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Topic: Re: Please do not recommend broken components (Read 7967 times) previous topic - next topic - Topic derived from Please do not recomme...
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Re: Please do not recommend broken components

Hello!
Using foobar2000 1.6.6 and theme/skin DarkOne v4 by tedgo
Win 10 x64
Just now saw this post and used foobar2000 via Help -> Online Troubleshooter which found this, see below.
So I removed them and restarted foobar with this result:
foobar broken
https://i.imgur.com/AG46vU1.jpeg
foobar ok
https://i.imgur.com/piqBtQZ.jpeg
Searched trying to find component updates but no cigar.
Are there updates or am I stuck with the "problematic" components?
Not a problem really since I don't get any crashes or any weird behavior in foobar.
I really love tedgo's DarkOne v4 and would like to keep it.
Any input on this? If I posted on the wrong place just delete or move to right place.
Thanks...
Code: [Select]
The following components found on your system are known to be problematic and should be either uninstalled or updated to their latest versions:

	foo_uie_vis_channel_spectrum.dll : Channel Spectrum panel 0.17.2
Reason: Repeated crash reports, division by zero bug.
Download the latest version...

	foo_uie_vis_peakmeter_spectrum.dll : Peakmeter Spectrum Visualisation 0.2.0.0 beta
Reason: Repeated crash reports.

	foo_uie_biography.dll : Biography View 0.4.2.4
Reason: Repeated crash reports.
Download the latest version...

	foo_uie_elplaylist.dll : ELPlaylist 0.6.9.1.2(beta)
Reason: Repeated crash reports.
Download the latest version...

	foo_uie_lyrics3.dll : Lyric Show Panel 3 0.5
Reason: Repeated crash reports.
What is the opposite of music? ~ Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts.

Re: Re: Please do not recommend broken components

Reply #1 –
I'm using (as many do) foo_uie_vis_channel_spectrum and foo_uie_elplaylist for years without issue.

Re: Re: Please do not recommend broken components

Reply #2 –
"Works for me" is about as useful as "there is no world hunger because I have a sandwich".

Just because one person doesn't have issues warrants the need to recommend broken components. Broken components are broken and must be shunned.

Re: Please do not recommend broken components

Reply #3 –
Quote from: mudlord on
"Works for me" is about as useful as "there is no world hunger because I have a sandwich".
That comment is beyond stupid... :/
What is the opposite of music? ~ Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts.

Re: Re: Please do not recommend broken components

Reply #4 –
Broken components are broken for a reason. You can use it as it is but if you encounter some bugs or crashes within the app don't blame foobar itself for that. Your best chance is to contact component's developer and ask him to update it.

Quote from: mudlord on
Broken components are broken and must be shunned.

Agreed.
Somewhere, there's someone dying in a foreign land
Meanwhile, the world is crying stupidity of man
Tell me why, tell me why

Re: Please do not recommend broken components

Reply #5 –
Agreed!  :D
What is the opposite of music? ~ Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts.

Re: Re: Please do not recommend broken components

Reply #6 –
I don't want to go without foo_facets for a month, even if it spawns the odd error report :-/

Re: Re: Please do not recommend broken components

Reply #7 –
Quote from: redorb on
Quote from: mudlord on
"Works for me" is about as useful as "there is no world hunger because I have a sandwich".
That comment is beyond stupid... :/

And trying to justify broken components when the application developer has to put up with tech support for the player only to find the end user is using defective components is.....?

I don't see in any way how saying that you don't have a problem with defective components means no one else had problems. Which is the exact same logic as my analogy. I see this all too often when doing tech support for my stuff, and why pretty much I stopped.

Its pointless doing tech support when people will use old component versions anyway (even ones admittedly that have bugs/crashes), etc.

I can see then why the policy of not using completely broken components is enforced. From a development standpoint it makes perfect sense and removes the hassles.

Re: Please do not recommend broken components

Reply #8 –
In my view, the best way for developers to ensure broken components are not used is not just to ban them but to either fix them or replicate the functionality they offer.

I'm sure if people are given better options, they will take them.
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?

