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Topic: New VST adapter for foobar2000 (Read 24077 times) previous topic - next topic
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New VST adapter for foobar2000

https://www.foobar2000.org/components/view/foo_dsp_vst3

Best used with latest foobar2000 v2.0 beta - please do not report annoying behaviors with old foobar2000, they're well known; foobar2000 v1.6.14 will also support this component properly.

UPDATE: foobar2000 v1.6.14 out, you can now use VST adapter properly without running foobar2000 betas.
Microsoft Windows: We can't script here, this is bat country.

Re: New VST adapter for foobar2000

Reply #1
Now that's awesome. Played with it, no crashes yet. I noticed, it's possible audio for few plugins changes not while operating the plugin GUI, but only after closing it - why is that? E.g. Chow Tape Model: https://chowdsp.com/nightly.html

Re: New VST adapter for foobar2000

Reply #2
With 64-bit v2 beta 13, using the Sonic Anomaly "Unlimited" 64-bit compressor/limiter VST I get "Unrecoverable playback error: VST refused audio stream format" no matter what the stream format is.  Not sure how the new "Override output channels" settings needs to be set, but get the same error with it set to either "none" or "stereo."  I use the default wasapi exclusive audio output.

I use the 32-bit version of the same Unlimited plugin successfully with Foobar 1.6.12 via the old Yohng VST wrapper.

Attached is the 64-bit version of the VST if someone cares to try it themselves (this was a free download from now-defunct Sonic Anomaly).

Re: New VST adapter for foobar2000

Reply #3
AMAZING, thank you so much for this Peter! It's been the only missing feature of FB2K for me for a long time, and the two old VST wrappers were no longer updated and very buggy. And it supports VST3! I am over the moon and will test it today and report back.

Re: New VST adapter for foobar2000

Reply #4
Hey Peter, maybe you can make a deal with https://www.airwindows.com/ guy to include some into fb2k, whose UI-less plugins also are included into the Surge synthesizer. Lots of them are about dynamics, so maybe make sense in an audio player.
BTW, considering CLAP support? I guess it will become relevant.

Re: New VST adapter for foobar2000

Reply #5
I tried to use this plugin with audio measuring VST's (ex. Voxengo span) but nothing happens. I do not want to use any audio changing plugings just measuring tools (Peak, RMS LUFS, PLR, Spectrum....). Is it possible yet?


Re: New VST adapter for foobar2000

Reply #7
Suggestions:
a) Please allow removing of the VST directories. One may just want to use hand picked VST directories.
b) A "find as you type" search field in the VST picker would be nice.

Re: New VST adapter for foobar2000

Reply #8
I tried to use this plugin with audio measuring VST's (ex. Voxengo span) but nothing happens. I do not want to use any audio changing plugings just measuring tools (Peak, RMS LUFS, PLR, Spectrum....). Is it possible yet?

From the web page: https://www.foobar2000.org/components/view/foo_dsp_vst3

"Current limitations: Because of the sandboxing, VST can't show live audio data being played."

But TBF this was mostly the case with the older 3rd party wrappers too, you couldn't really use graphical/metering VSTs with them because the delay was so bad. It's no biggie I guess but does preclude some nice metering options I have like Youlean Loudness Meter, DMG Track Meter, iZotope Insight etc.

I tried it out with a few thigs today (all VST3 64 bit, in 32 bit FB2K 1.6.13) and all except the aforementioned worked flawlessly!

Re: New VST adapter for foobar2000

Reply #9
This couldn't have come at a better time for me. But as soon as I load the component in foobar, Windows anti-virus pops up and says it has detected a trojan Win32/Wacatac.H!ml. 10 out of 67 engines on Virustotal.com also detect stuff. False positives, I assume? Nobody else has any problems with Windows anti-virus when using this?

Re: New VST adapter for foobar2000

Reply #10
Hey Peter, maybe you can make a deal with https://www.airwindows.com/ guy to include some into fb2k, whose UI-less plugins also are included into the Surge synthesizer. Lots of them are about dynamics, so maybe make sense in an audio player.
BTW, considering CLAP support? I guess it will become relevant.

