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Topic: Does Ogg Vorbis offer any advantages over Ogg Opus? (Read 21403 times) previous topic - next topic

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  • VEG
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Re: Does Ogg Vorbis offer any advantages over Ogg Opus?
Reply #25
— Vorbis supports high sample rates, up to 192kHz.
— Vorbis has a highly optimized (in terms of speed) encoder Lancer.
— It is just more popular, more hardware and software support it.

  • kode54
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  • Administrator
Re: Does Ogg Vorbis offer any advantages over Ogg Opus?
Reply #26
— Vorbis supports high sample rates, up to 192kHz.
And ultrasonic frequencies really only matter in mastering stages, if at all, and you wouldn't be using lossy formats there.
— Vorbis has a highly optimized (in terms of speed) encoder Lancer.
I can imagine this may be useful if you're performing a lot of encoding at many times real time, say, batch encoding at speeds faster than most solid state drives can read the raw PCM samples at. Also, mainline and forks have significantly improved quality and speed since 2010, which appears to be when that page snapshot is from.
— It is just more popular, more hardware and software support it.
I will give you that, but support will happen in the future. There's already the huge Google push behind YouTube, which uses Opus everywhere as its highest quality or preferred format.

  • dutch109
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Re: Does Ogg Vorbis offer any advantages over Ogg Opus?
Reply #27
I will give you that, but support will happen in the future. There's already the huge Google push behind YouTube, which uses Opus everywhere as its highest quality or preferred format.
Not all YouTube videos have an Opus track available.
Google also made bold claims in the past about replacing h264 by WebM & VP8 everywhere and none of that happened.
Vorbis -q2/5 (Android/PC) & WavPack -hhx6m
https://playnoise.com/

  • IgorC
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Re: Does Ogg Vorbis offer any advantages over Ogg Opus?
Reply #28
— Vorbis supports high sample rates, up to 192kHz.
— Vorbis has a highly optimized (in terms of speed) encoder Lancer.
— It is just more popular, more hardware and software support it.

But will it blend?!

  • quadH
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Re: Does Ogg Vorbis offer any advantages over Ogg Opus?
Reply #29
Google also made bold claims in the past about replacing h264 by WebM & VP8 everywhere and none of that happened.

YouTube only uses VP8 and Vorbis on old videos with a low amount of views.

  • saratoga
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Re: Does Ogg Vorbis offer any advantages over Ogg Opus?
Reply #30
I will give you that, but support will happen in the future. There's already the huge Google push behind YouTube, which uses Opus everywhere as its highest quality or preferred format.
Not all YouTube videos have an Opus track available.
Google also made bold claims in the past about replacing h264 by WebM & VP8 everywhere and none of that happened.

They actually did use VP8 for a while, but have since switched youtube over to VP9 on browsers that support it.

  • derf_
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  • Developer
Re: Does Ogg Vorbis offer any advantages over Ogg Opus?
Reply #31
That might be true in theory, but last time I checked Vorbis was still the only lossy codec that passed a problematic gapless test.

Where is the test you're referring to?

...it still occasionally stumbles over killer samples and this doesn't seem to be entirely cured at any bitrate.

Can you provide such samples?

Re: Does Ogg Vorbis offer any advantages over Ogg Opus?
Reply #32
I recently ripped some CDs to Ogg Vorbis, using quality 6 (the quality recommended on their website for near cd quality and "lossless stereo). I found the mids to trebles to be over amplified. This resulted in audio characteristics such as snares and claps being disproportionately LOUD, and songs just generally sounding harsh.

Has anyone else found this with Ogg Vorbis?

  • VEG
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Re: Does Ogg Vorbis offer any advantages over Ogg Opus?
Reply #33
Which encoder did you use?

Re: Does Ogg Vorbis offer any advantages over Ogg Opus?
Reply #34
I recently ripped some CDs to Ogg Vorbis, using quality 6 (the quality recommended on their website for near cd quality and "lossless stereo). I found the mids to trebles to be over amplified. This resulted in audio characteristics such as snares and claps being disproportionately LOUD, and songs just generally sounding harsh.

Has anyone else found this with Ogg Vorbis?

Did you try and ABX to rule out observational bias?

  • polemon
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Re: Does Ogg Vorbis offer any advantages over Ogg Opus?
Reply #35
I will give you that, but support will happen in the future. There's already the huge Google push behind YouTube, which uses Opus everywhere as its highest quality or preferred format.
Not all YouTube videos have an Opus track available.
Google also made bold claims in the past about replacing h264 by WebM & VP8 everywhere and none of that happened.
Last time I checked, the current target is AV1 to be the de-facto standard codec for video in Youtube. However, re-encoding old videos into newer lossy codecs makes no sense, since that would only reduce quality further. It's easier to keep the old stuff and only re-encode if it is absolutely imperative (like preview-size, etc) and where quality absolutely isn't the issue.

  • [JAZ]
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Re: Does Ogg Vorbis offer any advantages over Ogg Opus?
Reply #36
I recently ripped some CDs to Ogg Vorbis, using quality 6 (the quality recommended on their website for near cd quality and "lossless stereo). I found the mids to trebles to be over amplified. This resulted in audio characteristics such as snares and claps being disproportionately LOUD, and songs just generally sounding harsh.

Has anyone else found this with Ogg Vorbis?

That doesn't seem to be a problem added by Vorbis. At much, it sounds as if you got your hands on a CD that has pre-emphasis, and as such, it needs to be de-emphasized first.

  • IgorC
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Re: Does Ogg Vorbis offer any advantages over Ogg Opus?
Reply #37
Last time I checked, the current target is AV1 to be the de-facto standard codec for video in Youtube. However, re-encoding old videos into newer lossy codecs makes no sense, since that would only reduce quality further. It's easier to keep the old stuff and only re-encode if it is absolutely imperative (like preview-size, etc) and where quality absolutely isn't the issue.
Google won't transcode from VP9 to AV1.
Google keeps original versions of uploaded videos on Youtube.   

  • polemon
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Re: Does Ogg Vorbis offer any advantages over Ogg Opus?
Reply #38
Last time I checked, the current target is AV1 to be the de-facto standard codec for video in Youtube. However, re-encoding old videos into newer lossy codecs makes no sense, since that would only reduce quality further. It's easier to keep the old stuff and only re-encode if it is absolutely imperative (like preview-size, etc) and where quality absolutely isn't the issue.
Google won't transcode from VP9 to AV1.
Google keeps original versions of uploaded videos on Youtube.   
Isn't that what I've said?

  • IgorC
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Re: Does Ogg Vorbis offer any advantages over Ogg Opus?
Reply #39
Not sure.

What I mean is that Google can easily encode  ALL videos to AV1 because they have an original  sources (not VP9 encoded video which streamed on Youtube)  which were uploaded by users.