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Topic: Storing/restoring EQ settings on a song-per-song basis (Read 1333 times) previous topic - next topic
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Storing/restoring EQ settings on a song-per-song basis

Hi all,

There are many equalizers available. Some are system-wide (Equalizer APO), some are VST plugins, some are fb2k components.
fb2k remains my player regardless of the used EQ.
Here's how I like to do:
  • I have a default EQ setting that suits me.
  • For most songs, I use that setting and all goes well.
  • For some songs however, that setting doesn't work. Generally because those songs are poorly recorded. Maybe because they're old, or because they're live, or because the sound engineer was drunk... whatever.
  • Those particular songs need to be EQed on a song-per-song basis in order to please my ears.
  • Then for the next song, I have to go back to the default EQ setting.
  • But next time I play one of these particular songs, I have to EQ them once again. Which is annoying because I can't just concentrate on laying back, relaxing and listening.

I wish there was a way to solve this problem. Maybe we could store those EQ settings in custom tags, so that the EQ software could read those tags (which would require it to be a fb2k component) and "EQ itself" for those particular songs. That would be great.

Does this make sense? Can we hope for this to become real someday?

Thanks for you insights. :)


Re: Storing/restoring EQ settings on a song-per-song basis

Reply #2
Thanks. Hadn't thought of Dynamic DSP, I've been using it for other tasks. Thanks again for suggesting it.

I've given it some thought, and quite honestly, it doesn't seem very suitable for what I'm trying to achieve.
Unless I'm wrong, imagine you have 1000 'particular songs' that require EQing. Each one with its own custom EQ parameters.
That would make 1000 different EQ presets for Dynamic DSP. It would quickly become unmanageable.

In my mind, EQ values would rather be stored directly in custom tags.
For example, for the 18-band Equalizer DSP, we would have some %equalizer% multivalue tag.
That tag would have 18 values. For example: 3; 3; 3; 0; 0; 0; 0; 0; -1; -2; -1; 0; 0; 0; 0; 0; 0; 0
Then the Equalizer DSP could theoretically read those values and apply the relevant EQ for the track. :)

It could be a very simple option, like a checkbox somewhere with "write EQ values to tags" (yes/no).
EQ values would be written and read automatically by the relevant DSP.

Maybe there would be a way of suggesting that to one of the developers. Anybody knows who I should contact, please?

Re: Storing/restoring EQ settings on a song-per-song basis

Reply #3
In my mind, EQ values would rather be stored directly in custom tags.
The ID3v2 tag schemes actually provide for this. Fields called EQU/EQUA/EQU2 depending on ID3v2.version. 
Never seen it. Never heard about a player that handles it.
Last two months' worth of foobar2000.org ad revenue has been donated to support war refugees from Ukraine: https://www.foobar2000.org/

Re: Storing/restoring EQ settings on a song-per-song basis

Reply #4
That makes sense to me.
Then maybe foobar2000 should be the first player that handles it. :)

I'm only a beginner dev and this is way beyond my skills, but AFAIK we would only need to modify the equalizer DSP so it reads the EQU/EQUA/EQU2 multivalue tag before reading a track.
If it finds the tag and its values, there would be two options : either tag values completely override current EQ settings, or tag values add to current EQ settings. That's up to the dev.

Optional stuff :
- A button or option within the equalizer DSP : "write EQ settings to the current track tags"
- A preference where we could define a custom tag field name (e.g. EQUALIZER instead of EQU).

What developer(s) would be in charge of the DSP part, so I could hopefully tag them and see what they think about this ? Thanks.

Re: Storing/restoring EQ settings on a song-per-song basis

Reply #5
Well ... there are DSP components, including some that apply particular DSP operations based on tags.
But - surprisingly, I would say - demand for it is so little that even if it has been available since *looking it up* ID3v2.0 in 1998, it isn't supported. So ... not likely it would come around, when so few people are interested.