I might actually add some to foo_dsp_effect. I am trying to get beta 2 done, by fixing every major issue it has before adding more DSPs.

I see that code is sanely licensed, so maybe someone could do it all as VSTs, too.

Re: New VST adapter for foobar2000

Reply #11
Hey Peter, maybe you can make a deal with https://www.airwindows.com/ guy to include some into fb2k, whose UI-less plugins also are included into the Surge synthesizer. Lots of them are about dynamics, so maybe make sense in an audio player.
BTW, considering CLAP support? I guess it will become relevant.
Thanks Squeller for the airwindows link, a ton of VSTs to play around with now with the new v2 64-bit host!

Re: New VST adapter for foobar2000

Reply #12
To have an effect which keeps dynamics on more stable levels, which is crucial e. g. in louder environment vs. classical music, for sure this can be resolved with some upward expander/limiter combination.

BUT it needs to look ahead (e. g. volume down before a sudden loud passage).

Is that possible within the plugin hosts sandbox?

I'm willing to find a decent VLevel dsp alternative.




Re: New VST adapter for foobar2000

Reply #16
I tried to use this plugin with audio measuring VST's (ex. Voxengo span) but nothing happens. I do not want to use any audio changing plugings just measuring tools (Peak, RMS LUFS, PLR, Spectrum....). Is it possible yet?

Hello @wojak , actual VST wrapper implementation doesn't support that.

For such a kind of need and for complex VST configuration is more appropriate route the audio output to a separate (and appropriately featured) DAW.
I do that via digital loopback on SPDIF interface.

Regards, Andrea

Re: New VST adapter for foobar2000

Reply #17
New version out.

If you open a VST configuration panel while playing, live audio going thru the DSP will be also sent to the configuration panel, so VSTs can be used as measuring/visualisation tools now.
There's a delay between shown audio and playback, which is normal - set smaller output buffer to work around it.
Microsoft Windows: We can't script here, this is bat country.

Re: New VST adapter for foobar2000

Reply #18
New version out.

If you open a VST configuration panel while playing, live audio going thru the DSP will be also sent to the configuration panel, so VSTs can be used as measuring/visualisation tools now.
There's a delay between shown audio and playback, which is normal - set smaller output buffer to work around it.

To me the live measuring/visualization VST-plugin feature is the main reason for using Foobar2000, and it's an awesome component addition. Foobar2000 becomes an even more powerful tool. That said, I'm having trouble setting it up with this latest version.  I'm running Windows 7 Sp2. I've installed the Foobar2000 v2.0 beta 13, and the VST 2.x/3.x Adapter 0.7 released today.  v2.0 runs fine. But I'm having these three problems with the VST installation:

1. In my previous set up (v1.6.11) using the VST 2.4 adapter, under Preferences --> Playback --> DSP Manager I could see the list of Available VST plug-ins, and the Active ones. I do get the list of available plugins with Foobar2000 v2.0 beta 13 and the new VST host plugin. However none of my x64 plugins, or any other purchased plugin that I have installed show up under Available. Perhaps this is due to the path used to find them?

2. In my previous set up in Preferences --> Components there was a subheading "VST-plugins" which listed the VST-plugins in use, the I/O of each and the path where they were stored. I don't get that now. This is no big deal from my usage point of view, but perhaps an indication of what might be wrong?

3. One that does show up under Available is the Meier Crossfeed. If I activate this, it's added to the Active list. However, when I then proceed to View --> DSP the Meier Crossfeed doesn't show up there. In v1.6.11 there would be two DSP headings under View --> DSP, where the second one showed all the installed Active DSP plugins, such as for example the Meier Crossfeed.

I'm sure I'm overlooking something, and any assistance or hints would be appreciated.

Re: New VST adapter for foobar2000

Reply #19
Updated to .7 over .6 today, and right away noticed the absence of a configuration window for one of VST plugins I had been successfully using with .6 and always showed the window.  Before the update the StereoFX64 from airwindows showed a configuration panel as below:



Now, the config panel does not appear, and based on the sound the plugin's previous setting seems to have returned to the default.  Can this be fixed?  Foobar v2 beta 13 64-bit, Windows 10 22h2.

