Ogg Vorbis GT3 beta 1

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Ogg Vorbis GT3 beta 1

Reply #150 – 2003-05-25 14:26:23

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I think quantumknot has noticed that there is a considerable difference before q5 (i.e. at q4.5) and so, is enquiring as to whether Garf's tuned transient detection is the cause of the increase in bit usage.

Is this opposed to what I've written? NO, it isn't. And it is quite clear that Garf's tuning must also have affected these bitrates. Otherwise there must be a gap somewhere between the ancien q5 @ 160kbps and the gt3 q5 @ 180kbps.

Ogg Vorbis GT3 beta 1

Reply #151 – 2003-05-26 08:22:06

This is probably already explained somewhere on the past 7 pages, but...

At quality setting 4.5, the encoder encodes with a setting 'halfway' between -q4 and -q5. Since -q5 is changed, -q4.5 will also be different.

Ogg Vorbis GT3 beta 1

Reply #152 – 2003-05-26 12:50:04

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This is probably already explained somewhere on the past 7 pages, but...

At quality setting 4.5, the encoder encodes with a setting 'halfway' between -q4 and -q5. Since -q5 is changed, -q4.5 will also be different.

So does that suggest that though -q4.5 is not "tuned", it generally does better with transients than -q4.5 on the Xiph.org oggenc?

Ogg Vorbis GT3 beta 1

Reply #153 – 2003-05-26 14:45:21

Yes (and it will eat more bits than standard -q4.5 too)

Ogg Vorbis GT3 beta 1

Reply #154 – 2003-06-01 19:41:45

Greetings.

First of all I'd like to thank all developers involved for their work (DSPguru, Garf, rjamorim, Xiph team).

Ogg Vorbis GT3b1 binaries were released on rjamorim's site on 2003-05-20, so I would like to know if anyone noticed any problem (quality mainly) in using BeSweet with GT3b1 dlls. I've made it work, didn't noticed anything bad, but I'm not sure if it fits DVD audio transcoding better than CVS 1.0.

I know that GT3b1 is better tunned for higher bitrates, but I'm not sure if it is as good as CVS 1.0 was with low bitrates (64-128kbps).

So please post your experiences, suggestions or comments here.

Best regards.

Ogg Vorbis GT3 beta 1

Reply #155 – 2003-06-01 20:21:14

I would use standard Vorbis 1.0 for bitrates in the 64-128 range.

Ogg Vorbis GT3 beta 1

Reply #156 – 2003-06-02 09:33:29

@Garf:

Thank you for replying. But my situation is a little bit difficuilt.

I usually make movies with two soundtracks (the first one from 5.1 AC3 and the second one usually from 2.0 AC3 - different language, of course). So I choose 192kbps for 5.1 AC3 downmixing because of preserving DS2 information and lossless channel coupling and 128 for 2.0 AC3, just because it is originally 192kbps and contains only stereo.

So should I use GT3b1 for 192kbps and 1.0 for 128kbps?

What do you recommend?

Ogg Vorbis GT3 beta 1

Reply #157 – 2003-06-02 09:51:53

Lossless channel coupling in GT3b1 is a bit more conservative, you can try if a lower level still works with the Dolby stuff.

I don't think it matters much for movie soundtracks which encoder you use.

Ogg Vorbis GT3 beta 1

Reply #158 – 2003-06-02 10:43:24

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So I choose 192kbps for 5.1 AC3 downmixing because of preserving DS2 information and lossless channel coupling and 128 for 2.0 AC3, just because it is originally 192kbps and contains only stereo.

I don't know what your ultimate playback situation is, but couldn't you encode the 5.1 into 6 channel vorbis?

edit: I understand the format supports this, but don't know details of how to do it

Ogg Vorbis GT3 beta 1

Reply #159 – 2003-06-03 10:51:22

@DonP:

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I don't know what your ultimate playback situation is, but couldn't you encode the 5.1 into 6 channel vorbis?

Of course I can, but AFAIK there is problem with Ogg Vorbis DS filter from Tobias.

Ogg Vorbis GT3 beta 1

Reply #160 – 2003-06-27 14:07:13

Hi,

Is there a GT3 beta 1 "vorbis.dll" that i can use for Programms like headac3he ?

Thx

Ciao

n_J

Ogg Vorbis GT3 beta 1

Reply #161 – 2003-06-27 14:17:13

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Hi,

Is there a GT3 beta 1 "vorbis.dll" that i can use for Programms like headac3he ?

Thx

Ciao

n_J

Yes, there is. IIRC, you need the libVorbis.dll? You'll find a GT3b1 version at the Rarewares/Ogg Vorbis page.

Ogg Vorbis GT3 beta 1

Reply #162 – 2003-06-27 19:01:53

Hi,

Thx for answer.

No it dont work. headac3he needs the vorbis.dll,not the libvorbis.dll

Ciao

Ogg Vorbis GT3 beta 1

Reply #163 – 2003-06-27 22:47:53

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Hi,

Thx for answer.

