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Topic: how to create non-embedded cue for flac with foobar2000? (Read 2139 times) previous topic - next topic
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how to create non-embedded cue for flac with foobar2000?

hey,

my dap does not eat embedded cue, i need them in a seperate file.
the only way i have found for foobar to create cue, is to convert to multifle wave, then reconvert to flac, then rename the cue, the eddit the cue so it points to the flac. thats really annoying. is there a faster way?
i tried to google it but the solution i found (cuetools) does not work for many of my files because cuetools apparently is easily offended and outright refuses to create cue sheets for files with a higher resolution then 16bit/44.1khz.

help was appriciated. i have a lot of flacs, but while my dap has a very generous memory size, it does not like to many files.

Re: how to create non-embedded cue for flac with foobar2000?

Reply #1
No, CueTools isn't "easily offended", it's just not made to handle anything beyond CD quality (as cue sheets are a CD thing to begin with). And it's also not meant to work with anything less (or more) than complete CD releases (aka if said file collection exceeds 80 minutes).
Foobar2k is pretty much your only option here, it's also the only one that can even make any hi-res files you have into internal cue sheet image files. So the way that you're using now is effectively the only way.
You can however make it such that the file extension is the only thing you have to change within the cue sheet.

Re: how to create non-embedded cue for flac with foobar2000?

Reply #2
You don't have to go by way of .wav?
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Re: how to create non-embedded cue for flac with foobar2000?

Reply #3
You don't have to go by way of .wav?
i have to if i want a cue. if i just convert to a single file flac, foobar will not write an external cue but only an integrated one which my player cant read.

Quote
You can however make it such that the file extension is the only thing you have to change within the cue sheet.
this is what i am doing. however, exept i also have to rename it because foobar will write the extension xxx.wav.cue where i would need xxx.cue or xxx.flac.cue  - it was really a lot more convinient if foobar had the option to write an external cue with flac too. now, obviously i can accept the answer that foobar can not do this. however, i feel like this is something the tool could be improved on.

Re: how to create non-embedded cue for flac with foobar2000?

Reply #4
No, CueTools isn't "easily offended", it's just not made to handle anything beyond CD quality (as cue sheets are a CD thing to begin with). And it's also not meant to work with anything less (or more) than complete CD releases (aka if said file collection exceeds 80 minutes).
yeah well. i can accept that, but i dont think i have to accept this as a smart or reasonable solution. its not as if its still 1986 and redbook is the best and only thing we have. the tool refusing even to write the cue especially strikes me as arbitrary. it would not even have to transcode anything for that and not even be able to handle the file itself. it just had to read the metadata. but whatever.

Re: how to create non-embedded cue for flac with foobar2000?

Reply #5
You should be able to export the FLAC CUESHEET tag to a text file using MP3TAG
You could add CUESHEET to the tag panel. (to check if the tag exists or later remove contents only, otherwise this step isn't really necessary)



Load and highlight the FLAC file.
Ctrl+E (File > Export)



You would need an export configuration for the cuesheet. The text I used was
Code: [Select]
$filename(txt,utf-8)$loop(%_path%)%cuesheet%
$loopend()
I only tested this with a 16bit/44.1khz FLAC file with embedded CUESHEET tag.
korth


Re: how to create non-embedded cue for flac with foobar2000?

Reply #7
Can I just establish your starting point? I'm unsure whether you have a single flac file that contains a single CUESHEET tag or have them split into tracks, with or without CUESHEET tags?

If it's a single flac file then you can easily copy and paste the CUESHEET tag into a text file to produce the .cue, so am I to assume you want to do this across a number of albums at once?

CUETools is primarily for verifying CD rips (and the conversion thereof) so doesn't care for "HD" material.

Re: how to create non-embedded cue for flac with foobar2000?

Reply #8
Can I just establish your starting point? I'm unsure whether you have a single flac file that contains a single CUESHEET tag or have them split into tracks, with or without CUESHEET tags?

If it's a single flac file then you can easily copy and paste the CUESHEET tag into a text file to produce the .cue, so am I to assume you want to do this across a number of albums at once?

