Hi
I have a realtek 8xx , i don't remember should a 800 audio card
I listen music at 44.100 , mp3 lame 320kb ,aac itunes at 256vbr or 320vbr and only sometime at flac , and i can't hear any differences even via expansive headphones
I bought via internet some albums at 32bit 44.100 in flac
i use foobar2000 wasapi event or musicbee wasapi event with the realtek
i'm thinking to buy SMSL SU-1 (very cheap) high considered audio card or TOPPING E30II Lite via wasapi or asio
I will use them to connect to my Yamaha A-S501
I know it's a silly question
will I hear the difference between the realtek and these 2 audio cards ?
thanks in advanced
sound different? sure, slightly but not enough that one would notice unless you abx them
the difference will be in gain, one set up might have more gain, so more volume, so louder will sound 'better' esp. with less efficient speakers
and then there's the feature set
sound different? sure, slightly but not enough that one would notice unless you abx them
the difference will be in gain, one set up might have more gain, so more volume, so louder will sound 'better' esp. with less efficient speakers
and then there's the feature set
hi
do you know these dacs?
so will I enjoy at high volume ?
but even the many amps are not more clear at high volume even class a/b
even with SMSL PO100 AK or Topping D10s coaxial or optical cable without noise ?
thanks
No, of course I don't 'know' these DACs, nor do I have your 'ears'. These are general principles that I use. You, of course, should choose what you prefer. Trust your own ears.
I wouldn't attempt to discriminate between modern functional DACs.
No, of course I don't 'know' these DACs, nor do I have your 'ears'. These are general principles that I use. You, of course, should choose what you prefer. Trust your own ears.
I wouldn't attempt to discriminate between modern functional DACs.
Hi
but since i have to buy online
the difference will be in gain, one set up might have more gain, so more volume, so louder will sound 'better' esp. with less efficient speakers
and
, slightly but not enough that one would notice unless you abx them
I guess I won't hear any differences
the realtek are not so bad right? In wasapi the drivers should be bypassed
maybe i can hear in wasapi shared
thanks
@francesco According to this (well-known) MEASURES, DACs matters:
(https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?attachments/best-budget-stereo-dac-png.220680/)
Anyway the so-called "HiFi chain" can't be - of course - evaluated by the DAC quality only...
@francesco According to this (well-known) MEASURES, DACs matters:
(https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?attachments/best-budget-stereo-dac-png.220680/)
Anyway the so-called "HiFi chain" can't be - of course - evaluated by the DAC quality only...
hi
may i ask you a question?
have you tried dacs and build in audio card ?
can you hear the differences?
about some mesures like it , many amps are rated very poor marantz , yamaha A-S501 and so on
thanks for the graphic
@francesco According to this (well-known) MEASURES, DACs matters:
I'd say they
measurably differ. Whether that
matters is a separate question, not answered by this graph.
There are certainly DACs that measure better, are designed better, built better, have more features, and more gain. I would, all things being equal, choose the DAC that offered the most affordable quality and I would consider the measurements as a way to avoid a flawed design or cheap construction. I have four DACs, two internal, two external and I use them interchangeably, unless I want volume in which case I use my most expensive external DAC which has the most amplification.
Amps provide power, if you 'hear' an amp, it's being driven into distortion and you simply need a bigger amp.
There are certainly DACs that measure better, are designed better, built better, have more features, and more gain. I would, all things being equal, choose the DAC that offered the most affordable quality and I would consider the measurements as a way to avoid a flawed design or cheap construction. I have four DACs, two internal, two external and I use them interchangeably, unless I want volume in which case I use my most expensive external DAC which has the most amplification.
Amps provide power, if you 'hear' an amp, it's being driven into distortion and you simply need a bigger amp.
hi
may i ask you which dac do you use?
and if you have compare with you laptop ,desktop or imac build in audio card?
thanks
There's a ESS ES9023P realtek on the motherboard, ESS ES9023P on the xonar, Teac UD_H01 and a Krell 30i. "The 24 bit data is then fed to four differentially configured Burr Brown 20 bit Co-linear DAC’s" The Krell also has serious pre-amplification; it's a beast.
I will use them to connect to my Yamaha A-S501
Is your Realtek connected to the Yamaha via digital? If so, I doubt an external DAC would make an audible difference.
I will use them to connect to my Yamaha A-S501
Is your Realtek connected to the Yamaha via digital? If so, I doubt an external DAC would make an audible difference.
hi
no it's connected via a good cable line out ->amp
thanks
Anecdotal and subjective: If I didn't make music I am not sure if I would buy an external audio interface in 2024. I have an RME Fireface 802 connected to Event Precision 8 monitors and on the occasions I decide to just use the motherboard's (Asus B550) internal audio I am quite satisfied actually.
