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Topic: Unintuitive issues encoding/repairing inacurrate rips (Read 1172 times) previous topic - next topic
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Unintuitive issues encoding/repairing inacurrate rips

I've been acquiring some of my all time favorite albums from used sources. Four of them from a recent lot have a track completely unable to match with CTDB or Accurip. However, I know that this is due to a very small window of time (fraction of a second) where there is audible distortion, in one example, on Track 10 about halfway through, log below:

Code: [Select]
[CUETools log; Date: 9/24/2024 7:43:13 PM; Version: 2.2.6]
Pregap length 00:00:32.
[CTDB TOCID: JJ33QwP9LLcbhRYrueQHFsxxUCU-] found.
Track | CTDB Status
  1   | (1682/1725) Accurately ripped
  2   | (1699/1725) Accurately ripped
  3   | (1704/1725) Accurately ripped
  4   | (1693/1725) Accurately ripped
  5   | (1636/1725) Accurately ripped
  6   | (1698/1725) Accurately ripped
  7   | (1679/1725) Accurately ripped
  8   | (1663/1725) Accurately ripped
  9   | (1678/1725) Accurately ripped
 10   | (  0/1725) No match
 11   | (1648/1725) Accurately ripped
 12   | (1627/1725) Accurately ripped
[AccurateRip ID: 001c34e6-0106d601-ac0ead0c] found.
Track   [  CRC   |   V2   ] Status
 01     [67baafb2|95e502b7] (000+000/985) No match
 02     [9d96c428|e4df1440] (000+000/983) No match
 03     [1979935d|20b22ab6] (000+000/987) No match
 04     [94acb072|9ef5012f] (000+000/983) No match
 05     [ab05dd25|c5700f39] (000+000/985) No match
 06     [fc1e17a1|dc3a5034] (000+000/978) No match
 07     [214beb7b|13346641] (000+000/963) No match
 08     [61314db3|2fb1b129] (000+000/969) No match
 09     [7f56dc3f|44caf933] (000+000/952) No match
 10     [0358a9f9|cb8c4baf] (000+000/937) No match
 11     [4bdd5b8b|a474d803] (000+000/909) No match
 12     [65b9b3f8|24a6a858] (000+000/906) No match
Offsetted by -63:
 01     [86cbcc7f] (019/985) Accurately ripped
 02     [61affc44] (017/983) Accurately ripped
 03     [a06496aa] (016/987) Accurately ripped
 04     [7c861264] (018/983) Accurately ripped
 05     [4a00d6bf] (000/985) No match (V2 was not tested)
 06     [6d4d84ff] (016/978) Accurately ripped
 07     [b9e985b1] (016/963) Accurately ripped
 08     [04c01bae] (017/969) Accurately ripped
 09     [e2f9ea03] (016/952) Accurately ripped
 10     [27c1800e] (000/937) No match (V2 was not tested)
 11     [f0a047c9] (017/909) Accurately ripped
 12     [5d0517d3] (016/906) Accurately ripped
Offsetted by 385:
 01     [e2c3e33f] (007/985) Accurately ripped
 02     [7d6e6d44] (006/983) Accurately ripped
 03     [4e694363] (006/987) Accurately ripped
 04     [fe59e4eb] (006/983) Accurately ripped
 05     [5141043f] (006/985) Accurately ripped
 06     [57d3818b] (005/978) Accurately ripped
 07     [e06d9985] (004/963) Accurately ripped
 08     [5d3a62ee] (004/969) Accurately ripped
 09     [22e67023] (004/952) Accurately ripped
 10     [7a2d54ce] (000/937) No match (V2 was not tested)
 11     [e6c22529] (004/909) Accurately ripped
 12     [4597a713] (004/906) Accurately ripped
Offsetted by 667:
 01     [26f13191] (015/985) Accurately ripped
 02     [0377721c] (015/983) Accurately ripped
 03     [5fce185b] (015/987) Accurately ripped
 04     [d038b2f9] (014/983) Accurately ripped
 05     [713f20e3] (014/985) Accurately ripped
 06     [c717c5f5] (015/978) Accurately ripped
 07     [b2fca33b] (014/963) Accurately ripped
 08     [e2a2c8ec] (014/969) Accurately ripped
 09     [47eb2dec] (014/952) Accurately ripped
 10     [20581070] (000/937) No match (V2 was not tested)
 11     [3a9f9a94] (014/909) Accurately ripped
 12     [6c8f55d1] (014/906) Accurately ripped
Offsetted by 673:
 01     [e707f1df] (111/985) Accurately ripped
 02     [218d6cc4] (108/983) Accurately ripped
 03     [c3894a16] (112/987) Accurately ripped
 04     [18fe37d8] (107/983) Accurately ripped
 05     [c3a1217f] (108/985) Accurately ripped
 06     [0ca710f9] (107/978) Accurately ripped
 07     [96db7ccf] (106/963) Accurately ripped
 08     [4cf6b54e] (108/969) Accurately ripped
 09     [096a9613] (101/952) Accurately ripped
 10     [f84e146e] (000/937) No match (V2 was not tested)
 11     [fe6bd179] (099/909) Accurately ripped
 12     [6d639573] (096/906) Accurately ripped
Offsetted by 695:
 01     [fcb0b2fd] (162/985) Accurately ripped
 02     [e533592c] (153/983) Accurately ripped
 03     [11f70e76] (159/987) Accurately ripped
 04     [79297622] (158/983) Accurately ripped
 05     [f1b323bb] (159/985) Accurately ripped
 06     [d81731bc] (156/978) Accurately ripped
 07     [366940d4] (152/963) Accurately ripped
 08     [282a6d60] (155/969) Accurately ripped
 09     [2309bd6e] (152/952) Accurately ripped
 10     [657ecdbc] (000/937) No match (V2 was not tested)
 11     [22e1f14a] (141/909) Accurately ripped
 12     [1b187ec5] (138/906) Accurately ripped
Offsetted by 714:
 01     [b24e13f4] (117/985) Accurately ripped
 02     [99ce4840] (122/983) Accurately ripped
 03     [0162fb98] (119/987) Accurately ripped
 04     [3752736d] (121/983) Accurately ripped
 05     [f69425a9] (119/985) Accurately ripped
 06     [3d1efa15] (116/978) Accurately ripped
 07     [69ae93f7] (119/963) Accurately ripped
 08     [ce342f41] (117/969) Accurately ripped
 09     [da8daf5a] (115/952) Accurately ripped
 10     [66b4850b] (000/937) No match (V2 was not tested)
 11     [e6cd7704] (110/909) Accurately ripped
 12     [c8634846] (106/906) Accurately ripped