Re: Re: Please do not recommend broken components

Reply #9 –
Quote from: mudlord on
Its pointless doing tech support when people will use old component versions anyway (even ones admittedly that have bugs/crashes), etc.
+1

For example, I see a lot of crash reports for the really old version of my component (like 2 years old), despite there being a new release for a long time that fixes those crashes...

Re: Re: Please do not recommend broken components

Reply #10 –
Quote from: 2tec on
In my view, the best way for developers to ensure broken components are not used is not just to ban them but to either fix them or replicate the functionality they offer.

I'm sure if people are given better options, they will take them.
Reeeeal funny... You do know, that developing (and fixing *is* developing) new components is not like ordering pizza? It actually requires quite a bit of time (and effort).

And nor Peter, nor foobar2000, nor anyone else actually bans these components - most of us just don't bother diagnosing issues if there's one of such components installed, since we don't want to waste our time doing useless things.

TLDR: you can use crash-ware components all you want (since no one actually bans their usage), just don't expect the same (or even any) support if you encounter any problems even in (seemingly) unrelated parts of player.

Re: Please do not recommend broken components

Reply #11 –
I was not trying to justify broken components.
I was not saying that anyone else doesn't have or have problems.
I was not reporting a crasch or a bug...

I was trying to find help.
And... I was not able to find any updates for the broken components.

Quote
Searched trying to find component updates but no cigar.
Are there updates or am I stuck with the "problematic" components?

I have no idea who created the broken components and how to contact them.
The creator (tedgo) of DarkOne 4 seems to be inactive these days.

So... apologies for stirring things up...

Thanks and best regards,
redorb
What is the opposite of music? ~ Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts.

Re: Re: Please do not recommend broken components

Reply #12 –
Quote from: redorb on
I was not trying to justify broken components.
I was trying to find help.
No worries, this topic (and a few others like `x64 version of fb2k`) always triggers a lot of flaming =)

Regarding your OP:
foo_uie_biography.dll : I've never used this component, but it looks like it can be substituted with Biography scripts for foo_spider_monkey_panel component from WilB or kgena_ua (https://theqwertiest.github.io/foo_spider_monkey_panel/docs/script_showcase/single_panel_scripts/#biography-wilb and https://theqwertiest.github.io/foo_spider_monkey_panel/docs/script_showcase/single_panel_scripts/#biography-kgena-ua)

foo_uie_elplaylist.dll : maybe it can be replaced with Brett's playlist scripts? (https://theqwertiest.github.io/foo_spider_monkey_panel/docs/script_showcase/single_panel_scripts/#js-playlist , https://theqwertiest.github.io/foo_spider_monkey_panel/docs/script_showcase/single_panel_scripts/#js-smooth-playlist)

foo_uie_lyrics3.dll : I've heard about a new lyrics plugin https://github.com/jacquesh/foo_openlyrics (not tested it personally though)

Re: Re: Please do not recommend broken components

Reply #13 –
Quote from: TheQwertiest on
Reeeeal funny... You do know, that developing (and fixing *is* developing) new components is not like ordering pizza? It actually requires quite a bit of time (and effort).
No humour was intended. No one appreciates developers more than people like me that can't. All I'm saying is apart from personal interest, if developers need directions to develop towards, recreating the functionality of these broken components would be a productive direction and if there were better alternatives, users would take them and the number of broken older components in use would diminish.
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?

Re: Please do not recommend broken components

Reply #14 –
Quote from: 2tec on
Quote from: TheQwertiest on
Reeeeal funny... You do know, that developing (and fixing *is* developing) new components is not like ordering pizza? It actually requires quite a bit of time (and effort).
No humour was intended. No one appreciates developers more than people like me that can't. All I'm saying is apart from personal interest, if developers need directions to develop towards, recreating the functionality of these broken components would be a productive direction and if there were better alternatives, users would take them and the number of broken older components in use would diminish.

Well then we got another problem, most things are not open source. That's something I will never understand, releasing something, at some point being tired of supporting it and never release the source (so other people can continue development).

It's the developer's choice to release (or not) the source, for sure, but that behavior is totally... Some people care more about no one touching his "baby" than anything else.

There would be no need to recreate broken components at all if things were open source from the start.

