
cachex -i e

CacheExplorer 0.8 - spath@cdfreaks.com

Drive on E is  ATAPI    iHAS122   E      2L04

[+] Buffer size: 768 kB, read cache is enabled
[+] Supported read commands: BEh A8h(FUA) 28h(FUA) D4h(FUA) D5h(FUA) D8h(FUA)

Re: Drives without audio cache - still manufactured?

Reply #12
Pendor & Rutra80: Thanks for the Link & good to know that it works on Win10 :up:

 
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