Anecdotal and subjective: If I didn't make music I am not sure if I would buy an external audio interface in 2024. I have an RME Fireface 802 connected to Event Precision 8 monitors and on the occasions I decide to just use the motherboard's (Asus B550) internal audio I am quite satisfied actually.
hi
but Asus B550 does include a great audio chipset , about the realtek 800 series for what i have read they are not so great ,above all the analog output
I don't know if you had some exerience with such chipset
thanks
Anecdotal and subjective: If I didn't make music I am not sure if I would buy an external audio interface in 2024. I have an RME Fireface 802 connected to Event Precision 8 monitors and on the occasions I decide to just use the motherboard's (Asus B550) internal audio I am quite satisfied actually.
hi
but Asus B550 does include a great audio chipset , about the realtek 800 series for what i have read they are not so great ,above all the analog output
I don't know if you had some exerience with such chipset
thanks
I can not answer that, unfortunately. I don't have much knowledge about motherboard converters/chipsets. Hopefully someone else can is able to give you an answer.
If you're looking for an affordable headphone DAC, consider trying the Fosi Audio K5 Pro Gaming DAC.
If you're looking for an affordable headphone DAC, consider trying the Fosi Audio K5 Pro Gaming DAC.
hi
yes i'm thinking about or the Fosi Audio K5 Pro Gaming or SMSL PO100AK or Topping D10S
the beauty to use the asio ,is that it will work as wasapi event without taking exclusive control of the device ,right?
i don't need to resample if i use asio
thanks
if your internal dac have at least this parameters:
THD, IMD: -66 dBFS / 0.05%
Noise: -85 dBFS / 0.005%
Frequency response: ±0.5 dB
changing for a "best" dac isn't audible when used as line out to amplifier.
if you use your internal dac with headphones:
it is possible than use a headphone amp (<2 ohm output impedance and high power) be change the sound.
if your internal dac have at least this parameters:
THD, IMD: -66 dBFS / 0.05%
Noise: -85 dBFS / 0.005%
Frequency response: ±0.5 dB
changing for a "best" dac isn't audible when used as line out to amplifier.
if you use your internal dac with headphones:
it is possible than use a headphone amp (<2 ohm output impedance and high power) be change the sound.
hi
about these parameters ,where can i find ?
the manufacter doesn't show or release
thanks
the manufacter doesn't show or release
If a manufacturer doesn't headline their specifications, you can be sure the specifications are mediocre!
If the store you are buying from offers free returns, why don't you just buy it and try it. We don't have your ears and can't tell you what YOU can hear. People can give you specs but again we can't tell you if you will hear any differences. Just try it and send it back if you're not happy.
the manufacter doesn't show or release
If a manufacturer doesn't headline their specifications, you can be sure the specifications are mediocre!
hi
i'm talking about realtek , they don't release a lot of informations about audio chipsets
Main problem with motherboard integrated audio in the past was that it was easily affected by electrical noise. They were so easy to pick up noises that for example something so simple as your hard drive reading data or you moving the computer mouse caused chirping sounds in line-out. Another common problem was that the output had a constant background hiss.
Note that the above mentioned noises were rather quiet. Easy to hear if you had headphones plugged in to the output, but since speakers are much further away from ears you might miss them unless the volume is quite high.
These have been solved issues for many years now at least in better motherboards.
If you don't have unwanted background noises with your current audio solution you will almost certainly not hear any quality improvements from getting another DAC with music or any normal sounds.
You might get some theoretical improvements like better channel isolation or protection against intersample clipping, but these cause audible problems only with test signals.
If you are curious to test how well your current integrated soundcard performs, you can easily get an idea by testing it with RightMark Audio Analyzer (https://audio.rightmark.org/index_new.shtml). You only need a cable to connect the output from line-out to line-in. The results won't be perfectly accurate as quality of the line-in will degrade the measurements. But it will be a good estimate.
i'm talking about realtek , they don't release a lot of informations about audio chipsets
As a professional engineer (not audio), I could not build a system around components which had no published specification (for specifications which mattered in the final product). The reason for that is lack of accountability: for a product to meet its specification, its components have to meet their specifications, or be subject to rigorous testing in-house to determine their specifications (an expensive process).
A typical consumer-grade PC is not aimed at audiophiles, so the makers are not concerned about audiophile specifications. Therefore an audiophile user cannot rely on guaranteed performance for noise, THD etc.
There are three solutions to this:
- Find an audiophile supplier of PCs;
- Use an external DAC with published performance specifications;
- Listen to (or test) the audio output from your existing PC and decide whether it is good enough for yourself.
Notebooks can get much better simply by unplugging from the mains and running off battery.
I realise you were wondering whether you would notice any improvement by switching to an external DAC and whether the investment would be worthwhile. Unfortunately only you can decide that, it depends how good your ears are (and how much it matters to you). Personally, I don't think I would notice any difference. What you do get with an external DAC is better connectors (the 3.5mm stereo socket is a weak link)!
I will use them to connect to my Yamaha A-S501
Do you have a SPDIF-Out on your PC?
Why not using the SPDIF-In of your Yamaha A-S501?
From the manual:
Supported digital audio format (OPTICAL/COAXIAL) PCM (2-ch) 192/176.4/96/88.2/48/44.1/32 kHz
PCM word depth 24 bit/16 bit
Your Yamaha is using a PCM5101APWR DAC with good specs.
