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Topic: Chronflow (Read 478567 times) previous topic - next topic
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Chronflow

Reply #75
You guys are aware that you can host WPF content in a Win32 window, right? CoverFlow has already been implemented in WPF, it's very easy.

Someone should just write a generic WPF content host that can host any WPF UIElement class. Want a new kind of panel? Write it in WPF and host it with the plugin. You could even implement an ADO.NET data source for databinding.

Once that's done, you could very easily write a new WPF GUI for foobar2000.

Chronflow

Reply #76
Sorry to say, but I'm getting really tired to hear complains from people who think developers have to dedicate all their life and soul for the benefit of the community. Those who are concerned should really stop thinking only about themselves. The whole aspect of development for this software is based on volunteering, so there is absolutely no place for any kind of expectations on how the output of work should be or anything. People are free to invest their free time in development whenever they like and in whatever way they like and it is in the natural order for them to expect gratitude from the others. In my point of view, arguing and putting pressure on the programmer only contribute in eating out this community by lack of gratefulness. Count yourselves already lucky to have such a generous variety of (free) components available, plus a (free) rock solid media player and a (free) support forum with well qualified members.

This might be a bit overreacted, but I have this one on my mind since a while. I'm not talking for anyone else than me expressing my point of view.

Just so that you understand me well : you have overreacted because you have misunderstood me. I am NOT one of the people you describe, and I am not asking anything here. Hell, I don't even care if chronial's CoverFlow becomes available one day, there are more important things in life.

The only thing I'm saying is that WHEN a developer decides to work on a popular project like CoverFlow, and WHEN he creates a buzz around his project (by posting videos for instance), THEN the least he can do is keep people informed on a regular basis and answer their questions. No more, no less.

Like I said, chronial may take all the time he wants. He can even drop the project if he wants, that's OK with me. The only thing I'm asking is for some information so that people can stop asking the same questions over and over again ("when will there be a beta", etc, etc. - you know the story). Just a bit of information. Is that so difficult ? I don't think so.

Let me tell you a story. There's some developer out there in HA forums, his nick is McoreD. He may not be the best developer in the world, but at least he's proactive. You ask a question, he answers quickly. You report a bug, he thanks you and he patches it in the twinkle of an eye. You submit an idea, he thinks about it, and he doesn't hesitate to modify his own conception of the software to better fit user's suggestions (instead of saying "that's not MY point of view, so I won't implement it, and I don't care if you guys think different", like some developers do). He's not self-centric, he's kind, intelligent, and most of all, user-centric. I don't even know McoreD personally, but I think most developers out there should learn from him.

Programming skills are essential, but all the rest may be even more important IMHO.

Chronflow

Reply #77
The only thing I'm saying is that WHEN a developer decides to work on a popular project like CoverFlow, and WHEN he creates a buzz around his project (by posting videos for instance), THEN the least he can do is keep people informed on a regular basis and answer their questions. No more, no less.
Totally agree with you, Jose.
It's just a matter of respect for the fb2k community.

Chronflow

Reply #78
Programming skills are essential, but all the rest may be even more important IMHO.


One of the most essential skills is being able to say no to bloat requests.
Stay sane, exile.

Chronflow

Reply #79
I'd rather say that one of the most essential skills for a programmer is being able to discern all the intelligent / useful requests from the others. Just being able to say "no" is not really a skill. Some programmers feel compelled to say "no" every time a request goes against their point of view. That's a big mistake and a proof of over-self-confidence IMHO (I hope this is the right word, english is not my native tongue).

Sorry for the off-topic. Let's get back to CoverFlow... if there's any news about it of course. 

Chronflow

Reply #80
It's nice that my plugin has created such a heavy discussion about development here ^^.
At first: I'm still alive as usual - I don't visit the forums since I get every reply via mail.
About the component: It has not changed in any way since the video. From what I read on the coverplay page I'd say that my plugin is a little bit further developed than this one. I don't develop it a the moment since I just do not have the time to so.
About a beta: Releasing my version would be no use for you, since the image filename, the album path and the foobar executable are hardcoded. I could of course change that, but I don't consider this useful as long as it is this unflexible. In addition - any work I would do to release this stand-alone program would be completely useless in regards to a release of a foobar component.


I have to completely support eejadx's statement. But I know that barely any non-developer will understand this. The developers do not owe you anything at all. They spend a lot of time to make their components usable by others (no component would need an options dialog - you could hardcode all that). But I know how this sounds to a non-developer (I have been one some time ago, too), so just forget about it.

About the news: I won't post a "still nothing new" post as a reply to every "any news?" post. As soon as there are news, you will hear them.

And about the C#/XAML thing: well, everyone with a decent knowledge of C++ and OpenGL/DirectX can write that, too. Except it will be faster, smaller and run on non-Vista machines

Chronflow

Reply #81
And about the C#/XAML thing: well, everyone with a decent knowledge of C++ and OpenGL/DirectX can write that, too. Except it will be faster, smaller and run on non-Vista machines

That's only partially true. For one, you don't need Vista, only .NET 3.0. For something like CoverFlow it would be unnoticably slower, since WPF 3D uses DirectX. MSIL bytecode assemblies are typically smaller than native binaries because they depend on the CLR instead of statically linked or included code. Doing it in native code would also result in it being potentially less reliable and certainly less expandable. WPF is enormously powerful, if you had a component that could host a WPF control, you could write an entire WPF GUI, which has enormous benefits (I realize this is not your goal, but that was simply the point I was making in my other post).

