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Topic: Is there an online database to check the checksum of tracks? (Read 2890 times) previous topic - next topic
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Is there an online database to check the checksum of tracks?

I downloaded Mermaids by Hans Zimmer from 4 different sites (16-Bit 44.1 kHz, similar file sizes), and each checksum of raw audio (not to be confused with the hash sum of the file itself) was different:

Code: [Select]
$ metaflac --show-md5 *.flac
deezer.flac:03817d597f0cc02e837944d80311f5a2
qobuz.flac:bfd6771e77b870f3d30675196d231e12
tidal.flac:dd7b598c8928c4e0683811437139b6b0
rutracker.flac:c08ed19ee9734c93ec880f640b2f043e

Is there any way to figure out which version is "original"? Maybe something like MusicBrainz but for hash sums?

Re: Is there an online database to check the checksum of tracks?

Reply #1
CueTools, but for whole albums.
TAPE LOADING ERROR

Re: Is there an online database to check the checksum of tracks?

Reply #2
CueTools is only valid for media ripped from CD

Unfortunately I can’t find any evidence of this album, on any of the services mentioned. So hard to help there. In terms of services I would trust least, Deezer allows user uploaded content, and Tidal has been known to serve up MQA encoded files, with their non-MQA offerings possibly just a simple conversion from the already damaged MQA versions.
Rutracker is of course a torrent site and anybody there can upload any garbage they got from anywhere, or may have altered in any way.

Qobuz is incredibly reliable in my experience and I would trust it to have the “correct” audio data, unless it is one of those new releases with watermarks in the audio signal.

Re: Is there an online database to check the checksum of tracks?

Reply #3
CueTools is only valid for media ripped from CD

QOBUZ has albums that are CD rips, for example, they check out in CueTools.
TAPE LOADING ERROR

Re: Is there an online database to check the checksum of tracks?

Reply #4
CueTools is only valid for media ripped from CD

Unfortunately I can’t find any evidence of this album, on any of the services mentioned. So hard to help there. In terms of services I would trust least, Deezer allows user uploaded content, and Tidal has been known to serve up MQA encoded files, with their non-MQA offerings possibly just a simple conversion from the already damaged MQA versions.
Rutracker is of course a torrent site and anybody there can upload any garbage they got from anywhere, or may have altered in any way.

Qobuz is incredibly reliable in my experience and I would trust it to have the “correct” audio data, unless it is one of those new releases with watermarks in the audio signal.

Thanks, I was wondering which site has the "original" audio, and a lot of people praise Qobuz, so I'll be using it.

Re: Is there an online database to check the checksum of tracks?

Reply #5
I happen to have that CD, and for that track I have a MD5 sum that is different from the 4 you mentioned.
Music: sounds arranged such that they construct feelings.

Re: Is there an online database to check the checksum of tracks?

Reply #6
I happen to have that CD, and for that track I have a MD5 sum that is different from the 4 you mentioned.

That's the problem. Shouldn't the md5 be the same for everyone since it's "lossless"?... I can't understand it.

Re: Is there an online database to check the checksum of tracks?

Reply #7
A file can be a lossless representation, but still different.  For example: the amount of "silence" at the beginning and end of the rip.
It's your privilege to disagree, but that doesn't make you right and me wrong.

Re: Is there an online database to check the checksum of tracks?

Reply #8
That's the problem. Shouldn't the md5 be the same for everyone since it's "lossless"?... I can't understand it.
Different masterings are different, sometimes audibly so.
If one was mastered for CD and another for file delivery, they need not have same length.
And even if same mastering, only different CD pressings: Depending on which device created the master it was pressed from, they might differ in so-called offset: one pressing may have every track boundary say thirty or a hundred samples to the left or to the right of another one.
Same mastering, same pressing, different ripping tool: Drives also have different read offsets and if that isn't corrected upon ripping, you will get bitstream shifted. That is even if there was no ripping error.

Re: Is there an online database to check the checksum of tracks?

Reply #9
Thank you all for the replies, now it makes sense.

Re: Is there an online database to check the checksum of tracks?

Reply #10
It is part of Universal Music so every streaming service can have its own watermark.
You may spot it with using deltawave (deltaw.org) and the 'Spectrum of delta' column.
Is troll-adiposity coming from feederism?
With 24bit music you can listen to silence much louder!

Re: Is there an online database to check the checksum of tracks?

Reply #11
CueTools is only valid for media ripped from CD

QOBUZ has albums that are CD rips, for example, they check out in CueTools.

I would assume this makes up a very small minority of the content hosted on Qobuz or any DSP, and even if it were 16/44.1 it would be impossible to know if their files on the backend happened to come from a CD rip anyhow, prior to checking for a potential match in the CTDB.

My general rule of thumb, is if it’s only available in 16/44.1 and an older release from before the modern lossless streaming/download age - just get/rip the CD and forget about the WEB version!
Then you get a legitimate cue/log as well. There’s no longer any need for guesswork.

Re: Is there an online database to check the checksum of tracks?

Reply #12
My general rule of thumb, is if it’s only available in 16/44.1 and an older release from before the modern lossless streaming/download age - just get/rip the CD and forget about the WEB version!

At least if it is before the loudness war. Or well, if you can get both, you can pick and choose.

"As a principle" that I do not believe in in practice, the CD should be "inferior" to a file:
* there must be file to produce the CD, and if you can get that, you avoid the risk of the following:
* on the way from file to CD, there are things that incompetent people might do to the mastering.

But for older music, my gut feeling is that the worst that was done to the music was done intentionally, and ... and who knows if those old masters even exist anymore. It might be that the now-discontinued CD versions are as close as one can ever get to a good master.

Re: Is there an online database to check the checksum of tracks?

Reply #13
My general rule of thumb, is if it’s only available in 16/44.1 and an older release from before the modern lossless streaming/download age - just get/rip the CD and forget about the WEB version!

At least if it is before the loudness war. Or well, if you can get both, you can pick and choose.

"As a principle" that I do not believe in in practice, the CD should be "inferior" to a file:
* there must be file to produce the CD, and if you can get that, you avoid the risk of the following:
* on the way from file to CD, there are things that incompetent people might do to the mastering.

But for older music, my gut feeling is that the worst that was done to the music was done intentionally, and ... and who knows if those old masters even exist anymore. It might be that the now-discontinued CD versions are as close as one can ever get to a good master.

To clarify, my rule of thumb really pertained mostly to things that are from late enough in the digital era that they only ever got one mastering,and were released on CD initially, but still too early to have been distributed as as a lossless file/download/stream to begin with. I guess we should roughly say the 2000-2014 era, give or take a bit.

For example, there was a hip hop album I wanted from 2007. It’s available now on DSPs in 16/44.1 lossless, but the original CD was rare/pricey.
 Instead of just getting the download, I waited till I could obtain a rip of the actual CD release. That way there would be nothing to speculate about the provenance of the files, I have a legitimate rip of the original release with log/cue in my archive rather than some random set of files that weren’t made available until more than a decade after the fact.