CUETools is primarily for verifying CD rips (and the conversion thereof) so doesn't care for "HD" material.
starting point are flacs in seperate fliles per track that i want to merge into a multifile flac with cue. it was nice to be able to do a batch run on multiple albums, but one album at a time without having to do multiple transcodes, and edit and rename a file or use multiple programs already was a huge improvement.

some of the albums are hd, most are not (like if i can i get a 48khz version, but only if  it comes from a native hd source. i also do not have the dillusion of being able to tell the difference. its mostly for flexibilty - the same reason i prefer flac. not because i think they sound better, but because i can transcode them without quality loss.

Re: how to create non-embedded cue for flac with foobar2000?

Reply #9
starting point are flacs in seperate fliles per track that i want to merge into a multifile flac with cue.
Starting point is not .flac with embedded cuesheet - but one flac per track and no accompanying .cue file?

I haven't used shntools for this, but I've seen it recommended. shntool join -n -o flac *.flac or something?
(I don't know if it will preserve tagging.)
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Re: how to create non-embedded cue for flac with foobar2000?

Reply #10
Starting point is not .flac with embedded cuesheet - but one flac per track and no accompanying .cue file?
some have a cue, some dont. the flac files all are tagged appropriately though (this is why creating a wav + cue with foobar gets useable results in the first place).

tested shn tools. it creates a cue when merging files, but the cue will only contain a single entry. cue will also always point to *.wav regardless of file format used. (so even if there was an input error and it was possible to write correct entries for each file, i still had to edit the cue to fix it which is the same step i now want to avoid in foobar)

Re: how to create non-embedded cue for flac with foobar2000?

Reply #11
https://notepad-plus-plus.org/ to replace Windows' notepad.
You can open all .cue files and replace all every occurrence of .wav" WAVE with .flac" WAVE in all open files at once.
High Voltage socket-nose-avatar

Re: how to create non-embedded cue for flac with foobar2000?

Reply #12
yes. this would help somewhat. still: i have the transcode to wav, and the renaming. yeah, i guess i could use a batchrenamer for that as well.
hum. it really was so much more easy if there was a transcoder which just could write internal tags and a cue sheet for multifile flacs in one step XD

aaanyway. untill somebody knows a plugin or a tool that can do that, i guess ill just go on as i where. thanks tho ♥

Re: how to create non-embedded cue for flac with foobar2000?

Reply #13
I used foobar 'Convert' to create one .flac file from multiple, using 'Generate multi-track files' with an output format of flac.
If I then open the .flac file in foobar, and right click 'Utilities > Edit cuesheet' (hold shift whilst right clicking if it's not available) and it shows me the cuesheet; can you not just copy and paste that into a .cue file (Unfortunately you still have to change 'CDImage.wav' and 'WAVE') but there's no other intermediate steps.

Having said that, is your intention to create a copy of your music just for the DAP, as this format is much less compatible than individual flac files, and you may be creating a bigger problem for yourself down the road? I split to individual flac files and only create a CUE if one is needed to have the album verify with CUETools e.g. if the album contains a pregap, data track e.t.c.

I know you said your DAP "does not like too many files", but I don't really know what that means, is it from a storage or indexing perspective? How does the DAP handle individual flac files with a CUE sheet to bring them together?

Re: how to create non-embedded cue for flac with foobar2000?

Reply #14
Creating single cue files from single files in foobar often shifts the start of the tracks to the nearest point a CD frame would start because of the cue format limit.
Recreating the exact single file source is not possible. Just saying.
Is troll-adiposity coming from feederism?
With 24bit music you can listen to silence much louder!

Re: how to create non-embedded cue for flac with foobar2000?

Reply #15
I used foobar 'Convert' to create one .flac file from multiple, using 'Generate multi-track files' with an output format of flac.
If I then open the .flac file in foobar, and right click 'Utilities > Edit cuesheet' (hold shift whilst right clicking if it's not available)

i love you now! i did not know there where hidden options, this might safe me a transcode which is already a huge improvement

edit: this works but... i have to create a new file, copy the text, insert the text, copy the name of the flac, replace the part where the file name has to go, rename the file. after all this actually seems more work then just double transcode, especially as transcoding to wav is so fast. very best its just as much work. if only this edit cuesheet function had the option to actually export the cue sheet.

