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Topic: vinyl 2 digital HF roll-out  (Read 827 times) previous topic - next topic
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vinyl 2 digital HF roll-out

Hi guys, sorry if this was already answered, but I did a narrow search of the forum and found no threads concerning this matter^


I recently did some rips of my vinyls and noticed that high frequency roll out is much more audible on some rips than the other. i suppose, that in case of better sounding ones, some measures were taken to compensate for high frequency roll-out, whilst the others were overlooked. I was wondering, if any of you could give me a tip on what frequencies to add or filters to apply, to correct the sound at the end of the records. Perhaps there already is some tool to do that in complex. I mean, if studios can make the vinyl sound more or less flat all the way through, there must be something a casual listener can do, right? Riiiight?…;)


cheers!

Re: vinyl 2 digital HF roll-out

Reply #1
You'll just have to adjust it by ear.   It's helpful to have a known-good reference recording to compare to.   That can be a digital recording but it should be in the same (or similar) genre).   You probably can't exactly match the sound but it's good to "keep you're ears calibrated" and to keep from getting carried away and over-doing it.

There is an effect called an "exciter" (among other names) that generates higher frequency harmonics rather than simply boosting what's there.   I'm not saying that's better than EQ.   It's just something else to try.    I've used it before but I don't remember using it on vinyl.   I usually just boost the highs with EQ.  (If you have Audacity it's an optional plug-in called a "Harmonic Enhancer")

Quote
i suppose, that in case of better sounding ones, some measures were taken to compensate for high frequency roll-out, whilst the others were overlooked.  
Did you digitize them yourself or did you download them.   There's no way of knowing what someone else did and a different phono cartridges will have different frequency responses.

A lot of older records had rolled-off highs, especially the older recordings.  The good ones were rare.     The rumor was that classical records were better, but I didn't listen to classical.   They were getting better toward the end of the vinyl era and I assume modern records are better and more consistent but I haven't bought any records since I got my 1st CD player.   The recordings from the 60's & 70's were pretty good even though they were analog.  (You can tell from the CD versions.)

Re: vinyl 2 digital HF roll-out

Reply #2
hi!
my friend did the recording as he has better equipment, but these vinyls are mine and i can clearly hear the same curve on vinyls on my equipment too. also, low quality rips i was able to find on the have the same issue, i guess its just something that wasnt accounted for during mastering process for that particular vinyl. as for digital versions, sadly there are none, if there were, i wouldn't be going for vinyl in the first place;) i, like you, prefer digital sound, but in this case, there is only vinyl. the record itself is from 2004. so im guessing, its just an error on sound engineer's part, not adding that additional psssts toward the end))
anyway, thx for the answer! ill do it by ear, and definitely try that exciter thing!
cheers!

Re: vinyl 2 digital HF roll-out

Reply #3
I remember reading somewhere that the slower songs, with not so much high frequency content, were put at the end of the sides because vinyl speed there is much slower and the high frequencies sounded worse because of that. If that is the case, you should adjust HF range to your liking.
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Re: vinyl 2 digital HF roll-out

Reply #4
nope, thats the opposite, as a matter of fact)) a single track on a side, 33rpm, 7.5 minutes (distance between grooves nearing .5 millimeter). the decay of hf becomes audible from 1/4 of the record and worsens more or less evenly through the course. so rather than adjusting the highs to my taste is the problem of making it sound flat all the way through

Re: vinyl 2 digital HF roll-out

Reply #5
OK - so you'll need to gradually enhance the high frequencies throughout the whole recording, How, that I don't know.
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Re: vinyl 2 digital HF roll-out

Reply #6
Quote
OK - so you'll need to gradually enhance the high frequencies throughout the whole recording, How, that I don't know.
I've never heard of anybody doing that and I never noticed loss of high frequencies at the inner grooves.   "Good sounding" records usually sound good all the way through.

The BIG limitation of records is NOISE which usually can be improved with digital processing but not to "digital quality".    Then, limited-inconsistent frequency response which can be fixed with EQ, and sometimes audible distortion which can't be fixed.  

I'm pretty sure records are capable of 20kHz to the center grooves...   There was a quadraphonic standard that used an ultrasonic carrier frequency.   It required a special stylus but it did work.

The slower linear-speed does affect quality but the usual complaint is "inner groove distortion".     Of course, they try to put the best songs & the hits at the beginning.    And, I think they put the quieter and "easier" tracks at the end.

Re: vinyl 2 digital HF roll-out

Reply #7
https://youtu.be/1TKaQJM6ZE4
clearly audible decay. even after youtube compression. must be an error on sound engineers behalf.