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Topic: Dolby Headphone Wrapper DSP (Read 337845 times) previous topic - next topic
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Dolby Headphone Wrapper DSP

Reply #125 –
Quote from: Chungalin on
nawhead: Thanks for letting me know of that. I'm sorry for the inconvenience to all plugin users. The 1.1.1 version was initially a test version to evaluate the effect of Dynamic Compression parameter, but I really forgot to make it official. Store & Serve was fine some months ago, but of course it's not the best way to keep it available for a long time. Now it's uploaded at official 3rd party plugins website as version 1.1.1, the only change from the "test" 1.1.1 is that the Dynamic Compression is disabled by default. I've also uploaded the 1.0.0 version for older foobar2000 0.8 as requested by Erik.


Thanks for releasing 1.1.1 officially.  I really do think the Dolby Headphone Wrapper is the best crossfeed/speaker simulator available for Foobar2k right now.  I'm a big headphone buff too (or used to be, with a M-Audio 2496 sound card feeding Creek OBH-11 headphone amp to Grado SR-125 or Sony MDR-7506, nothing fancy, but it was passable for semi-cool) back in the day, and always used software crossfeeds.  I've gone pretty basic nowadays with just a Koss KSC-35 connected to the headphone jack on a Audigy sound card, but the Dolby HP plugin makes me think I have a better setup than I do!   


Quote
As I said previously, I'm no longer using it for music. If you read the older posts in this thread you will see that we already tried several upmixing variations to feed DH, including ChannelMixer and FreeSurround. The main problem (for my taste) is that without Dynamic Compression is difficult to harness the volume so the DH engine doesn't go outside 0db (i.e. clip) in all cases. I want to listen to music without the paranoid stress of "hey! I think I've heard a clip there!". Maybe as you say it's a matter of adjusting RG for your media to avoid bad peaks. Feel free to share the experience.

However, I don't plan to spoil the party to anyone. I'm happy to know that there're people enjoying the sound from this plugin.


I've been playing around more with the different upmixing solutions (with the help of Peakmeter as a visual aid), and I still think a replaygained track upmixed with Channel Mixer is optimal.  I've been listening to everything from opera to hardcore heavy metal and I'm not finding any unresolvable clipping issues. 

However, I've identified two situations in order of severity where tracks still clip with ReplayGain + Channel Mixer + Dolby Headphone:
  • Listening to an album with + dB album gain but there's a track with - dB track gain, where the single track is louder than the rest of the album.  The greater the difference, the greater the impact (i.e. +1 dB album gain, -3 dB track gain). 
  • Something like an opera track, where it's quiet for so long then you get very high peak (i.e. track gain of +5.5dB).
(Note: For situation #1, you have to be listening in album mode for this problem to affect you.)

For both instances, advanced limiter solves it.  However, since situation #1 is worse than situation #2, if you have an album with a couple -5 dB track gain on a +2 dB album, you may just want to playback in track mode so advanced limiter doesn't kick in so much. 

For me, I don't like it when advaned limiter kicks in a lot, so I'm preferring to listen to everything in track mode now.  Album gain doesn't seem to make sense to me anymore for anything but gapless albums.

Why do I go through the trouble you may ask?  I don't like the FreeSurround upmixer since it's hardcoded to 85% gain, and it's not a dynamically adjusting solution.  Same for just setting lower amplification in DHP itself.  I don't like the idea of just throwing away bits of information unnecessarily.  Also, the highs with Channel Mixer (with sub turned on, no redirection) has more sparkle when I adjust for volume difference [but don't take my word for it, I haven't done abx testing so I may be fooled].

But FreeSurround does bring out the low mids better than the default 2 to 4 channel upmixer, so it's good for people who don't have a replaygained library or don't want to go through the trouble of it (though I find replaygaining my library has brought me more benefits than I first sought out, but that's another discussion).

Dolby Headphone Wrapper DSP

Reply #126 –
I have two different versions of the dolbyhph.dll, one from PowerDVD 4, and the one from PowerDVD 7, and the version numbering is wrong on 1.20!

From PowerDVD 4:
DolbyHph.dll (modified date 11/5/2001)
File version 1.2.0.222
Product Version 1.02.0222

From PowerDVD 7:
dolbyhph.dll (modified date 2/7/2007)
File version 1.10.0.270
Product version 1.10.0270

They messed up the file version # on the dolbyhph.dll from back in 2001.