Creating single cue files from single files in foobar often shifts the start of the tracks to the nearest point a CD frame would start because of the cue format limit.
Recreating the exact single file source is not possible. Just saying.
yeah but i am not creating a new cue file - i extract the cue file that was created along the file.

edit: tested it with a gapless transition and it seems to sync perfectly.

Having said that, is your intention to create a copy of your music just for the DAP, as this format is much less compatible than individual flac files, and you may be creating a bigger problem for yourself down the road?
maybe - probably not though. almost all modern dap understand cue + flac now, and i can always transcode without loss - this is the main reason i keep flac in the first place.
my players db has a stupid file limit of 20000 tracks but can handle 2tb of memory. so this is my appoach to safe file limits. but tbh: i dont even know if this works. could very well be that a multifile flac still counts as much as individual files for this limit.
in any case: i also find it more convinient to handle, especially for certain multi-cd albums i own (looking at you siegfried) 

Re: how to create non-embedded cue for flac with foobar2000?

Reply #16
If you have a fishy player ... have you tried how it works with other formats than FLAC? (Can it handle Matroska?)

Next question coming up: How many FLAC albums do you have, that aren't CDDA? CUETools will handle the CDDA for you.
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Re: how to create non-embedded cue for flac with foobar2000?

Reply #17
my players db has a stupid file limit of 20000 tracks but can handle 2tb of memory

:) :) :) which player is that, so others can avoid it?
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Re: how to create non-embedded cue for flac with foobar2000?

Reply #18
edit: this works but... i have to create a new file, copy the text, insert the text, copy the name of the flac, replace the part where the file name has to go, rename the file. after all this actually seems more work then just double transcode, especially as transcoding to wav is so fast. very best its just as much work. if only this edit cuesheet function had the option to actually export the cue sheet.
You could use foo_run with
Code: [Select]
"C:\Windows\sysnative\cmd.exe" /c nul > "$directory_path(%path%)\%filename%.cue"
to create the empty, correctly named cue sheet for you, but I can't see any way of addressing the tag CUESHEET, so I'm unable to modify it (to replace CDImage.wav) or to write it out to the CUE sheet. Anyone else have any ideas?


Having said that, is your intention to create a copy of your music just for the DAP, as this format is much less compatible than individual flac files, and you may be creating a bigger problem for yourself down the road?
maybe - probably not though. almost all modern dap understand cue + flac now, and i can always transcode without loss - this is the main reason i keep flac in the first place.
I was thinking the DAP would be the exception to your listening habits and home streaming would be the norm, which is where you'd struggle with single flac files e.g DLNA, Roon e.t.c.


my players db has a stupid file limit of 20000 tracks but can handle 2tb of memory. so this is my appoach to safe file limits. but tbh: i dont even know if this works. could very well be that a multifile flac still counts as much as individual files for this limit.
I would imagine it's a metadata size limit (like Sonos has) so anything you do to reduce what it needs to store will help, be it tags, filenames, paths e.t.c.

Re: how to create non-embedded cue for flac with foobar2000?

Reply #19
If the limit is on metadata size, then you can have the full tags in a file and/or ADS and/or database using https://www.foobar2000.org/components/view/foo_external_tags , and keep a minimum in the tagging block.
Also, if it helps to remove embedded artwork, then consider to export album cover to folder.jpeg or something and delete from files.


On a different note: it seems to me that when fb2k converts FLACs to single FLAC with embedded cuesheet, it does not use the CUESHEET block?
(I tried metaflac's export cuesheet function.)


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Re: how to create non-embedded cue for flac with foobar2000?

Reply #21
On a different note: it seems to me that when fb2k converts FLACs to single FLAC with embedded cuesheet, it does not use the CUESHEET block?
METADATA_BLOCK_CUESHEET doesn't support metadata (such as track title or track artist) so it's mostly useless.

Re: how to create non-embedded cue for flac with foobar2000?

Reply #22
which player is that, so others can avoid it?
its a hiby r3 pro sabre.
sadly, the perfect dap does not seeem to exist anymore, but this player is what i had identified as the best compromize for me at this time. it has a few short commings, but it also does a lot of things very well.