Track Peak [ CRC32  ] [W/O NULL] 
 --   99.9 [BCBDB0B3] [CBDBE7EE]           
 01   99.9 [2597C40A] [CF69C7CA]           
 02   99.9 [B80DE4AC] [1306D669]           
 03   99.9 [C85FE363] [7F6C972F]           
 04   99.9 [3F7CACFE] [B740502F]           
 05   99.9 [21B208BA] [809AC912]           
 06   99.9 [21F88F97] [7678AD03]           
 07   99.9 [D2540219] [0017E78A]           
 08   99.9 [8086D810] [B4574D83]           
 09   99.9 [0C7F4BD1] [86FA9378]           
 10   99.9 [FBB40628] [B90CBFEE]           
 11   99.9 [C62E6983] [A688BD78]           
 12   99.9 [C2C3EE90] [3E8BE2FA]          

In only one of the albums with issues I am able to select from a list of sources to fix, and it actually fixed and allowed me to encode it to flac. In this example, nothing comes up even though there are clearly matches based on the other tracks. Is this by design, am I doing something wrong, or is this an oversight?

thx

Re: Unintuitive issues encoding/repairing inacurrate rips

Reply #1 –
The track is "too destroyed". The database doesn't have playable audio, it has a repair record that is big enough to correct a small number of frames being wrong.
There might be more wrong data than just the "unlistenable". You might try to re-rip using a different drive (and CUERipper?) and hope to get lucky.

