Skip to main content

Notice

Please note that most of the software linked on this forum is likely to be safe to use. If you are unsure, feel free to ask in the relevant topics, or send a private message to an administrator or moderator. To help curb the problems of false positives, or in the event that you do find actual malware, you can contribute through the article linked here.

Poll

Shall we continue with the yearly format usage polls - lossy and lossless?

Yes
[ 49 ] (90.7%)
No
[ 5 ] (9.3%)

Total Members Voted: 54

Voting closed: 2023-04-10 12:43:26

Topic: Continue Yearly Format Usage polls - yes or no (Read 5533 times) previous topic - next topic
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Continue Yearly Format Usage polls - yes or no

Since member IgorC is no more, i.e. banned, (god & mods know why) I'd like, with this 'metapoll', so to speak, to inquire whether folks down here still see the need for those yearly format usage polls he'd been carrying on with for a decade or so.

I set its duration for 90 days and will see how it goes.

In case the outcome is affirmative, I'm willing to run it for the oncoming years, as well as to continue creating graphs analysing previous years' results.

Cheers,

Nilson
Listen to the music, not the media it's on.
União e reconstrução



Re: Continue Yearly Format Usage polls - yes or no

Reply #3
I'm not sure whether the results of the lossless format poll would change much since last time (I haven't seen much discussion indicating change), but as the last poll for that was 5 years ago, maybe it is not a bad idea to poll anyway. Usually discussion resulting from the poll gives some insight into motives for using one or the other.

Lossy formats have seen quite some change the last few years, so that would be interesting.
Music: sounds arranged such that they construct feelings.

Re: Continue Yearly Format Usage polls - yes or no

Reply #4
TBH, soon after posting this poll/thread, I started to wonder whether the lossless one would be any useful.
But I reckon that your argument that the 5-year gap may be long enough to deem another poll - if not necessary, at least interesting - is a strong one.

It's way too early, I know, but based on the partial replies so far (100% Edit: 16 'yesses' out of 17 votes), I guess your idea might come in handy for the pattern:
Yearly lossy polls / quinquennial* lossless ones.

* i.e, every 5 years; had to look that up  :)
Listen to the music, not the media it's on.
União e reconstrução

Re: Continue Yearly Format Usage polls - yes or no

Reply #5
Lossy formats have seen quite some change the last few years, so that would be interesting.
Have they really, though, Opus is over 10 years old at this point?

Re: Continue Yearly Format Usage polls - yes or no

Reply #6
If taking on it, make a choice between the following:
* be precise about what you mean by using a codec. Like, "when encoding, or if given multiple options to download"
or
* accept that this ambiguity has been with the poll for ages and some will go "I am a YouTube user so sure I use Opus" and some will use YouTube on desktop all the time and still not count it as using Opus

Re: Continue Yearly Format Usage polls - yes or no

Reply #7
Lossy formats have seen quite some change the last few years, so that would be interesting.
Have they really, though, Opus is over 10 years old at this point?
Sorry, that wasn't a clear statement. I meant not the codecs themselves, but their use here on this forum according to the polls. See the graph in https://hydrogenaud.io/index.php/topic,120734.0.html
Music: sounds arranged such that they construct feelings.

Re: Continue Yearly Format Usage polls - yes or no

Reply #8
A poll is still interesting even if we "know" what the result should be, because a single opinion is not consensus. It would also be a rough gauge of how strong legacy use cases are, ie using mp3 because that's all the car stereo can handle. I wonder if it would be useful or too complicating to craft the poll in such a way that legacy use cases were distinct from general use, something like separate options for "mp3: general use" and "mp3: Legacy application".

Re: Continue Yearly Format Usage polls - yes or no

Reply #9
I wonder if it would be useful or too complicating to craft the poll in such a way that legacy use cases were distinct from general use, something like separate options for "mp3: general use" and "mp3: Legacy application".
Then it turns into a survey, probably. Somelike this
Do you encode to more than one lossy codec?
-> if yes, select from list
-> if no, select from matrix with all codecs and a few use cases

In that case one could choose MP3 for 'car stereo' and Opus for mobile phone library, or something like that.

However, such granularity might not make it easy to draw conclusions.
Music: sounds arranged such that they construct feelings.

Re: Continue Yearly Format Usage polls - yes or no

Reply #10
Nope. because it would be very biased, full of errors and what not.
Please remove my account from this forum.

