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Topic: [OFF-TOPIC] From: iTunes 10 (Read 4580 times) previous topic - next topic
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[OFF-TOPIC] From: iTunes 10

Quote from: cpchan on
people do, using programs of their own choosing. I can care less what people use, plus choice is good. I only have problems when someone push a certain device and program as the "Jesus" combo.

I don't push anything. I just explain why I find iTunes to be the best choice for my needs, and defend those who don't want to use time doing things manually, if they're easily managed by software in the background.

If an application can do the same things with the same ease of use, that's fine. At present that application don't exist. Other applications can do some of what iTunes do, but then I need several applications to do it all. Which would mean I have to waste time switching between apps, choosing what apps to use for each task, and generally waste time on tasks that could have been managed automatically in the background.

If you're a graphics professional, you don't waste time installing, learning and using a lot of small, specialized freeware apps (not even to mention complex and awkward Open Source stuff) — you use Photoshop. You do this, even if Adobe has turned into a greedy monopolist that charge ten times as much for their software as they used to. You do this, even if installing and even updating Photoshop means that you'll have to watch out not to install anything that takes control over things your OS do better on its own. Even if Adobe runs copyright protection that puts illogical limitations on the use of the software you've bled through the nose to purchase. You use Photoshop, despite all this, because no other single applications offers the same possibilities within a single user interface. Even if you have specialized applications for some tasks, you'll still have Photoshop as your main tool — and if possible, you'll choose additional tools that can be controlled from Photoshop.

You have to realize that there's two different kinds of computer users, even if you keep the plain amateurs out of it:

One, the chosen few who primarely work with computers, and don't see it as an annoyance to fiddle with technical stuff to get absolute control over details.

(This kind of users don't necessarily have the same preferences, by the way. In our context, some use small, one-task music players, while others install complex multimedia servers that need hours of tweaking before they're able to do anything at all, and needs a dedicated computer since they use a lot of processor power and tend to crash regularily.)

Two, the great unwashed, who just want to get things done, and don't give a damn who supply the means, as long as they work.

(Some of us even realize that nothing in this world is free, and that other people, like ourselves, need to get paid for what they do. Thus we pay the costs, whether it's directly when buying software, or indirectly by buying services offered through the software.)

[OFF-TOPIC] From: iTunes 10

Reply #1 –
You keep talking about Photoshop. What exactly does it install that is comparable with what iTunes installs? And how is iTunes comparable with Photoshop in any way?

[OFF-TOPIC] From: iTunes 10

Reply #2 –
Quote from: andy o on
You keep talking about Photoshop. What exactly does it install that is comparable with what iTunes installs? And how is iTunes comparable with Photoshop in any way?

To run Photoshop in Windows, you'll have to install QuickTime. No matter what platform you're on, you'll have to install software that checks if you have a legal copy, and that this copy is not also used on other computers. Photoshop won't run without this. You've got updaters that not only deal with Photoshop, but also other Adobe software, like Acrobat and Flash. If you've got a Mac, you must be very careful to avoid that the installer also installs the Adobe Reader, that will deactivate the built-in PDF support in Safari. If you've got the full Creative Suite, you'll have to cancel this installation every time you open Acrobat. If you install Adobe Reader by mistake, it's a lot of fiddling to get rid of it.

I used Photoshop as an example. But I could just as well have used Microsoft Office. At least if you've got a Mac, it bombs your computer with software that, at the best, offers inferior ways to do simple tasks, at the worse bypass smooth functions in the OS and do things the MS way.

Still, this is software that do what it's supposed to do better than other software. Even if I don't like Microsoft's monopoly, I won't expose myself to the awkwardness of some OpenOffice solution for ideological reasons. Neither can I use a simple text editor for my writing, since it doesn't give me the opportunities for visual formatting that I need.

[OFF-TOPIC] From: iTunes 10

Reply #4 –
Quote from: Hansen on
Neither can I use a simple text editor for my writing,


I am doing exactly that- I haven't used a word processor from a number of years. I keep everything in plain text which I could read 20 years later. This is after being bitten by several binary formats over the years.

Quote from: Hansen on
since it doesn't give me the opportunities for visual formatting that I need.


