Skip to main content ↑ ↓

Notice

Please note that most of the software linked on this forum is likely to be safe to use. If you are unsure, feel free to ask in the relevant topics, or send a private message to an administrator or moderator. To help curb the problems of false positives, or in the event that you do find actual malware, you can contribute through the article linked here.
Topic: ogg/oga extension and totaltracks field mapping (Read 5061 times) previous topic - next topic
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

ogg/oga extension and totaltracks field mapping

Hello,

1. Currently when using the converter to create Vorbis files, foobar2000 creates files with ogg extension. According to Xiph.org this extension is kept for Vorbis only for hardware compatibility, but new ogg files (not Vorbis) should use oga extension.

From the Xiph website :
Quote
.oga - audio/ogg
[...]
Ogg Audio Profile (audio in Ogg container)
[...]
Vorbis and Speex may use .oga, but it is not the prefered method of distributing these files because of backwards-compatibility issues.
Quote
.ogg - audio/ogg
[...]
.ogg has more recently also been used for Ogg FLAC and for Theora, too — these uses are deprecated now in favor of .oga and .ogv respectively
[...]
RATIONALE: .ogg has traditionally been used for Vorbis I files, in particular in HW players, hence it is kept for backwards-compatibility
Source : http://wiki.xiph.org/index.php/MIME_Types_...File_Extensions

Since it is very inconvenient for Windows users to use the ogg extension for Vorbis because of different software associated for video and audio content, is it possible to optionally make foobar output oga files by default ?


2. When reading/writing tags to Vorbis files, foobar2000 uses the "totaltracks" and "totaldiscs" vorbiscomment fields to keep track of the total number of tracks and discs, however most other software I use (mainly on Linux) are using "tracktotal" and "disctotal" instead. I know there is no official standard for these fields, however couldn't it be better to unify this mapping ?
Opus 96 kb/s (Android) / Vorbis -q5 (PC) / WavPack -hhx6m (Archive)

ogg/oga extension and totaltracks field mapping

Reply #1 –
Quote from: dutch109 on
1. Currently when using the converter to create Vorbis files, foobar2000 creates files with ogg extension. According to Xiph.org this extension is kept for Vorbis only for hardware compatibility, but new ogg files (not Vorbis) should use oga extension.

From my understanding of the quote .oga is the encouraged extension for FLAC in OGG, and .ogv the one for Theora in OGG. The rationale clearly states that Vorbis in OGG should keep the .ogg extension for compatibility reasons.

Quote from: dutch109 on
2. When reading/writing tags to Vorbis files, foobar2000 uses the "totaltracks" and "totaldiscs" vorbiscomment fields to keep track of the total number of tracks and discs, however most other software I use (mainly on Linux) are using "tracktotal" and "disctotal" instead. I know there is no official standard for these fields, however couldn't it be better to unify this mapping ?

You could define your own custom fields just by creating the respective meta field (Add New Field, Ctrl+N, or doubleclick the Properties page), or you can edit the mapping of the fields via Preferences->Advanced->Display->Properties Dialog->Standard Fields.
It's only audiophile if it's inconvenient.

ogg/oga extension and totaltracks field mapping

Reply #2 –
Quote from: Kohlrabi on
Quote from: dutch109 on
1. Currently when using the converter to create Vorbis files, foobar2000 creates files with ogg extension. According to Xiph.org this extension is kept for Vorbis only for hardware compatibility, but new ogg files (not Vorbis) should use oga extension.

From my understanding of the quote .oga is the encouraged extension for FLAC in OGG, and .ogv the one for Theora in OGG. The rationale clearly states that Vorbis in OGG should keep the .ogg extension for compatibility reasons.

Yes that is what I understand too, but some users don't care about hardware compatibility, and find inconvenient to have one extension (ogg) for different content (audio and video). That is why I suggest to add this as an optional feature.

Quote from: Kohlrabi on
Quote from: dutch109 on
2. When reading/writing tags to Vorbis files, foobar2000 uses the "totaltracks" and "totaldiscs" vorbiscomment fields to keep track of the total number of tracks and discs, however most other software I use (mainly on Linux) are using "tracktotal" and "disctotal" instead. I know there is no official standard for these fields, however couldn't it be better to unify this mapping ?

You could define your own custom fields just by creating the respective meta field (Add New Field, Ctrl+N, or doubleclick the Properties page), or you can edit the mapping of the fields via Preferences->Advanced->Display->Properties Dialog->Standard Fields.