Re: Continue Yearly Format Usage polls - yes or no

Reply #11
As much as some of the new suggestions given here so far seem to be quite interesting or justifiable, I must say my initial idea when volunteering to take over from the previous guy, was to simply carry on as before, so that the data gathered in the previous years would still be comparable to oncoming years'. For starters, the graphs would still make sense - lest, according to how much the options changed, we'd have to start them from the scratch - certainly the graphs; maybe even our own individual analyses of said data.

Also, as the previous polls were obviously based on the same forum script which doesn't allow for multiple choices - as explained by the current and previous admins - I've always been in the impression that a simple disclaimer like '...by which we mean the format you've been encoding/transcoding to THE MOST currently' would have sufficed, IMO - even more so if we give in to the fact that quite a few of us are self-confessed format hoppers (myself included).

Who knows, such a disclaimer (or whatever we call it) could end up reducing claims as varied as 'but I watch videos on Youtube' (who doesn't?) or 'I use X format for car listening, Y for home and Z for whatever!'.

Also, without wanting to sound too orthodox, wouldn't we run the risk of ending up with something too convoluted instead of the, IMO, simpler cross-sectional data of whatever the HA members (who've bothered replying), were up to this or that year?

These, obviously, are just my two cents though. Just because I'm willing to step in, I'm don't mean at all to become some sort of self assumed Lord of the Flies of such polls.  :))
Listen to the music, not the media it's on.
União e reconstrução

Re: Continue Yearly Format Usage polls - yes or no

Reply #12
Yeah, go on like that. The biases mycroft describe are real, HA users are not representing the general public anyway - but in the least the results are comparable from year to year.

Re: Continue Yearly Format Usage polls - yes or no

Reply #13
Like it or not you are the poll master now (the sash is in the mail). When it comes to polls your word is law.

It's baffling how mp3 can be so high in the 2021 poll if it's single option, aside from a car stereo I can't think of a legacy device that can't easily be updated that people would actually use. I suppose never being able to update is the danger of using lossy as the best format you have.

FYI the external site I always see used for polls is strawpoll, don't know if it's an indication of quality but the 2021 link is the first time I've seen anything else.

Re: Continue Yearly Format Usage polls - yes or no

Reply #14
Yeah, go on like that. The biases mycroft describe are real, HA users are not representing the general public anyway - but in the least the results are comparable from year to year.
Hear, hear!
Listen to the music, not the media it's on.
União e reconstrução

Re: Continue Yearly Format Usage polls - yes or no

Reply #15
[...](the sash is in the mail).
Only if I can have 'Mr. Plow' engraved on it.  ;D

I can't think of a legacy device that can't easily be updated that people would actually use.
Just to illustrate what you say, I still keep my ancient Creative Jukebox 3 (bought at London's Tottenham Court Road shop back in Jan 2003!) more or less alive. But the last time I uploaded anything to it was 2009-10.

FYI the external site I always see used for polls is strawpoll, don't know if it's an indication of quality but the 2021 link is the first time I've seen anything else.
If you mean what IgorC called then the 'Unofficial survey, I can't honestly tell to this day whether that was considered useful or not.
Listen to the music, not the media it's on.
União e reconstrução

Re: Continue Yearly Format Usage polls - yes or no

Reply #16
It's baffling how mp3 can be so high in the 2021 poll if it's single option, aside from a car stereo I can't think of a legacy device that can't easily be updated that people would actually use. I suppose never being able to update is the danger of using lossy as the best format you have.
What's baffling is how people can feel so certain that what they think is best everyone must think is best.  For my purposes MP3 is good enough, works everywhere, and I have no reason to try something else (which would mean completely revising my toolchain).

And yes, my car stereo is pretty limited in what it will accept.
It's your privilege to disagree, but that doesn't make you right and me wrong.

Re: Continue Yearly Format Usage polls - yes or no

Reply #17
I actually like to participate in polls, so here's a "Yes" from me.
(Knowing that I visit this site every few years or so... anyway.)
audiophile // flac & wavpack, mostly // using too many audio players

Re: Continue Yearly Format Usage polls - yes or no

Reply #18
I actually like to participate in polls, so here's a "Yes" from me.
(Knowing that I visit this site every few years or so... anyway.)
Be sure to pop by in April then, when, as promised (and by the looks of it) this year's poll will be on.
Listen to the music, not the media it's on.
União e reconstrução