PART NUMBER: PCM5101A
DYNAMIC RANGE: 106 dB
SNR : 106 dB
THD: –92 dB
Service Manual: Yamaha A-S501 (https://elektrotanya.com/yamaha_a-s501_a-s301.pdf/download.html#dl)
Specs: PCM5101 (https://www.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/pcm5101a.pdf)
Bear in mind that if the PC does have an SPDIF output (how many do, unless you've fitted a specialist sound card?), it could have significant jitter.
i'm talking about realtek , they don't release a lot of informations about audio chipsets
As a professional engineer (not audio), I could not build a system around components which had no published specification (for specifications which mattered in the final product). The reason for that is lack of accountability: for a product to meet its specification, its components have to meet their specifications, or be subject to rigorous testing in-house to determine their specifications (an expensive process).
A typical consumer-grade PC is not aimed at audiophiles, so the makers are not concerned about audiophile specifications. Therefore an audiophile user cannot rely on guaranteed performance for noise, THD etc.
There are three solutions to this:
- Find an audiophile supplier of PCs;
- Use an external DAC with published performance specifications;
- Listen to (or test) the audio output from your existing PC and decide whether it is good enough for yourself.
Notebooks can get much better simply by unplugging from the mains and running off battery.
I realise you were wondering whether you would notice any improvement by switching to an external DAC and whether the investment would be worthwhile. Unfortunately only you can decide that, it depends how good your ears are (and how much it matters to you). Personally, I don't think I would notice any difference. What you do get with an external DAC is better connectors (the 3.5mm stereo socket is a weak link)!
Hi
I was looking a friend 's computer , pretty good i guess , there is a MSI B350M Gaming Pro , with a Realtek® ALC887 high definition audio card
even looks a pretty desktop with 64Gb of ram , great video card , and fast fast ssd 980 PRO NVMe M.2 SSD 1 TB
i can't find any informations about the Realtek® ALC887 high definition , even should pretty old chipset on a good mothercard
the only informations i can find are these ...
1. Meets premium audio requirements for Microsoft WLP 3.10
2. Meets stricter performance requirements for future WLP
3. High-performance DACs with 97dB Signal-to-Noise Ratio (SNR), ADCs with 90dB SNR
4. Four stereo DACs (8 channels) support 16/20/24-bit PCM format for 7.1 sound playback.
5. Two stereo ADCs (4 channels) support 16/20/24-bit PCM format recording simultaneously
6. All DACs supports 16/20/24-bit, 44.1k/48k/96k/192kHz sample rate
and
The ALC887 is a 7.1 Channel High Definition Audio Codec with two independent SPDIF outputs. Featuring eight channels of DAC support 7.1 sound playback, and integrates two stereo ADC that can support a stereo microphone, and feature Acoustic Echo Cancellation (AEC), Beam Forming (BF), and Noise Suppression (NS) for voice applications. ALC887 is designed not only to meet the premium audio performance requirements in current WLP3.10 (Windows Logo Program), but provides better characteristics for future WLP. That brings user real high fidelity of sound quality.
Those things tell you the digital performance of the audio processing, they say nothing about the analogue performance. Realtek (or whoever might supply an audio interface chip set) have no control over how a systems integrator actually uses the chips.
A 32-bit DAC would be of no use if the electronic noise floor is a 10-bit hiss!
To my mind, the most significant benefit of an external DAC is to get the analogue signal as far away as possible from the EMI within a PC, preferably on a de-coupled power supply. BUT... if you can't hear any interference coming out of your PC (even over silence), then you don't need it.
Bear in mind that if the PC does have an SPDIF output (how many do, unless you've fitted a specialist sound card?), it could have significant jitter.
I don't think that is an issue at all? The audiophoolery business has been trying to provoke forth all sorts of jitterbug, and ... is there anything the buffer in the DAC won't handle? Another issue is that coax cables connect the devices electrically, so sending (analog!) noise out.
As for "how many do": I don't think those dual-function 3.5" SPDIF/headphone jacks outlets are that common anymore, but - HDMI to SPDIF, anyone?
Those things tell you the digital performance of the audio processing, they say nothing about the analogue performance. Realtek (or whoever might supply an audio interface chip set) have no control over how a systems integrator actually uses the chips.
A 32-bit DAC would be of no use if the electronic noise floor is a 10-bit hiss!
To my mind, the most significant benefit of an external DAC is to get the analogue signal as far away as possible from the EMI within a PC, preferably on a de-coupled power supply. BUT... if you can't hear any interference coming out of your PC (even over silence), then you don't need it.
hi
they are cheap dac ,and they use usb to power up or as power supply
for example SMSL SU-1 Stereo DAC , seems it works great via usb
i'm thinking about Topping D10S and SMSL PO100AK , for the output
thanks
SMSL PO100AK
It looks like the PO100AK has early roll-off with 44.1/48kHz input.
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/s-m-s-l-po100-ak-measurements-round-2-dac.42982/ (https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/s-m-s-l-po100-ak-measurements-round-2-dac.42982/)