You could use foo_run with...
interesting, i will take a look at foo_run.

I would imagine it's a metadata size limit (like Sonos has) so anything you do to reduce what it needs to store will help, be it tags, filenames, paths e.t.c.
apparently its really only a file limit, and in my testings multi-file flac + cue indeed only contributes with 2 files toward this limit regardless of how many entries it actually contains.
i agree  that this does not seem to make much sense from a technical point. if anything the size of the database created should impose a limitation based on the hardware specs. but apparently this is not the case. indeed it seems to be able to handle much larger databases then 20000 entries.
i think this 20000 file limit is there simply to destinguish it from the larger products. which of course is a stupid thing to do, but at the same  time, i dont really care too much as its easy to overcome this limitation.

If you have a fishy player ... have you tried how it works with other formats than FLAC? (Can it handle Matroska?)

Next question coming up: How many FLAC albums do you have, that aren't CDDA? CUETools will handle the CDDA for you.

true, most of my albums are not hd. however, a lot of them are multi-disk albums and i always retag them so they make for one album in my databases. as i see it it really makes no sense anymore to  "change cd" on a dap XD
cuetools doesnt like this.

fishy player? dont know what you mean. i think its pretty nice over all.  i dont know if it plays mkv. according to product description it supports "most Hi-Res lossless formats, including FLAC, APE, WMA, WAV, AIFF, DSD IOS, DFF and OGG. Native support for DSD256, PCM up to 384Khz/32bit"

Re: how to create non-embedded cue for flac with foobar2000?

Reply #23
true, most of my albums are not hd. however, a lot of them are multi-disk albums and i always retag them so they make for one album in my databases. as i see it it really makes no sense anymore to  "change cd" on a dap XD
cuetools doesnt like this.
Given CUETools just needs CD's to be uniquely identified (tracks to be grouped by DISCNUMBER) and track orders to be in sequence, I assume you're saying that you're tagging multi-disk albums as a single disc? It's not just CUETools that doesn't like that, it's ALL tagging programs too! I know you're prepared to compromise for this DAP, but you're really putting all your eggs in one basket here, so I would seriously consider keeping a correctly tagged master copy of your music with one file per track should you ever want to use it for anything other than this DAP.


You could use foo_run with...
interesting, i will take a look at foo_run.
If you had wsl installed you could have run something like the following to extract the cuesheet and write the cue file for you.
Code: [Select]
metaflac --show-tag CUESHEET --no-utf8-convert 'path_to_converted_image/image_name.flac' | sed 's/cuesheet=//;s/CDImage\.wav/nameofflacfile.flac/' > 'path_to_converted_image/nameofflacfile.cue'
I hate Windows scripting, but I've never tried powershell so if I get a bit of free time later I'll try and convert it so it'll run natively under Windows, then you'll just need to run the Convert step in foobar and then run the foo_run step - which you can obviously assign a shortcut key to so you don't need to navigate the menu system :-)

Re: how to create non-embedded cue for flac with foobar2000?

Reply #24
you're saying that you're tagging multi-disk albums as a single disc? It's not just CUETools that doesn't like that, it's ALL tagging programs too!
i have not run into any issues doing this since... 2003? well ok: tbh i am running into issues now XD.

in any case this is what i have now, it would be a lot of work to change the tags back to reassemble a tag structure dictated by a dead format. plus: many of my albums where released as vinyl first - would you also argue i keep the disc structure of the lp then? cd never did that...
and anyway, i really want to keep the tags as they are now. i think its much more convinient this way and i gain nothing from the knowledge that once the tracks where released on multiple cd while the chance i ever burn the files on cd are about as high as me recording them on a  casette.

If you had wsl installed you could have run something like the following...
on windows i think | has to be replaced by > and / by \ but yes it should work somehow. not sure how to get the data from the flac on windows tho, but writing the data to the cue should be easy.
tho: i doubt typing the command into the shell is less work then renaming and fixing the cue. most of it can be copy pasted, but file names still had to be fixed.
edit: nvm, wildcards should do the trick.