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Topic: Upscaling MP3 to DSD (Read 3367 times) previous topic - next topic
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Re: Upscaling MP3 to DSD

Reply #25
Funny how some attribute a sound to mp3. There were listening tests people prefered the mp3 over the original not because it was harsh suddenly. What mp3 surely does is softening transients so it is likely the other way around.
One should try to build up a simple comparison on his own before doing stupid upsampling because someone said so.
Is troll-adiposity coming from feederism?
With 24bit music you can listen to silence much louder!

Re: Upscaling MP3 to DSD

Reply #26
Rollin told you how to convert everything you play in foobar2000 to DSD on-the-fly. But if you don't have DSD capable DAC you'll need to convert DSD back to PCM. Note that the audio will still not change though, it's just resampling and good resampling has always been transparent.

I do have a  DSD capable DAC which plays my DSD files perfectly.  I had hoped to be able to convert the mp3 files 'off-line' , so to speak, into DSD files in ,maybe the mistaken, assumption that as the processor will not be working as hard as it would converting 'on -the-fly' there would be more chance of good sound.  However I am grateful to Rollin for this - I have the plug-in and will try to work out how it can do this conversion - I know I should not expect any improvement, but at least, hopefully, I can try it for myself.

thanks Mitch

Re: Upscaling MP3 to DSD

Reply #27
,maybe the mistaken, assumption that as the processor will not be working as hard as it would converting 'on -the-fly' there would be more chance of good sound

There's no maybe about it. Yet another audiophile myth. Same as people who seem to think that playing files from different locations on a HDD gives a different sound.

But we all have to learn somewhere :)

Re: Upscaling MP3 to DSD

Reply #28
Want to mention the recent SoX at sourceforge does PCM->DSD conversion.
Is troll-adiposity coming from feederism?
With 24bit music you can listen to silence much louder!

Re: Upscaling MP3 to DSD

Reply #29
Oh no!!  I had not heard of the HDD one - not another audiophile myth I might succumb to!! 

The trouble is, that like a lot of people with a life-time of 'fiddling' with turntables, I cannot help tweeking.  Unfortunately, the technology of my Garrard 401 is a little simpler than the mysteries of digital.

I think it is time for me to give up and say thank you to all those who have tried to educate me - I am grateful for your time and I have learned a lot.  I know that on forums like this as well as asking questions, one should try and contribute to the problems of others - I feel a little guilty about this, but it will be some time before I know enough to be confident to offer any meaningful inputs - sorry.

While I was typing this a post from Wombat came in telling me of of some software at Source Forge.  So about that giving up........

Mitch

Re: Upscaling MP3 to DSD

Reply #30
While I was typing this a post from Wombat came in telling me of of some software at Source Forge.  So about that giving up........

Relax. You don't it. Just let your media player play your music.
High Voltage socket-nose-avatar

Re: Upscaling MP3 to DSD

Reply #31
As we have said for many years, CD is able to achieve an audibly faithful replica of what is on vinyl and do so consistently. The same cannot be said about going in the opposite direction.

The Meyer and Moran study shows that the first portion of this exists outside of academia.
Is 24-bit/192kHz good enough for your lo-fi vinyl, or do you need 32/384?

Re: Upscaling MP3 to DSD

Reply #32
For those who still get even a modicum of entertainment the use of “some” was pretty obvious: digital is inherently harsh so mp3 can only be made less harsh.
Digital is definitely not 'harsh'

[MODERATION]
I'm terribly sorry, I meant to reply to your post, not edit it.  You spent a great deal of tmie writing your response.  I was only be facetious, however.

I don’t believe the forum software has the ability to revert changes. If you happen to have a saved copy in your drafts I can restore it to that point.
-greynol

I apologize for my strident tone anyway.  I sometimes take things too seriously.   I REALLY CARE -- and sometimes I am a little too vehement.  That 'harshness' or 'starstep' idea (myself as an EE/DSP & software person) almost elicits a knee-jerk response in me -- and jerk might sometimes be operative :-).

There are *REAL* cases in nonlinear signal processing with digital processing where the effects of the 'stairstepping' (actually aliasing) are important.  It is VERY EASY to unfortunately produce aliasing if one is designing digital compressors/limiters -- so there are some real issues there.  When messing with normal linear signal processing -- then the rules tend to be simpler, and the starstepping/suprise aliasing/harshness issues aren't operative.

Think about this --  you have a fast attack compressor/limiter, and effectively when doing gain control -- the nice/clean signal is multiplied by the instantaneous gain control.  That quick change in gain due to the fast attack will definitely produce evil sidebands.  Those evil sidebands can easily wrap around Nyquist rate -- cause aliasing -- and create nasty/harsh/ugly sound.   It is a VERY challening thing to do a really good fast attack compressor/limiter without IMD (it is an especially nasty form of IMD that is hard to measure, because constant signals don't really cause it.)  A well design RMS compressor/expander does have a nice advantage -- the attack/decay tends to be slower than a fast attack compressor -- but these are just details.

I know that this board is really mostly interested in 'measured' results only -- no ad-hoc 'sounds good' are acceptable unless it is ABX.   Frankly, I don't know how to quantize the real distortion resulting from a fast compressor/limiter, and doing a comparison by listening (ABX, if you want) is the only way that I know to decide between the 'kind of good' and 'really good' results.

The silly simple compressor that I have posted elsewhere has none of the heroic efforts needed to produce absolutely perfect (within limits of physics) that I'd need to put my name on a product.  I give the toys away as demos and MAYBE useful for learning or casual use.  Some day, after my noise reduction emulators are finished, might write a REALLY GOOD/truly low IMD compressor/expander.  The stuff is a LOT more complicated to do correctly, than just to do it!!!

Again, sorry if I did appear to be strident.  I sure wish I could explain things better -- the language needed to explain stuff is so tricky, even when I am not emotional,  I cannot always communicate accurately...

John

Re: Upscaling MP3 to DSD

Reply #33
It seems obvious to me that you’re not a jerk. You provide a wealth of helpful information. That’s a good way to respond. I’ve grown cynical and can’t help but just poke fun.

Is 24-bit/192kHz good enough for your lo-fi vinyl, or do you need 32/384?


Re: Upscaling MP3 to DSD

Reply #35
Sorry, i only saw commits at sourceforge and Mr. Rullgard contributing. His fork is here at github https://github.com/mansr
He is the person at CA who has answered and claryfied the DSD capable version is not at sourceforge and linked you the compiled version, mansr.
Is troll-adiposity coming from feederism?
With 24bit music you can listen to silence much louder!

Re: Upscaling MP3 to DSD

Reply #36
thanks - all understood

Mitch

 

 
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