Thanks, that is what I was looking for.
Opus 96 kb/s (Android) / Vorbis -q5 (PC) / WavPack -hhx6m (Archive)

ogg/oga extension and totaltracks field mapping

Reply #3 –
You can always create a custom converter encoder preset to use .oga instead of .ogg - just choose your preferred settings for the built-in "Ogg Vorbis", then select "Custom" and the exact chosen parameters will be dumped there. Change the extension as needed and save under a new name.

But for the rest of the users, better leave the default as .ogg for the aforementioned reasons.
Full-quoting makes you scroll past the same junk over and over.

ogg/oga extension and totaltracks field mapping

Reply #4 –
I agree ogg should stay the default, but a checkbox to use the oga extension could have been added to the Vorbis encoder settings dialog.

Anyway since it is very easy to do it with a custom encoder as you said, I am happy with this method.
Opus 96 kb/s (Android) / Vorbis -q5 (PC) / WavPack -hhx6m (Archive)

ogg/oga extension and totaltracks field mapping

Reply #5 –
You are only going to confuse yourself with that. Keep ogg for Vorbis-only files like Xiph tells you to do and use oga for OggFLAC and ogv for video files. And spx for Speex.

ogg/oga extension and totaltracks field mapping

Reply #6 –
Thank you for your concern, but there is nothing confusing in using oga for audio and ogv for video.
That would be the official recommandation if hardware players were smarter by using headers instead of filenames to identify file formats.
It seems more logical to me than to use oga for some audio content in ogg container, ogv for video in ogg container, and ogg for a bit of both. On Windows, you always end up opening a downloaded video with foobar, and making VLC pop when opening a file from your music library.

But I don't really care anyway since I'm now using Windows almost only to batch convert with foobar, and the kind folks above answered my questions.
Opus 96 kb/s (Android) / Vorbis -q5 (PC) / WavPack -hhx6m (Archive)

ogg/oga extension and totaltracks field mapping

Reply #7 –
The only Ogg videos I've ever seen were marked with a .ogm extension for Ogg Media or something like that. I doubt that was part of the official specification, though.

I don't even see that many places that have Ogg videos, mostly Matroska .mkv or good old .avi.

Also, identifying files just by their contents and not by file name extension is prone to error, depending on how many formats you have to support.

ogg/oga extension and totaltracks field mapping

Reply #8 –
Quote from: kode54 on
The only Ogg videos I've ever seen were marked with a .ogm extension for Ogg Media or something like that. I doubt that was part of the official specification, though.

You're right, .ogm was invented by some guy to enable OGG to store video content. It has since been (officially) superseded by enhancements to OGG.
It's only audiophile if it's inconvenient.
 

ogg/oga extension and totaltracks field mapping

Reply #9 –
Quote from: dutch109 on
2. When reading/writing tags to Vorbis files, foobar2000 uses the "totaltracks" and "totaldiscs" vorbiscomment fields to keep track of the total number of tracks and discs, however most other software I use (mainly on Linux) are using "tracktotal" and "disctotal" instead. I know there is no official standard for these fields, however couldn't it be better to unify this mapping ?


In the wave of recent tagging compatibility with other software improvements, I would like to propose another one. dutch109 already mentioned that "tracktotal" and "disctotal" are used in most of the linux (players using gstreamer/taglib) and Mac OS X (Play, Max, XLD) software. There is also an official list of proposed tag names, which is based on their usage in different tagging software. Of course, nothing prevents a foobar2000 user from writing tracktotal or disctotal field. The problem is inconsistency. ID3 tag TRCK is mapped to TRACKNUMBER/TOTALTRACKS, the same applies to APEv2 tag Track or MP4 tag trkn. So at the moment I need to have two mappings named “Total tracks” in my Properties dialog.
There are two solutions to the problem:
  • Map TRCK, Track and trkn to TRACKTOTAL instead of TOTALTRACKS (same with DISCTOTAL/TOTALDISCS)
  • Map internal foobar tag name TOTALTRACKS to Vorbis field TRACKTOTAL (same with DISCTOTAL/TOTALDISCS)

The second solution seems to be a better option to me. It will not break anything (existing plugins, titleformat scripts etc.) as long as foobar will be able to map both tracktotal and totaltracks Vorbis comment fields to the internal name TOTALTRACKS when reading tags.