To see the Product Version info, go to File Properties -> Version tab -> Product Version item (2nd from bottom).

Dolby Headphone Wrapper DSP

Reply #127 –
You should not rely on the modification date as it is only related to your file system and not the file itself. Some programs set that date to the date when the file is first copied to your hard disk. Version 1.10.0.270 is definitely much older than the shown date.

Dolby Headphone Wrapper DSP

Reply #128 –
Quote from: Hancoque on
You should not rely on the modification date as it is only related to your file system and not the file itself. Some programs set that date to the date when the file is first copied to your hard disk. Version 1.10.0.270 is definitely much older than the shown date.


You're thinking of file creation date.  The file modification date is separate from the file creation date.  But that really wasn't the part I was trying to impress.

Look at the product version numbering:

File version 1.2.0.222
Product Version 1.02.0222

File version 1.10.0.270
Product version 1.10.0270

1.10.0.270 is definitely newer than 1.2.0.222.

Now is there a noticeable audible difference?  Much harder to say...

Dolby Headphone Wrapper DSP

Reply #129 –
Quote from: nawhead on
1.10.0.270 is definitely newer than 1.2.0.222.

Now is there a noticeable audible difference?  Much harder to say...


I just did an ABX test to see if the different dolbyhp DLL's have any audible difference.  Failed.  Then I realized I could have just done a binary comparison first.  "No differences in decoded data found."  Well I could have saved myself 45 minutes by doing that first!   

So I guess this was pointless arguing about version numbers.

Dolby Headphone Wrapper DSP

Reply #130 –
Quote from: nawhead on
You're thinking of file creation date.  The file modification date is separate from the file creation date.
No, I know the difference between file modification dates and file creation dates. What I wanted to say is that programs often change the modification date to the creation date when it is initially written to the hard disk. Of course that is an unwanted behaviour. Therefore these dates are not reliable to show how old a file really is.

Dolby Headphone Wrapper DSP

Reply #131 –
Quote from: Hancoque on
Quote from: nawhead on
You're thinking of file creation date.  The file modification date is separate from the file creation date.
No, I know the difference between file modification dates and file creation dates. What I wanted to say is that programs often change the modification date to the creation date when it is initially written to the hard disk. Of course that is an unwanted behaviour. Therefore these dates are not reliable to show how old a file really is.


Ok I understand, but that's why I pointed out the product version numbers as well.  But this is becoming off topic and might get modded. 

As I said above, I did the bit comparison and the output of 1.2.0 (or 1.02) is the same as 1.10, so I'm convinced it doesn't matter which version of the DLL is used with this plugin.  I think the changes might have been cosmetic in the code, or maybe code optimizations, and nothing to do with signal processing.

Dolby Headphone Wrapper DSP

Reply #132 –
Quote from: Chungalin on
Thanks thuneau for your feedback.

Regarding the bug you report, yes, I was expecting this to happen (unfortunately). The point is that Dolby Headphone engine DLL is not multithread compatible. This means that only one stream of audio can be processed at a time for a given process that has loaded the DLL. Given the time shifts that Dolby Headphones introduces to signal, the DLL needs to use a small buffer to keep part of the previous input audio. Then the filter is not exactly 1:1 on every call. If you mix calls from different audio sources you will get a mess on output, since previously buffered samples from source A (play) are mixed with samples from source B (convert).

However I was expecting this to happen whenever concurrent play and convert with DH is performed, not only when a given file is being played/converted at the same time. I'll check it.


I just came upon this bug when I was converting a bunch of files for use on my new portable.  Every single file came out garbled!  I own a P4 HyperThreading CPU so foobar2k processes 2 files simultaneously at all times.  I thought I was gonna have to abandon my Dolby Headphone conversion plans, but I fortunately came upon this discussion about disabling hyperthreading with foobar.  To do so, open up Task Manager, find the foobar2000.exe process, right-click, "Set Affinity," and uncheck CPU 1.  Voila, no more hyperthreading with foobar2000, and I can mass convert with Dolby Headphone for portable use.  Of course, I have to go through these steps every time I want to convert using DHP, but it's simple enough to remember.

Dolby Headphone Wrapper DSP

Reply #133 –
Quote from: nawhead on
Look at the product version numbering:

File version 1.2.0.222
Product Version 1.02.0222

File version 1.10.0.270
Product version 1.10.0270

1.10.0.270 is definitely newer than 1.2.0.222.