Re: New VST adapter for foobar2000

Reply #20
How do we use this plugin in practice?
The only way I managed to use it is via Library, Configure, Playback, DSP manager, Active DSPs, ...., and manually choosing needed vst each time. I did not find any other way to see measuring panels/windows. I use Voxengo Span, AnSpec, Correlometer, Oscarizator, dpMeter5, Izotope Ozone Imager. To be able to see anything measured I must repeat the procedure described above each time. I also saved VST plugin in DSP chain presets and enabled DSP switcher on the Toolbar. I can pick VST plugin to be "used" but to no effect.
Do I miss some other, easier, more intuitive way to do it? If not, it would be nice to have such a way,

Re: New VST adapter for foobar2000

Reply #21
Ok, so I figured out that by double clicking the VST 2.x/3.x Adapter in the Available DSPs I could access the folders containing the VST effects. I'm using Izotope Ozone 9 advanced which I had previously tried to get working with Foobar2000 through using jBridger without success. So it's a huge step to be able to use this 64-bit application in the 64-bit version of Foobar2000.

Compared to running the VST effects 32-bit in Foobar2000 1.6.11 in the VST 2.4 adapter, the VST 2.x/3.x Adapter introduces noticeable lag in Foobar2000 2.0 beta with several seconds of silence to respond to changes. Starting playback after a stop takes a long time, approximately 6-8 seconds.

Only one VST effect can be run at a time, whereas in Foobar2000 1.6.13 with  VST 2.4 several effects can be run simultaneously, changes are immediate, and playback after stop starts immediately, too. However VST 2.4 only runs 32-bit and not VST3 applications.

Here's hoping that the speedy development of the 64-bit VST application continues so that it's soon comparable to the ease of use of VST effects with VST 2.4 in Foobar2000 v 1.6.

Re: New VST adapter for foobar2000

Reply #22
Compared to running the VST effects 32-bit in Foobar2000 1.6.11 in the VST 2.4 adapter, the VST 2.x/3.x Adapter introduces noticeable lag in Foobar2000 2.0 beta with several seconds of silence to respond to changes. Starting playback after a stop takes a long time, approximately 6-8 seconds.
What kind of changes?  I'm not seeing the re-starting playback lag you mention at all here.

Only one VST effect can be run at a time, whereas in Foobar2000 1.6.13 with  VST 2.4 several effects can be run simultaneously, changes are immediate, and playback after stop starts immediately, too. However VST 2.4 only runs 32-bit and not VST3 applications.
You can run several effects simultaneously, you just need to add another instance of VST 2/3 Adapter to the DSP chain with the additional VST plugin chosen.  I am doing that now, running LoudMax (a VST2) and Wider (a VST3) in the same chain:



Re: New VST adapter for foobar2000

Reply #23
Updated to .7 over .6 today, and right away noticed the absence of a configuration window
Yup, a) absence of VST configuration windows is new (UI-less VSTs?). b) For some reason Melda FX don't pass audio through. Fb2k is silenced.

Re: New VST adapter for foobar2000

Reply #24
Compared to running the VST effects 32-bit in Foobar2000 1.6.11 in the VST 2.4 adapter, the VST 2.x/3.x Adapter introduces noticeable lag in Foobar2000 2.0 beta with several seconds of silence to respond to changes. Starting playback after a stop takes a long time, approximately 6-8 seconds.
What kind of changes?  I'm not seeing the re-starting playback lag you mention at all here.

Only one VST effect can be run at a time, whereas in Foobar2000 1.6.13 with  VST 2.4 several effects can be run simultaneously, changes are immediate, and playback after stop starts immediately, too. However VST 2.4 only runs 32-bit and not VST3 applications.
You can run several effects simultaneously, you just need to add another instance of VST 2/3 Adapter to the DSP chain with the additional VST plugin chosen.  I am doing that now, running LoudMax (a VST2) and Wider (a VST3) in the same chain:




Thank you for the heads up on how to get multiple VSTs.  Now that I knew how that worked, I found that in F2k 2.0 beta with the VST 2.x/3.x Adapter I could only see one VST interface window at a time. To get another one up, I needed to close down the one in use. I need several open simultaneously.

