Hydrogenaudio Forums

Hydrogenaudio Forum => Listening Tests => Topic started by: Rich B on 2015-09-04 14:33:37

Title: Foobar testing
Post by: Rich B on 2015-09-04 14:33:37
So I have a friend claiming that he can hear clear audible differences between FLAC and 384 of the same recording.

He tried out Adele blind tests that he claims was not suitable because the album was a crappy master, so he tells me on well recorded material the differences would be easier to detect. One thing he always mentions is listener fatigue with lossy tracks.

So I want to challenge his assertions. So I guess I should ask him to use the most well recorded music he has to clearly hear the difference (to avoid excuses) then use Foobar ABX plugin to test those claims.

My questions are :

1) You can share the results of Foobar with others? So if I want to see how well or poorly he did, I can see those results.
2) Is it possible to tamper with the results from Foobar? Ie acing a test even though he may not have heard a difference?

Just want to make sure when I challenge him to a test of audibility that I have all my ducks in a row, so to speak. Is there anything else I should be aware of to make the test more reliable/valid?
Title: Foobar testing
Post by: shadowking on 2015-09-04 14:47:10
**Don't show them the results**  - use the *hide* option unless they are experienced and set a good number trials at least 8 and much more for very subltle differences : up to 50

Let him  / her abx for a good while until exhaustion or until they believe they are really winning or losing. Then show results. Why ? Because you can still get good results by just guessing and posting only the good numbers. (but getting <1% is super rare).

If using the sighted option they must get good scores like pval 1% or less. This means  at least 8/8,  9/10, 13/16 etc not the 4/4 BS that has been posted by audiophiles at times.
Title: Foobar testing
Post by: Case on 2015-09-04 14:50:12
Only way to prevent cheating is to be physically present to monitor the test. There is no way to prevent dishonest people from cheating with software.
Title: Foobar testing
Post by: Apesbrain on 2015-09-04 15:01:24
1) Yes, you can share.  foobar2000's ABX component creates a text report.
2) It's a text file so yes you can tamper/edit it.

Just let your friend believe what he wants.  My experience is that you will not be successful in changing his mind regardless of the ABX results.
Title: Foobar testing
Post by: greynol on 2015-09-04 15:09:14
A signature has been added to the log files in order to address your concern in 2):
http://www.hydrogenaud.io/forums/index.php?showtopic=107354 (http://www.hydrogenaud.io/forums/index.php?showtopic=107354)
Title: Foobar testing
Post by: greynol on 2015-09-04 15:10:32
384?

Also, this topic is not about hardware. Please don't dump just any old question in the hardware forum.
Title: Foobar testing
Post by: Rich B on 2015-09-04 15:17:49
384?

Also, this topic is not about hardware. Please don't dump just any old question in the hardware forum.


Sorry, my mistake.
Title: Foobar testing
Post by: greynol on 2015-09-04 15:28:41
Still didn't answer my question. 384 what?
Title: Foobar testing
Post by: bennetng on 2015-09-04 18:19:48
Only way to prevent cheating is to be physically present to monitor the test. There is no way to prevent dishonest people from cheating with software.

So true. One can simply route the audio output to an analyzer and know the answer without even listening, assume the differences are visible.

Here is my old method:
http://www.hydrogenaud.io/forums/index.php...st&p=440943 (http://www.hydrogenaud.io/forums/index.php?s=&showtopic=49288&view=findpost&p=440943)
Title: Foobar testing
Post by: Arnold B. Krueger on 2015-09-06 12:37:47
Only way to prevent cheating is to be physically present to monitor the test. There is no way to prevent dishonest people from cheating with software.

So true. One can simply route the audio output to an analyzer and know the answer without even listening, assume the differences are visible.

Here is my old method:
http://www.hydrogenaud.io/forums/index.php...st&p=440943 (http://www.hydrogenaud.io/forums/index.php?s=&showtopic=49288&view=findpost&p=440943)


Totally agree. History has shown that there is no perfect cure for cheating or stealing. All you can do is raise the bar to success.

Kudos to the Foobar author who substantially raised the bar with the 2.0 ABXplug-in, but regrettably he lives in the same real world as the rest of us...
Title: Foobar testing
Post by: KozmoNaut on 2015-09-06 13:05:56
Still didn't answer my question. 384 what?


384kHz, maybe? Is there even any material available at such high sampling rates?
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