Well, last time I checked, 2 were less then 10...
Can't wait for a HD-AAC encoder :P

Dolby Headphone Wrapper DSP

Reply #134 –
Quote from: odyssey on
Quote from: nawhead on

Look at the product version numbering:

File version 1.2.0.222
Product Version 1.02.0222

File version 1.10.0.270
Product version 1.10.0270

1.10.0.270 is definitely newer than 1.2.0.222.

Well, last time I checked, 2 were less then 10...


Don't be going all common sense on us now.  I'm a computer geek so I need leading zeros to tell me if 2 is less than 10! 

Dolby Headphone Wrapper DSP

Reply #135 –
Quote from: nawhead on
Quote from: odyssey on

Quote from: nawhead on

Look at the product version numbering:

File version 1.2.0.222
Product Version 1.02.0222

File version 1.10.0.270
Product version 1.10.0270

1.10.0.270 is definitely newer than 1.2.0.222.

Well, last time I checked, 2 were less then 10...


Don't be going all common sense on us now.  I'm a computer geek so I need leading zeros to tell me if 2 is less than 10! 

I just think it was funny  True that some uses leading zeros, but I've seen this practice other places now. Take a look at Nero - They don't pad their number with zeros as well, and sometimes run up above 9 in their versioning scheme
Can't wait for a HD-AAC encoder :P

Dolby Headphone Wrapper DSP

Reply #136 –
Hello, first post here..

First, this is an awesome plugin (made me switch out of winamp!) for headphone listeners.  quite the only DSP needed, period.

I wanted to put some additional observation here..and that is:

I think most people here would agree that while Dolbyhph.dll accepts 2.0 stereo input for processing, it's really designed for 5.1 input.  Thus, upmixing stereo material (i.e. most mp3's) to minimum of 4 channels or to 6 channels using skyprich's Channel Mixer is essential before passing off to dolby headphone..

It seems to me, Dolby Headphone sounds best when you send it a true, natively mastered 5.1 surround material (i.e. from a DVD for example).  Upmixing using free upmixers available for foobar2000 doesn't produce the realistic sound for me (then again, a 2 channel stereo is 2 channels, not 5.1... making 5.1 out of it is quite not realistic).

So I've been looking for 2ch->6ch upmixers for foobar2000 that have some additional feedback processing that bring more 'liveliness' to the sound while upmixing, similar to Dolby Pro Logic II, etc.  So far the best one I've found is Steve Thompson's V.I. VST Plugin available at http://www.stevethomson.ca/vi/

Right now my foobar2000 DSP settings are chained like this:

1. Channel Mixer:  Upmix is switched off, subwoofer is switched off.  Channels are set to 6 channels on first page however.
2. VST Host bridge -> V.I. Plugin for upmixing
3. Dolby Headphone Wrapper DSP (vol. set to 100%, dynamic compression off)
4. Advanced Limiter or custom compressor like VLevel if you notice any clippings

And quite simply, this setup produces the best ever headphone sound I've ever heard from standard 2 channel stereo mp3's -- definitely beats chaining thru typical freely available upmixers (i.e. built-in 4 channel upmixer, etc).  I can actually locate the sound as if being in a room, where as with typical setup before, it wasn't too realistic as this.

Only problem is that VST host bridge seems extremely unstable with V.I. Plugin loaded.  For example, re-seeking to different section of the song while playing would either produce lots of noise or crash foobar2000.  Alternative way for now is to convert stereo mp3's to 5.1 surround material by chaining ChannelMixer->VSTHostBridge and using Convert function (which I can then listen with just Dolby Headphone wrapper DSP loaded).

Anyway, just sharing my experience, thank you for the awesome plugin!

Dolby Headphone Wrapper DSP

Reply #137 –
I have evaluated the V.I plugin for some time now and I agree: It definitely improves the sound even further compared to the simple quad upmix. The mentioned DSP chain is exactly what I'm using now.

Dolby Headphone Wrapper DSP

Reply #138 –
Is there a VST host bridge that works with foobar 0.9.5 and if there is do you care to link me?

Dolby Headphone Wrapper DSP

Reply #140 –
Thanks a lot

Edit: Can I just close the VI plugin or do I have to keep that window alive for it to work? I'm just asking because if I have work on the desktop to to it is rather annoying.