With F2k 1.6.11 and the VST 2.4 I could have four or more windows up simultaneously enabling multiple visual monitoring along various dimensions. I could be changing parameters in one VST, and seeing how they play out in different VST tools simultaneously.  I wanted to make a comparison to F2k 20 beta with the new VST adapter.

So I set up trial using various VST tools, the main ones being Izotope Ozone 9 Advanced, and Izotope Ozone 8 Advanced. In F2k v 2.0 beta I used VST2, as well as VST3 versions, and 32-bit as well as 64-bit versions . In F2K 1.6.11 I used the VST 2.4 component to host the VST, and Ozone 8 Advanced 32-bit version.

I set up the comparison using Ozone 8 Advanced VST2 32-bit using the VST 2.x/3.x Adapter in F2k 2.0 beta, and VST 2.4 in F2k 1.16.11. Ozone can serve as a host to various VSTs from its own modules. I set up comparisons using their 8-band parametric equalizer with an initially flat frequency curve, which also displays phase delay, phase response, group delay; the Imager which shows the stereo image and few other things, the Maximizer enabling control of any clipping, and the Post EQ VST window showing what the total output looks like. So four VST tools inside the overall Ozone wrapper. I used identical VST-tools in both Foobar versions with the only difference being the VST adapters hosting them.

In F2k 1.6.11 with the VST 2.4 starting playback was immediate. Changing song, same thing. Modifying the VST view, say from the Equalizer to the Imager was equally immediate. Same when modifying the the parametric equalizer, sound immediately changes and everything works very smoothly.

In F2k 2.0 beta with the VST 2.x/3.x Adapter and the same Izotope Ozone 8 VST2 32-bit starting a track, or changing a track took between 5 - 6.5 seconds. This pauses sound. Modifying which VST is being viewed inside the Ozone host from the Equalizer to the Imager resulted in a 4.3-5 second delay.  So this was a straightforward comparison of identical settings.

I then proceeded to, in F2k 2.0 beta, try the Ozone 8 Advanced 32-bit VST3 version, using the same tools. This resulted in a delay of 5-5.6 seconds to start or change track. So the 32-bit VST3 was a little bit faster when changing tracks, but still substantial pauses. Changing which VST is viewed inside the Ozone host took 4.5-5 seconds.

Next I tried Ozone 9 Advanced VST3 64-bit in F2k 2.0 beta with the VST 2.x/3.x Adapter hosting. I was using three VST tools inside Ozone. Starting tracks was now down substantially mostly around 3 seconds, occasionally 4 seconds. Modifying parameters in the VST tools resulted in delays of 2-3.6 seconds, essentially twice as fast as the 32-bit version of Ozone 8.

I also tried Ozone 9 Advanced VST2 64-bit in F2k 2.0 beta with the VST 2.x/3.x Adapter hosting. It displayed equal times to the VST3 version.

I also tried stand alone modules from Izotope Ozone, and other providers. 64-bit VST2 and VST3 versions. Here stand alone VST2 version delays for changing tracks were around 3-3.5 seconds, and the VST3 version 2.5 seconds.  The shortest pause was 2.5 seconds. Other providers' tools introduced a 3 second pause when starting or changing tracks.

So in F2k 1.6.11 with the VST 2.4 component as host I'm presently running Ozone 8 32-bit with six VST-modules simultaneously. In addition two other VST monitoring modules are running, displaying visuals continuously. So all in all 8 VST-modules. Changing tracks, modifying parameters, are all without any delays.

I'm running Windows7 SP1, on a six core 3Ghz processor with 24GB of memory, software on SSD, tracks on hdd. This may have some influence, I don't know. It looks like available primary memory of 10GB is identical regardless of which set up I'm using.

To me the 64-bit version of Foobar2000 and this initial VST 2.x/3.x Adapter 0.7 version are among the best news I've had all year as it enabled me to try the Ozone 9 Advanced version. I hope there, in time, will be solutions available to the limitations I'm experiencing.