Well, I'd be damned to recommend iTunes, but from a googling, iTunes does actually support per-file equalizer settings. But it seems to be stored in the library database, not in tags.
Last two months' worth of foobar2000.org ad revenue has been donated to support war refugees from Ukraine: https://www.foobar2000.org/

Re: Storing/restoring EQ settings on a song-per-song basis

Reply #6
Haha, I was among the first iTunes users, some 20 years ago or so. God forbid me to use that evil proprietary thing ever again.
I would say that foobar already supports some niche features that most people don't even know about (suffice to look at some advanced preferences). What's one more? :D

Now seriously, is there at least somebody that we could tag to discuss this?
The feature makes sense for those who'd like EQ on a track-per-track basis, and ID3 provides for it. Maybe more people are interested but they are not bored enough to post about it? :P

Re: Storing/restoring EQ settings on a song-per-song basis

Reply #7
Now seriously, is there at least somebody that we could tag to discuss this?
Well ...
The author of foo_dsp_deemph which applies a particular EQ curve based on a tag. (And of a convolver ...) @lvqcl, is this worth doing?
I guess Peter would have implemented it if he wanted to, but if someone else gives it a shot based on tags, he might need to fix some tag mapping to handle EQU, EQUA, EQU2 in ID3.
Last two months' worth of foobar2000.org ad revenue has been donated to support war refugees from Ukraine: https://www.foobar2000.org/



Re: Storing/restoring EQ settings on a song-per-song basis

Reply #10
This is an insane request. EQ the tracks in an audio editor and save them.

Re: Storing/restoring EQ settings on a song-per-song basis

Reply #11
There is nothing insane about it. Editing directly the tracks has these problems:
- Not lossless. Dithering, etc.
- Lossy formats can not be edited without reencoding (are you gonna EQ mp3 files and reencode? really?).
- Not trivial for most users.
- Breaks the source chain. You have to document your changes in case you need to re-rip files, re-download from the store, etc.
- Can not be restored. EQ is permanently applied.
- You can not restore changes or re-apply with different settings. Successive re-encoding or degradation when changing it on the future.
- I could continue....

EQ per tag solves all those problems. It's 2022, we have hardware perfectly capable of applying most audio related edits on real time. If at some point you want to change the settings, you can do it without touching the original audio.  It's all advantages.

Room corrections is done via DSP and I have never seen anyone say "just EQ the tracks" XD That's the insane thing if you ask me.

PD: Find it funny I keep saying "it's 2022" in many threads because people keep negatively reacting to additions/changes without any reason at all. Dark themes, 64 bits, etc.

 

Re: Storing/restoring EQ settings on a song-per-song basis

Reply #12
Thanks Regor, I couldn't agree more :) EQing the tracks in an audio editor is the most insane thing I've heard in a long time !  :))

EQing has evolved a lot. 20 years ago, only a few people were EQing stuff, because we generally needed hardware EQs to do so and the changes could not be kept. Nowadays, software equalizers have become more and more usual. We have classic AND parametric EQs. We have software like REW. As a result, people can now easily and accurately EQ their hi-fi system to their room.

And not only hi-fi systems. Headphone owners are using EQ more and more. People like Oratory1990 or Jaakko Pasanen via the AutoEQ website provide EQ profiles for every headphone in the market, matching every target curve you can imagine (Harman, Optimum Hi-Fi, Diffuse Field, etc).

That of course makes sense, but only for perfectly balanced tracks. Sadly lots of tracks need individual EQing. Either to compensate some mastering issues, or just to fit our own taste, which can vary slightly between sessions.

So in 2022 we really need our beloved foobar to be capable of keeping track of EQ changes, using tags:
- In the case of 3rd party EQ components, their devs could decide to add the aforementioned buttons ("Append EQ values to track", etc).
- In the case of foobar's core, we'd need the dev of the Equalizer DSP to add the buttons in the same way.

I hope somebody takes this request seriously, because in 2022 it absolutely makes sense for a lot of people out there. Thanks!