Dolby Headphone Wrapper DSP

Reply #141 –
You can close it.

Dolby Headphone Wrapper DSP

Reply #142 –
Hi guys, I'm a really really awful n00b in every sense of the word when it comes to audio and things, but I just wanted to say I stumbled upon the DH wrapper 2 weeks ago and am absolutely wowed! It made listening MUCH easier on the ears and it "felt" cooler too...

However, my problem is that although until now I've been using stereo->4ch and then Dolby Headphone wrapper in that order... Some music sounds absolutely unlistenable because of the bass. Amon Tobin's Four Ton Mantis just sounded awful. So I read this thread and what I understood was that stereo->4ch makes it sound a lot louder, but the bass can get too loud. Instead some people have been upmixing from stereo to 6ch/5.1. One component suggested was ATSurround Processor, which was good for bass but after a while I felt it was a bit tinny. Also, it was rather soft. Then I tried using ATSurround Processor on its own without Dolby Headphone, but it felt uncomfortable to my ears and not all that different from normal playback. Another one was skyprich's CHannel Mixer, but it wouldn't work (wrong version of foobar? I'm using 0.9.4.4) so I can't use that.

Any suggestions? I don't suppose it's possible to have sufficient loudness + proper handling of bass + surround-sound feeling all in one package is it... For the record I'm using audio-technica ATH-T22 headphones, maybe I should just get better headphones or do some equalizing or something :S

Dolby Headphone Wrapper DSP

Reply #143 –
I don't have more bass when using "Convert stereo to 4 channels" and "Dolby Headphone". Maybe it's a clipping problem. I use ReplayGain and a -6 dB attenuation for material without ReplayGain information. With most music I don't get peaks above -6 dB that way. But when I disable ReplayGain and the attenuation I get peaks above 0 dB all the time. The peaks almost never go above +3 dB, though. So it would help to lower the amplification in the "Dolby Headphone" plugin to 71% (which equals -3 dB) to prevent clipping. Maybe that solves your problem. You should also disable "Dynamic compression" in the plugin's options. That could also be the cause of a too "thick" sound.

P.S.: Try the archive of the "Channel Mixer" plugin with the .7z extension instead of .zip. The former is for foobar2000 0.9.x while the latter is for 0.8.x. If you don't know how to handle it google for "7-zip".

Dolby Headphone Wrapper DSP

Reply #144 –
Quote from: Hancoque on
I don't have more bass when using "Convert stereo to 4 channels" and "Dolby Headphone". Maybe it's a clipping problem. I use ReplayGain and a -6 dB attenuation for material without ReplayGain information. With most music I don't get peaks above -6 dB that way. But when I disable ReplayGain and the attenuation I get peaks above 0 dB all the time. The peaks almost never go above +3 dB, though. So it would help to lower the amplification in the "Dolby Headphone" plugin to 71% (which equals -3 dB) to prevent clipping. Maybe that solves your problem. You should also disable "Dynamic compression" in the plugin's options. That could also be the cause of a too "thick" sound.

P.S.: Try the archive of the "Channel Mixer" plugin with the .7z extension instead of .zip. The former is for foobar2000 0.9.x while the latter is for 0.8.x. If you don't know how to handle it google for "7-zip".


Thanks for the swift reply! I've turned dynamic compression off from the start, and have a DSP component called "Advanced Limiter" - I guess it's better to switch that out for a "Hard -6dB Limiter", although I can't hear the difference so clearly yet (shall check it out when I get back). I'll try reducing the Dolby Headphone plugin's amplification then. And many thanks regarding the archives - I didn't realise the .7z was newer (I know how to use it though).

Dolby Headphone Wrapper DSP

Reply #145 –
Can anyone tell me if the source of this wrapper is available anywhere?

THX

Dolby Headphone Wrapper DSP

Reply #146 –
Quote from: eeasee on
Can anyone tell me if the source of this wrapper is available anywhere?

THX


It is included in some software distributions that come with new DVD drives. I know LG's have it. Check your software.
Glass half full!

Dolby Headphone Wrapper DSP

Reply #147 –
I think eeasee means the source code.

Dolby Headphone Wrapper DSP

Reply #148 –
correct, i meant the source code of the wrapper.
I'd like to port it to other plug-in APIs.

Dolby Headphone Wrapper DSP

Reply #149 –
dolbyhph.dll (1.20.0.276) included in PowerDVD 8.
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