Re: Unintuitive issues encoding/repairing inacurrate rips

Reply #2 –
What @Porcus said.
When interpreting the log:
If one or more tracks show "No match" in the CTDB 'individual tracks' section, there are too many samples that differ. Repair is not possible.
If one or more tracks show "Differs in ..." in the CTDB 'individual tracks' section, repair may be possible.
korth

Re: Unintuitive issues encoding/repairing inacurrate rips

Reply #3 –
Quote
However, I know that this is due to a very small window of time (fraction of a second) where there is audible distortion, in one example, on Track 10 about halfway through, log below:
I have more than one computer and a couple of portable CD readers so the 1st thing I try is a different CD reader.

When there is no audible defect I ignore it and it doesn't take long for me to forget which CDs or tracks were "bad".

Sometimes the track can be audibly "repaired" with Audacity, or I have a couple of applications for cleaning-up digitized vinyl and they can usually do a good job with short-duration clicks.  Of course the data is still imperfect.    Sometimes after fixing-up the audio I've burned a new copy.    Of course it will fail AccurateRip but it will play OK and it can be ripped.

Sometimes the CD will sound OK when played on a CD player or with player software.    CD players tend to be better at error-hiding and "error correction" than ripping applications.  In that case you can make a digital-to-analog-to-digital recording.    Again, not digitally-perfect but it can be perfect sounding.    Audacity has the ability to record  whatever is playing on your computer.  There is a ripper called Audiograbber that has (or had)  "analog" ripping built-in.   But I think it's now adware and I'm not sure if it's "safe" to install.

On a couple of occasions I've purchased an MP3 from Amazon.   Of course it's lossy but there are generally no audible defects.   And if there are audible compression artifacts they won't be as bad as a defect that's bothering you.

Or you can acquire another new or used copy of the CD.

Or, if you don't like the song or don't care about it, you can delete it!   I did that once on a compilation CD that was totally fouled-up...   It was a new CD from some flakey manufacturer and the songs on the CD didn't exactly match the songs listed on the back of the case.     I kept the good songs and returned the CD for a refund.

Re: Unintuitive issues encoding/repairing inacurrate rips

Reply #4 –
Quote from: DVDdoug on
Or, if you don't like the song or don't care about it, you can delete it!   I did that once on a compilation CD that was totally fouled-up...   It was a new CD from some flakey manufacturer and the songs on the CD didn't exactly match the songs listed on the back of the case.     I kept the good songs and returned the CD for a refund.
And that's how you rid yourself of a valuable collector's item that could get you big $$s?  ;D

There are a few such I guess ... but when CDs became too common and cheap to produce, quality control went down and mishaps became more frequent. Easier and cheaper to just replace a wrong one.
A mispressed CD isn't exactly like mis-stamped coins or wrongly cut banknotes.

Re: Unintuitive issues encoding/repairing inacurrate rips

Reply #5 –
Quote from: Porcus on
The track is "too destroyed". The database doesn't have playable audio, it has a repair record that is big enough to correct a small number of frames being wrong.
There might be more wrong data than just the "unlistenable". You might try to re-rip using a different drive (and CUERipper?) and hope to get lucky.
Quote from: korth on
What @Porcus said.
When interpreting the log:
If one or more tracks show "No match" in the CTDB 'individual tracks' section, there are too many samples that differ. Repair is not possible.
If one or more tracks show "Differs in ..." in the CTDB 'individual tracks' section, repair may be possible.

So I understand that the data is too far gone, but am I hearing right that "differs in" doesn't just mean I have a different pressing, but that the "/1725" are actually sectors and not other confirmed rips? I was thinking the "1682/1725", for instance, was that it matched 1682 of 1725 other uploads basically.

My goal is archival/long-term preservation, so just ignoring it isn't really a good option here. I'd just have to find a different disc. (some of these are over 30 years old)
 

Re: Unintuitive issues encoding/repairing inacurrate rips

Reply #6 –
Did you review the link? There's an example and definitions.

New example:
Code: [Select]
8 (1682/1725) differs in 78 samples @
means out of a total of 1725 rips of Track 8, 1682 of them differ from your rip by 78 samples.
korth