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Topic: Back up mp3s have somehow acquired additional ID3v1.1 tags... What's going on?! (Read 3143 times) previous topic - next topic

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  • MaxDread
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Back up mp3s have somehow acquired additional ID3v1.1 tags... What's going on?!
Hi all

I'm ripping my CD collection to my PC hard drive, and periodically I back this up to an external HD.  I do the back up manually by copy and pasting.  When I'm done I check the overall folder sizes to check that they are the same and that I have not missed anything. 

I did a back up session yesterday and at the end of it the PC drive and back up drive were different sizes.  After a fair bit of comparing and investigating, I saw that around 50 albums on the back up side of things had additional ID3v1.1 tags.  I could not see any different tag info per se, but when I checked properties, under the section "Contains" they had ID3v2.3 & ID3v1.1 listed.  Whereas on the main HD the same files only had ID3v2.3 listed, with no mention whatsoever of any ID3v1.1 tags.

What's even stranger is that the files this has happened to were ripped and backed up a while ago.  When I have checked them against the PC HD in the past, both have been exactly the same size.  So it would seem that these ID3v1.1 tags have been added recently somehow.  I've absolutely no idea how though and it has left me a bit worried and confused. 

I'm guessing it is likely something I have done and forgotten or not realised.  To help figure out what, I wondered if anyone with more tagging knowledge than me might be able to take a look at a pair of files (both of the same song, one from the PC HD and one from the back up) and see what the differences are and what the ID3v1.1 tag info is on the back up file.  I'm hoping that will lead me to understand what the hell has gone on. 

Here's a link to a couple of files for comparison:

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B5TOZ--hamf8SFVnUFFZOXdlN0E

Any help to get to the bottom of this would be much much appreciated.

Cheers

Max

  • spoon
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  • Administrator
Re: Back up mp3s have somehow acquired additional ID3v1.1 tags... What's going on?!
Reply #1
Look at the last modified date of the files.

  • Apesbrain
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Re: Back up mp3s have somehow acquired additional ID3v1.1 tags... What's going on?!
Reply #2
I downloaded your "PC" file and copied it to my backup drive; there was no change in tags.  Copying a file from one drive to another via your OS stock copy utility cannot add new tags.  There is something else going on.  Do you have any shell extensions associated with your file explorer that might have done this; e.g. a "helper" like WMP Tag Plus that lets you view/edit extended tag information?  How exactly did you "manually by copy and pasting"?

I'm ripping my CD collection to my PC hard drive, and periodically I back this up to an external HD.  I do the back up manually by copy and pasting.  When I'm done I check the overall folder sizes to check that they are the same and that I have not missed anything.
You might be interested in FreeFileSync.  It does this process for you and can be manually run as needed or set to sync in background.

https://www.freefilesync.org/

  • MaxDread
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Re: Back up mp3s have somehow acquired additional ID3v1.1 tags... What's going on?!
Reply #3
Look at the last modified date of the files.

Well spotted!  That's very interesting to see that they are different, although it hasn't got me any nearer to knowing what has gone on. 

I downloaded your "PC" file and copied it to my backup drive; there was no change in tags.

Thanks for trying that.  Would there be any chance of downloading both of the files (PC and Back UP) and then comparing them for any other differences.  Also, is there a way I can see JUST what the ID3v1.1 tag is on a file, without any other tag info?  That might prove very helpful if so.

Do you have any shell extensions associated with your file explorer that might have done this; e.g. a "helper" like WMP Tag Plus that lets you view/edit extended tag information?

Not that I know of….

How exactly did you "manually by copy and pasting"?

I select the folders on the PC HD, select copy (ctrl-c in my case as I like the kb shortcuts!), navigate to the destination folder on the BU HD, select paste (ctrl-v).

There is something else I’ve realised which might help…  I have my own genre system which I use when tagging albums.  I didn’t realise to begin with, but it turns out that all of the albums this has happened to belong to the same genre.  Could this be something to do with it?  Perhaps genre has been saved as a ID3v1.1 tag AND a ID3v2.3, and that’s why the files were minimally different sizes.  A total guess but seems logical.  If I can isolate what the ID3v1.1 tag info is, I guess this could answer the question.

You might be interested in FreeFileSync.  It does this process for you and can be manually run as needed or set to sync in background.

https://www.freefilesync.org/

Thanks for that.  It is something I have looked at before, and I admit I should totally be using a utility for such tasks.  Easier, quicker, more efficient, etc.  But in all honest I am a bit of a control freak!  I won’t use sat navs for the same reason :) !  It’s definitely something I need to work on…

Thanks for all the help – much appreciated.

Max

  • Apesbrain
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Re: Back up mp3s have somehow acquired additional ID3v1.1 tags... What's going on?!
Reply #4
Would there be any chance of downloading both of the files (PC and Back UP) and then comparing them for any other differences.
Using foobar2000 "Bit-compare" utility, the two tracks report "no differences found" with regard to the musical data.  Mp3tag, however, does show the BU file has both IDv2.3 and IDv1 tags while the PC file has only IDv2.3.

Also, is there a way I can see JUST what the ID3v1.1 tag is on a file, without any other tag info?
You can use Mp3tag for this.  Load all the files and from main menu select "Tools" > "Options" > "Tags" > "Mpeg" > "Read" and click only "ID3v1", save and click "Refresh".  The ID3v1 tags in the BU file are: ARTIST, ALBUM, TITLE, TRACK, YEAR.

Perhaps genre has been saved as a ID3v1.1 tag AND a ID3v2.3, and that’s why the files were minimally different sizes.
Even so, why would copying a file from drive to drive cause the files to change at all?  Of course, that should not be happening.  What happens if you simply make a copy of the file to the same drive as the original?

It is something I have looked at before, and I admit I should totally be using a utility for such tasks.
Well, now might be a good time to try it just to see if it solves your problem.

  • Porcus
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Re: Back up mp3s have somehow acquired additional ID3v1.1 tags... What's going on?!
Reply #5
You might be interested in FreeFileSync.

Used to install adware and/or some registry "optimizer" on your computer. Have they quit doing so?

  • Apesbrain
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Re: Back up mp3s have somehow acquired additional ID3v1.1 tags... What's going on?!
Reply #6
You might be interested in FreeFileSync.

Used to install adware and/or some registry "optimizer" on your computer. Have they quit doing so?
You can override it during install.

  • greynol
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  • Global Moderator
Re: Back up mp3s have somehow acquired additional ID3v1.1 tags... What's going on?!
Reply #7
Is 24-bit/192kHz good enough for your lo-fi vinyl, or do you need 32/384?