Chronflow

Reply #82
Well, I have to agree with Chronial. At least he has given some news, and that's all I was asking for. So thanks to him.

FYI, I do support Chronial's work (really !), like I will support any other initiative from any other developer towards a future "CoverFlow for foobar" component. Thanks everyone.

Now let's get busy until someone comes up with some good news. 


Chronflow

Reply #84
it seems to be really good I hope it will be released soon


Chronflow

Reply #86
Bad News: I had just finished restructuring my whole code and playing with different rendering positions (aligning the covers in a circle looks really nice and gives that nice spinning effect ;), when I realized something really bad: I won't be able to run the next foobar version (still running Win2k, and that won't change within the next time).
Well long story short: Since I won't be able to develop for the current foobar version, I won't invest a lot of time just to create a plugin only those few that are running an old foobar version can use :/.

Maybe I'll create a standalone version, but I'm not sure about that.
The sourcecode is quite structured now and you can mail me, if you'd like a copy.

Chronflow

Reply #87
I thought that 0.9.5 foobar is backwards compatible with 0.9.* versions. Actually I use components that weren't updated for quite a long time already.
Sharing delusions since 1991.

Chronflow

Reply #88
Aww bummer 
Was it meant to be a panels component? Would you need to change a lot for it to work on the latest Foobar version/Xp you think?
Aren't there things the community can do to help out with testing on XP for instance? I'm no coder so I'm probably underestimating the matter.

Chronflow

Reply #89
it doesn't matter how much has to be changed - as a long as I can't debug it, I can't develop it.

Chronflow

Reply #90
I think that as long as it can work on a 0.9.x version it should work on XP up to 0.9.5. Is what you have so far at least functional for you? If it is, maybe compiling a .dll and sending it out to a few testers who use XP to see if it works?

Hopefully something gets figured out, or at least someone takes over your project .
Song List: keikoniumboards.ke.funpic.org/files/songlist.html

Chronflow

Reply #91
IMHO someone taking over the project (with credits to chronial of course) would be best.

Just FYI, AFAIK Columns UI / Panels UI components can run painlessly with the new 0.9.5 and its Default UI : you just have to install Columns UI and Dockable Panels. The components (e.g. Peakmeter, Lyrics Show Panel...) do appear over the Default UI and you can place them wherever you want (over the UI or at the sides, etc.).


Chronflow

Reply #93
D'oh! Could you please just release the plug-in for older versions? Because I'm one of those few running an older version and I'm not planning to upgrade. I was so looking forward to that thing

Chronflow

Reply #94
All right - I took the time and added some input to the code. So here's an alpha demo version for you:
http://chron.visiondesigns.de/bin/chronflow-alpha-demo.zip

I don't want this to be distributed any further, since it is not really ready for release.

It scans recursively for images (.jpg, .png, .bmp). If your cover images have special names you can give them as parameters (eg. "chronflow.exe folder.jpg" will only display images named "folder.jpg").
This is not really ready for release, but I wanted to show you the cool spiral flow (which I really enjoy playing with ^^). If I release this as a foobar plugin, style of cover flow will be completely costumizable via formatting strings, so the spiral is only an example.
The default.png is the image that is shown for not yet loaded covers. If you have anything better for this (I just took my albumimg-panel no-cover image), feel free to post it since I will need this for a release.
Controls are: left arrow/right arrow, pg up/down, mouse wheel and clicking on covers.

You can only scroll through the images - it doesn't start an application do anything else.

This is only an alpha version, but if you find any bugs, feel free to report them - maybe I don't know it already .

Chronflow

Reply #95
The spiral is pretty cool (albeit a bit headache producing ;-)

Would make a pretty slick screensaver.

Chronflow

Reply #96
Came late to the topic, wanted to add a few points

Some programmers feel compelled to say "no" every time a request goes against their point of view. That's a big mistake and a proof of over-self-confidence IMHO (I hope this is the right word, english is not my native tongue).

The developer should have the right to reject any feature request for any reason whatsoever.  Especially for component developers, you usually write a component that you will use.  If there is a feature you wouldn't use, why spend the time?  Providing source code such that other interested users could contribute the code for additional features, in my opinion, is well above what should be expected of a developer, yet many developers here do just that.  If you need the feature so badly, write it yourself.  You have no idea how frustrating it is when random people tell you how best to do your hobby!

MSIL bytecode assemblies are typically smaller than native binaries because they depend on the CLR instead of statically linked or included code.

Wow, you really want to make that argument??  Sure, the assembly itself is very small, but it is useless without the 30-50MB of extraneous crap the .NET framework piles on.  You do realize those assemblies won't work without the redistributable, right?  So, when comparing the size between the two, you must include the size of the entire framework.

Not to say .NET isn't a viable option or a decent platform, you just can't make the size argument.  With Vista, you would already have it installed, so that does make it a little trickier, but as you said, it's still a dependency.

Chronflow

Reply #97
You do realize those assemblies won't work without the redistributable, right?

Duh? Don't try to be a witty smartass and patronize me. I'm not an idiot.

So, when comparing the size between the two, you must include the size of the entire framework.

No, because you don't have to distribute the framework with every application. Yes, some people might not have it installed, in which case it needs to be distributed, but a lot of other software already requires it, and it's available on Windows update, so I'm assuming that many users already have it. I don't have any statistics but please, the framework does not at all count as size of the executable.

It doesn't matter anyway, even the largest binaries are tiny by the standards of the past decade, I was only pointing out that what he was saying wasn't strictly true.

Chronflow

Reply #98
Very very cool! Nice work chronial