No it dont work. headac3he needs the vorbis.dll,not the libvorbis.dll

Ciao

My mistake! I forgot that Dark Avenger uses his own version of the old vorbis.dll that was used with pre-1.5 CDex. I used to have the source for that but I can't find it now!! I'll mail him and see if he'll send me the source to do a GT3b1 compile.

Ogg Vorbis GT3 beta 1

Reply #164 – 2003-06-28 11:21:54

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Hi,

Thx for answer.

No it dont work. headac3he needs the vorbis.dll,not the libvorbis.dll

Ciao

OK, I have the source. I am afraid you'll have to wait until tomorrow for the compile, but I will have it done then. Sorry!! I'm going out in a minute and won't be back until tomorrow.

Ogg Vorbis GT3 beta 1

Reply #165 – 2003-06-28 22:09:46

Hey that Sounds good

Thx for Help.

Ogg Vorbis GT3 beta 1

Reply #166 – 2003-06-29 15:28:48

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Hey that Sounds good

Thx for Help.

New GT3b1 compile of vorbis.dll for HeadAC3he now available at Rarewares/Ogg Vorbis page.

Ogg Vorbis GT3 beta 1

Reply #167 – 2003-06-29 17:07:44

It works Super.

Good Work john33 B)

And now i Hope DarkAvanger build a New version of HeadAc3he

Ogg Vorbis GT3 beta 1

Reply #168 – 2003-07-22 23:58:13

Just found a bug in GT3 b1, or more in "Floggy"-Vorbis (q -2). It works perfect for stereo, but not for mono. There are very strange pops and other strange disortions. Because the file is so small I uploaded it completly: ede_q-2_mono.ogg (129KB)
The first, very load, strange through all frequences tone is at 0:38,2 with a duration of ca. 200ms. Then at 2:14 and 2:15,2 there are 2 very noticeable drop-outs (very short time silence). Then at 2:18,2 there is a other strange noise. From 2:23,4 to 2:26,1 there are 4 strange tones similar to the one at 0:38,2.
Another strange sound is at 2:57,6 simlar to the one at 2:18,2 and at 3:02,7 there is again one of those very ugly, load tones. The same file, not downmixed to mono is perfect and doesn´t contain any of the bugs descriped.
Also I don´t think that matter: source file: 44100Hz; Stereo; PCM IEEE-float 32Bit.
Command line: oggencgt3b1 -q -2 --resample 6000 --downmix
That also happens with mono/8kHz.

Ogg Vorbis GT3 beta 1

Reply #169 – 2003-07-23 01:24:07

Thanks for your work GARF.

Really good codec, waiting for the stable version.

Ogg Vorbis GT3 beta 1

Reply #170 – 2003-07-23 20:36:24

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Thanks for your work GARF.

Really good codec, waiting for the stable version.

Read this thread and start waiting!

Ogg Vorbis GT3 beta 1

Reply #171 – 2003-07-23 21:26:23

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Just found a bug in GT3 b1, or more in "Floggy"-Vorbis (q -2).

Floggy is completely unfinished and has all kind of bugs, don't bother reporting them.

Ogg Vorbis GT3 beta 1

Reply #172 – 2003-07-24 04:45:16

This isn't a bug but I found a song that seems particularly difficult/large to encode using GT3b1. I tested it with the regular version of Ogg as well as Lame at both the Alt-preset-standard and Alt-preset-extreme settings to compare, and here are the results:

Melotron - Weltfrieden - 04 - Wir Sind !!! (LAMEDrop XPD 1.3.2 Using LAME 3.90.3)(Extreme).mp3 6,599kb (268kbps)

Melotron - Weltfrieden - 04 - Wir Sind !!! (LAMEDrop XPD 1.3.2 Using LAME 3.90.3)(Standard).mp3 6,192kb (252kbps)

Melotron - Weltfrieden - 04 - Wir Sind !!! (OggDropXPd V1.7 GT3b1)(q-5).ogg 7,805kb (317kbps)

Melotron - Weltfrieden - 04 - Wir Sind !!! (OggDropXPd V1.7 Post 1.0 CVS)(q-5).ogg 4,888kb (198kbps)

Melotron - Weltfrieden - 04 - Wir Sind !!!.wav 34,697kb

As you can see not only does the overall bitrate seem pretty excessive for q-5, the difference between 1.0 and GT3b1 is quite abnormal. The .wav is from a good rip off a brand new cd and when I saw what happened after encoding my eyes bugged a bit. I can't do any ABXing myself since I have hearing problems with one ear. When I get my stereo set back up in a few weeks I'll get a buddy over to test it and see if he can detect any difference between them. Not sure if this is of any interest to you guys, feel free to tell me if you think it's a waste of time to bring attention to it.
-Stephen

Ogg Vorbis GT3 beta 1

Reply #173 – 2003-08-16 00:31:23

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Melotron - Weltfrieden - 04 - Wir Sind !!! (OggDropXPd V1.7 GT3b1)(q-5).ogg 7,805kb (317kbps)

Thats nothing!!!!!! "Base Metal" by Download has an average bitrate of [span style='font-size:21pt;line-height:100%']345kbit[/span] when encoded with GT3b1 at -q5.

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