Oh really? Ever heard of a markup language? In fact one of the most powerful standard publishing system- TeX and its higher level cousin LaTeX is expressed in plain text. I use Org-mode under Emacs these days. I can:

1. Capture things with one key.
2. Have hyperlinks to anything
3. Publish in several formats including LaTeX, pdf, html, etc with full TOC, hyperlinks, graphics, tables, formulae, etc.

[OFF-TOPIC] From: iTunes 10

Reply #5 –
Quote from: cpchan on
I haven't used a word processor from a number of years.

Why doesn't this surprise me?

But you do realize that this is not an alternative for people who live by their writing and have to interact with a multitude of different publishers?

With your approach, you can only interact with publishers who use a system aimed at contributors like you, or editors who have the time and technical skills to deal with stuff like that manually.

I edited and published a magazine for some time. Somewhere along the line (during the big  I got the idea that I should try to keep all contributions in plain text with tags. It was a short experiment, it scared off most of my contributors and tripled my workload...

In short, it's an approach that only works within a technocracy where people have to study and adapt to the technology to be able to function. It's an elite approach; not at all an option if you want technology to be available for everyone.

Again, it's the 'you'll have to be a mechanic to drive a car' approach.

[OFF-TOPIC] From: iTunes 10

Reply #6 –
Can someone explain what option preference I need to to tick to get Itunes to be a word processor?

Or move somewhat back on thread.

thank you

terry

[OFF-TOPIC] From: iTunes 10

Reply #7 –
Quote from: tpijag on
Can someone explain what option preference I need to to tick to get Itunes to be a word processor?

We've just demonstrated that people who claim that a small music player from an independent developer is a better choice than iTunes, also claims that writing plain text with formatting tags is a better choice than Word.

I would say that this is highly relevant for this discussion.

[OFF-TOPIC] From: iTunes 10

Reply #8 –
Quote from: Hansen on
But you do realize that this is not an alternative for people who live by their writing and have to interact with a multitude of different publishers?


You do realize that TeX/LaTeX is one of the standard format in the publishing industry (especially for scientific and mathematical journals)? For those that don't, it is very easy to export to ps/pdf which is widely accepted. I never said that this approach is for everyone.

This is getting horribly off topic.

[OFF-TOPIC] From: iTunes 10

Reply #9 –
Quote from: Hansen on
I would say that this is highly relevant for this discussion.


Of course you would. The sum total of your participation here is expounding upon your ideology as opposed to providing assistance to others.


terry

[OFF-TOPIC] From: iTunes 10

Reply #10 –
Quote from: Hansen on
Quote from: tpijag on
Can someone explain what option preference I need to to tick to get Itunes to be a word processor?

We've just demonstrated that people who claim that a small music player from an independent developer is a better choice than iTunes, also claims that writing plain text with formatting tags is a better choice than Word.

I would say that this is highly relevant for this discussion.


But nobody is going to change anybody's mind here. I personally use tex/latex every day (and spend half my working time writing C, Fortran, Python, Mathematica, and several other languages less frequently), and also use iTunes. I have used Word twice in my life and didn't like it one bit and another word processor solely for a single, infrequently updated document. Then again the publishers I interact with accept (and prefer) latex, so I guess that helps.

So it may work the way you state it but it doesn't work the other way round (which actually supports your point). But I don't really see the benefit to anybody of continuing this discussion further.

At any rate, word processors, pipes, filters, emacs, vi, slime, squeak, tex, latex, xelatex, framemaker, random quotes from Gancarz, photoshop, xcode, the age at which one first programmed a computer and the like seem rather irrelevant to a discussion of iTunes 10.

[OFF-TOPIC] From: iTunes 10

Reply #11 –
Quote from: Kees de Visser on
Quote from: andy o on
Apple updater still tries to trojan-horse Safari and MobileMe by checking them by default when running an update.
FWIW Google includes Chrome when one tries to download Google Earth. The option can be disabled, but is enabled by default.


And Office (on OS X at least) installs a bunch of background stuff that runs to check other copies on the network, checks for updates etc, as do Adobe suites. I guess most big suites do the following. Whether that is reasonable The discussion here, I think, is probably best summarised as "is this reasonable in the case of iTunes?". Personally I'd say no, but it not intrusive in this way on OS X (most of that stuff is in the OS installation already) so I don't personally care, but it evidently irritates people on Windows (and would certainly irritate me just as much as Microsoft and Adobe's stuff, if I was running Win).