Re: Please do not recommend broken components

Reply #15 –
Perhaps some code is considered just not worth releasing. Not that it's necessarily poorly implemented, but unwinding someone else's old nondocumented code can be quite counter-productive. Maybe they're doing others a favour by not releasing it. Then there's whole issue of code doing what it shouldn't be doing …

i too generally like open-source projects for the reason the code is exposed, peer pressure and review is invaluable

with that said, I still prefer Foobar, a closed source player over the other open-source alternatives.
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?

Re: Please do not recommend broken components

Reply #16 –
Not talking about foobar but specifically about its components, although I think the same for any software if you ask me (and I still prefer foobar over other programs too). I don't think there is code not worth releasing when you are releasing the compiled thing, to me that's really ironic.

That was my point, being practical -for the community as a whole- it makes 0 sense to release closed source things when you can't offer support, but coding is not about being practical but the ego of developers/companies most times. It may be bad coded or bad documented, but it's better than nothing on my book.

If that's not true then... why there is a crash report telling users to not use broken components instead of asking their developers to not release closed source components without support? Both are warnings in line with the 'we are tired of supporting broken things' aim, but only the first is given.

Also the results are clear, how many broken components are closed source? There you got the lyrics component... broken at so many points during its lifetime but people keep releasing more and more plugins for it in hope it continues working because there is no way to change the component itself. And ff there are no alternatives, then as you noted, there is no "reason" to uninstall those broken components and use others.
Thanks there is an alternative now

On the other hand you have WSH, JS, SMP scripts which have had infinite updates/Fixes by different people even when the original coder was gone. And I would not say those give less crashes! But at least they can be fixed by anyone.

Re: Please do not recommend broken components

Reply #17 –
@TheQwertiest

Thanks for your kind answer, I really appreciate it!
I will try the components you so kindly suggested and let you know the outcome.
Adding links to components is a great bonus for me, so thank you!

Best regards,
redorb
What is the opposite of music? ~ Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts.

Re: Please do not recommend broken components

Reply #18 –
Quote from: redorb on
redorb
@redorb

I too would like to switch to the newest version of foobar.  And I have been using DarkOne v3 by tedgo for years (and years).

While I doubt it will work, I'd like to try.  But how do you import the .fcl configuration file in the new version of foobar.  I didn't find that option.

Did you get v 4 to work?

Re: Please do not recommend broken components

Reply #19 –
You should have zero issues running themes like DarkOne on the latest version of foobar2000. Just upgrading it in place should work fine.

As for importing .fcl files, that requires Columns UI - something you should already have as part of your theme???

Re: Please do not recommend broken components

Reply #20 –
@frankpc
foobar 2000 1.6.7 and DarkOne 4 works flawlessly together for me.
With components [TheQuertiest Spider Monkey Panel 1.6.0] and [WilB Biography 1.2.0] and [veksha (lyrics) foo_multisource v0.55] I have a very nice foobar player setup!!
No guarantee it will work for you as there might be some issues with older components that are no longer supported so no support in here for this setup.
I haven't yet tested the components TheQwertiest so kindly presented in this thread.
My setup:
https://i.imgur.com/I0VN8sQ.jpg
What is the opposite of music? ~ Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts.

Re: Please do not recommend broken components

Reply #21 –
Nice layout except those rounded images.... The curse of the modern internet which has even infected github. I hate it.  ;D

edit: I'm sure they're optional, I know WilB has super advanced settings panels for his scripts.

Re: Re: Please do not recommend broken components

Reply #22 –
@redorb , please, don't use 1.6.0 SMP, since it has some very nasty bugs... It's better to use 1.5.2 for now...

PS: Agreed with marc about rounded images, those are so annoying, since they often cripple my square-designed avatars...

Re: Please do not recommend broken components

Reply #23 –
@TheQwertiest @snotlicker
Thanks for the info, missed the bugs (never noticed any bugs) downgraded to 1.5.2)
The screenshot with round images in biography was to show some of the new features WilB Biography 1.2.0 added.
I use the setting where only one image (auto-cycle 20) of artist/band is shown in biography.

Best regards,
redorb
What is the opposite of music? ~ Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts.