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Topic: Mr QuestionMan 0.6 released (Read 45911 times) previous topic - next topic
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Mr QuestionMan 0.6 released

Reply #25 –
Oh my. Where to start...

Miriam: First of all, I encourage anybody to improve Mr QuestionMan, after all, that is one of the reasons why it is released under the LGPL license. And I appreciate it.

BUT... I think it's essential that some rules are followed. I would have appreciated if you had contacted me before releasing anything. You are creating a mess, introducing bugs and features I would not have included (the Scan button).

And I definitely don't appreciate that you are releasing new versions of MY application. Matter of fact you have no right to do that.

That being said, I will take a look at your changes, and if useful include them in the next version. I'm open to work with you in the future, but it has to be done in a proper way.

Gambit

Mr QuestionMan 0.6 released

Reply #26 –
Quote
Quote
The modified version 0.7 is a bit slower than Gambit's 0.6. Moreover, it does not show which preset has been used or if it's an alpha.
[a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=282762"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

yep, but otherwise it's pretty nice. In addition, is it possible to display the *real* average bitrate? And not just the average bitrate for each file...for instance, if I have 2 files; one has a duration of 10 seconds and an average bitrate of 220kbps and the second one plays 600 seconds and has an average bitrate of 170kbps, the average bitrate according to Mr. Question Man would be 195kbps...however, the real average bitrate is only 170,8kbps...

thanks
[a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=282769"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]


Ehm, are you sure? AFAIK, MrQ *is* displaying the *real* average bitrate.

Mr QuestionMan 0.6 released

Reply #27 –
for me it's mainly a naming issue ... Miriam should have named his version V0.6.1 or at last V0.7a ... & add Contributor: Miriam in smaller font than Gambit ... I was a bit surprised to see Miriam's nick everywhere from the license to credit ... but I guess it's just an enthousiasm of youth error ...

how will Gambit name his next version now V0.8 ? V0.9 maybe if Miriam steal V0.8 with the speed issue fix ... no update for months & now 3 or maybe 4 versions in a row for not much compared to 0.6 ... just recursive scan ...

... recursive scan is very nice, thks ... but plz keep low profile ... take exemple on Aoyumi toward Monty, shut up & code  ... we'll love you even more like this !!!

Mr QuestionMan 0.6 released

Reply #28 –
Gambit, considering I use Mr.QuestionMan a lot and use WavPack v0.6 is a very welcome update

And I think Miriam's version would've been better labeled something like Mr.QuestionMan 0.6 Miriam version or something like that.
Nero AAC 1.5.1.0: -q0.45

Mr QuestionMan 0.6 released

Reply #29 –
Quote
You are creating a mess, introducing bugs and features I would not have included (the Scan button).


Bugs can be fixed. And introducing features you would not have included is the whole point of branching, isn't it?

Quote
And I definitely don't appreciate that you are releasing new versions of MY application. Matter of fact you have no right to do that.


There's a file called license.txt in the sources distribution that says he has ALL the rights to do that.



He never tried to claim that was official version - he actually clearly pointed out everywhere it was unofficial and modified by him (therefore abiding to any clause about not claiming it was endorsed by the original creator)

If you want, PM me and I'll give you another rundown of the LGPL.

Mr QuestionMan 0.6 released

Reply #30 –
Quote
I was a bit surprised to see Miriam's nick everywhere from the license to credit ... but I guess it's just an enthousiasm of youth error ...


Miriam is completely right about what he did!

Quoting the LGPL, paragraph 2 .b:

Quote
b) You must cause the files modified to carry prominent notices stating that you changed the files and the date of any change.




Edit: DreamTactix291's point is valid, but the LGPL has no provision about, if code is branched, it must be renamed or labeled. So, from a practical and legal point of view, Miriam is clean.

Actually, licenses can't even govern naming. Only trademark laws can. And as I guess Gambit has no trademark on "Mr QuestionMan"...

Mr QuestionMan 0.6 released

Reply #31 –
rjamorim:

indeed Miriam is in his full rights ... but still some modesty & diplomacy doesn't hurt ...

I don't argue on LGPL ... I argue about the way it was done ...

Quote From Miriam's Warning :
I am NOT responsible for any damages, sexual agressions or the like that
this program may produce

Gambit releases a new version post the announcement on HA, & someone come out from nowhere post a new version on the same day on the some HA topic, stealing allmost all the glory, just to discover a couple of hours later that it's buggy ... sorry but Mr Question was raped & if Gambit feels f*cked ... I totally agree with him ...

Mr QuestionMan 0.6 released

Reply #32 –
I was refering to the name. I don't know if the LGPL covers that, I'd think you can't have two applications with the same name. And I think it's obvious who has the right to claim the Mr QuestionMan name . If nothing else, it's an unethical.

I really don't like all that legal bs.
Oh, well, that's what you get when you mess with open source... 

Edit: Oh, and I knew you wouldn't be able to resist this thread Roberto .

Mr QuestionMan 0.6 released

Reply #33 –
Quote
I was refering to the name. I don't know if the LGPL covers that, I'd think you can't have two applications with the same name. And I think it's obvious who has the right to claim the Mr QuestionMan name . If nothing else, it's an unethical.


Yes, I also agree he should have at least mentioned more clearly it was a different breed of MrQ. But I won't judge, really.

Quote
Oh, well, that's what you get when you mess with open source... 
[a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=282852"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]


That too. Next time you ask me, I'll give you a more through guide on OS licenses

Quote
Edit: Oh, and I knew you wouldn't be able to resist this thread Roberto  .


Discussing licensing it just too cool. Specially since most other people are too uninterested to read them themselves (and I understand them, interpreting licenses and legalese is a huge pain)

Mr QuestionMan 0.6 released

Reply #34 –
Quote
Quote
Oh, well, that's what you get when you mess with open source... 
[a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=282852"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]


That too. Next time you ask me, I'll give you a more through guide on OS licenses
[a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=282853"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]


No, the last time we talked about the LGPL was regarding a different case.
The LGPL is really providing me with it's share of troubles... Open source zealots, where are you now?

Mr QuestionMan 0.6 released

Reply #35 –
I think if you're going to branch an actively developed program, you should change the name at least slightly (virtualdub -> virtualdubmod for example) just so theres no confusion about versions or who's doing bug fixes.

Also, bitching about free software released under open source license ?  Ever consider doing the rest of us a favor and killing yourself? 

Mr QuestionMan 0.6 released

Reply #36 –
Quote
No, the last time we talked about the LGPL was regarding a different case.
The LGPL is really providing me with it's share of troubles... Open source zealots, where are you now?
[a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=282854"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]


*cough*BSD*cough*

IMO, I'd personally keep MrQ somewhat closed-source (ie. open to people who request it  ). The back-end (all of the libraries) are all completely open-source, and that's the major component. MrQ's just a handy front-end to it all.

That said, thank you for the single app that makes foo_openwith useful for me, forever bound to the key of Fate (which is, obviously, F8  ).

Mr QuestionMan 0.6 released

Reply #37 –
Quote
The LGPL is really providing me with it's share of troubles... Open source zealots, where are you now?
[a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=282854"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]


Good luck finding an open source zealot that actually read and understood the GPL and LGPL. Most zealots I know of are that way just because all his nerd friends are, or because he (it's always he) is particularly fond of Stallman's hobo-look.

Mr QuestionMan 0.6 released

Reply #38 –
I wish there was something like this for VCD level MPEG video.

Mr QuestionMan 0.6 released

Reply #39 –
... I can't believe some end-users are requesting to close the source from a free software that they use because someone could download the code & improve it 

... I can't believe too that Gambit seems unhappy with the LGPL ...
you can't complaint about LGPL if you didn't read it !!! 

... free sofware licenses are usually uncontrollable, this is voluntary they were written so that you cannot take back your soft as you wish !!! it's either you give it to the community OR you don't ... there is no easy half-way & you can't give it one day & take it back the other day ... see Xchat troubles with being GPL on Linux & suddenly trying to become shareware on Windows ... it just made the whole community completly mad at Xchat developer recently ... I don't want Mr QuestionMan to look like that ...

... I just don't get it ... with free software it's usually simple ... either Gambit swallow Miriam or Miriam forks ... no magic ... the most determined coder always wins & the community wins with him ... when it's not a team work, free software is challenge ... do you fear Miriam ?

... for me the problem was Miriam's intrusive behavior ... not LGPL

Mr QuestionMan 0.6 released

Reply #40 –
Open Source is Open Source... so Miriam is entitled to do what he's done.  And if it results in an improved app in the long-term then that's cool too.

However, I do agree that it would've been nice and polite for Miriam to have contacted you (Gambit) to have simply informed you of his intentions.  That way you may be able to work together to learn off each other and as I've already said give us an even better app than you've already given us (which is good like). 

What most definitely should've been done would've been to have given the Miriam version a much better name.  Naming versions, and the strategy of, is very important.  It's not a 0.7 version - Miriam hasn't tweaked a Gambit MrQ 0.7 version.  He's tweaked a 0.6 version, and so it should be called 0.6a_miriam (or something similar).

Just my take on it.

Mr QuestionMan 0.6 released

Reply #41 –
Greetings!

First, sorry to Gambit. I admit, maybe I hurried up things due to youth enthusiasm.. as you said. I'm just 21, after all.
I think I should have notified Gambit about the modifications before post them.
Releasing it as Mr QuestionMan 0.7 was a mistake, I admit.
Regarding credits, I think i have the (moral) right to appear on them. Thanks Roberto for pointing out the LGPL licensing issues and his arguments on the fact that I do not violate Mr QuestionMan's LGPL licence.
Having all these said, now the news:

To make a better difference between the original Mr QuestionMan 0.6 and my work, I decided to rename my "mod" in Mr QuestionMan ME (ME = Miriam Edition).
So, a new baby has been born: Mr QuestionMan ME 0.6.2

Download it here (setup, source and zip):
(Dead link removed.)

Changes from Mr QuestionMan 0.7 to Mr QuestionMan ME 0.6.2
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
* Now called Mr QuestionMan ME (Miriam Edition)
* To avoid confusion, I labeled is as 0.6, and stated in About that this is
  A BRANCH of original version
+ ESC cancels scan
+ "Scan!" button becomes "Cancel scan" on scanning
+ Way fasteeeeer that previous version (actually, it should be as fast as
  Mr QuestionMan 0.6)
* Some changes in about
! Fixed a bug that may cause AV error on startup when last browsed directory
  was in the meantime deleted or became invalid
! Fixed an "Out of list bounds" bug which appeared ocasionally on scanning
* Some changes in setup

MORE TO COME!!! (still, I think not that often)
(I have many *cool* ideas on how to improve Mr QuestionMan, but I think, as in Gambit's case also, it's a time issue)

Hope you like it!
Cheers!

Mr QuestionMan 0.6 released

Reply #42 –
@Miriam

Firstly, thank you for implementing the subfolder scanning.  It's already proved useful by pointing out some rogue MP3s I had.  I also like the Scan/Autoscan idea.

However, the manner in which the "Scan level" works appears confused.

I store most of my music in an "<artist>\<album>" folder setup - yet if I set the level to 3 it only picks up a few folders.  I think it must pick up just the first folder that has 3 levels ("<root>\<album>\<artist>").

I would have said a "Scan level" of 3 should pick up all folders at this level.

Any chance this will be updated in Mr QuestionMan ME 0.6.3 XP Pro II?
I'm on a horse.

Mr QuestionMan 0.6 released

Reply #43 –
The question is not one of legality - the LGPL gives Miriam the full right to modify and release modified versions of Gambit's code. However, it is rude (and possibly illegal, depending on whether it is trademarked and the country in question) to continue to call it Mr. Q.

For example (with GPL licence, but it doesn't matter in this case). I could take the source to the Linux kernel, make a token change and release it as CabbageOS, as long as I complied with the terms of the licence. However, I can't release my modified version as Linux because the name is a trademark which I am not licenced to use. In short, the code is covered by the licence, but the name of the product is not.

It is a purely cultural issue, that many people aren't aware of, but it is considered bad form to fork open source projects except in very exceptional circumstances. Certainly adding a minor feature would not prompt such a move in most projects. The correct thing to do would be to submit a patch to the author and wait for them to include it in the next release. Sure, this slows down the development cycle somewhat, but it does give development a sense of direction - one maintainer (or a group) control the direction of the project and provide a single repository for the code.

Imagine, for a second, if the people who added USB support to the Linux kernel forked it. Then a second fork was made for Serial ATA support. And a third group released a kernel with a different scheduler. There would be so many different kernels at different levels of quality with common and different bugs that all would be useless. Sure, it takes a bit longer to bet USB support through Linus, but it keeps the whole project moving forward. While it would be legal to release thousands of forks, it isn't a Good Idea.

So Miriam, all users of Mr Q certainly appreciate the features you have added. For the good of the project, please merge code with Gambit as soon as possible and switch to a more traditional open source development model.

rjamorim: I consider myself an Open Source zealot. I have read (and understood) both the GPL and LGPL. Supporting Open Source for me is not because my "nerd friends" think it's cool or because I like Stallman (although I do respect the man). I support Open Source because of the fact that, as an Engineering and science student, I am very concerned with academic and intellectual freedom and believe that Open Source and Free Software could play a major role in ensuring freedom from the oppressive Intellectual Property laws which currently threaten free (libre) research and development. I would appreciate it if you would not make such sweeping (and incorrect) generalisations in future.

Mr QuestionMan 0.6 released

Reply #44 –
 I like improvements () but is this really the way to go, modifying the code made by someone in a lot of time and then get some rapture cause your launched baby is still a bit better as you investigated some time in adding/correcting the pre-made.
It's like taking a beautiful ornate wardrobe and add some further ornaments and then pushing this wardrobe as selfmade 
Even though Miriam renamed the prog and rethought what he had done, I would let the Miriam-edition rest, give the modifications to Gambit and start a co-coding, what needs some communication and arrangement of course.

More or less I started this reply to tell about a bug in Mr QuestionMan 0.6 (Gambit), even though I guess Miriam has fixed this bug, it's about the 'Index out of bound'-bug.
I scanned a folder, 421 files in it, and pressing on the columns-header to sort by Encoder or whatever, an error-message 'Index out of bound (..)' (or sth. like this as far as I remember of what happend at home) came up.
This does not happen in folders with 15 files.

Good coding and co-operation 

Mr QuestionMan 0.6 released

Reply #45 –
Quote
@Miriam

Firstly, thank you for implementing the subfolder scanning.  It's already proved useful by pointing out some rogue MP3s I had.  I also like the Scan/Autoscan idea.

However, the manner in which the "Scan level" works appears confused.

I store most of my music in an "<artist>\<album>" folder setup - yet if I set the level to 3 it only picks up a few folders.  I think it must pick up just the first folder that has 3 levels ("<root>\<album>\<artist>").

I would have said a "Scan level" of 3 should pick up all folders at this level.

Any chance this will be updated in Mr QuestionMan ME 0.6.3 XP Pro II?
[a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=282930"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Thanks for report. It was due a bug in directory scanning procedure.
Updated. Same v0.6.2. Please re-download.

Mr QuestionMan 0.6 released

Reply #46 –
I just know that I have subfolder scanning now, and i like it.

Are you saying that open source is great, but you can't modify the source without working in tandem with the original programmer?  I agree the 0.7 release was a mistake, but I don't see a problem with 0.6.2 ME.  My only hope is that Gambit doesn't stop working on it as well, as it has been suggested that he was uncertain whether to continue the development previous to this.

For those of us too lazy to know, what is a "more traditional open source development model".  Does this suggest that Miriam and Gambit would have to work as a team with source control on the same code?  Do either of them want that model?  Forgive my ignorance if this is far from the case.

@Miriam

Just saw your response while previewing this post.  Thanks for the speedy service... 
I'm on a horse.

Mr QuestionMan 0.6 released

Reply #47 –
Quote
I like improvements () but is this really the way to go, modifying the code made by someone in a lot of time and then get some rapture cause your launched baby is still a bit better as you investigated some time in adding/correcting the pre-made.
It's like taking a beautiful ornate wardrobe and add some further ornaments and then pushing this wardrobe as selfmade 
Even though Miriam renamed the prog and rethought what he had done, I would let the Miriam-edition rest, give the modifications to Gambit and start a co-coding, what needs some communication and arrangement of course.

To be clear, I didn't steal someone else's work and launched it as "a new baby". My MODIFIED version is called Mr QuestionMan ME, and I stated in readme and also in about that this is A BRANCH of Gambit's work. I didn't remove any copyright messages or else, just add some credits to me. Also, if it were named differently, I surely would infringe the LGPL licence.
I give Gambit the right (and I encourage him) to freely implement in the original version the modifications made by me, even without the need to notify me. We all want a better Mr QuestionMan, aren't we? Still, some modifications I made may remaine specific to ME, as Gambit, for example, said he wouldn't implement a "Scan" button.

Quote
More or less I started this reply to tell about a bug in Mr QuestionMan 0.6 (Gambit), even though I guess Miriam has fixed this bug, it's about the 'Index out of bound'-bug.
I scanned a folder, 421 files in it, and pressing on the columns-header to sort by Encoder or whatever, an error-message 'Index out of bound (..)' (or sth. like this as far as I remember of what happend at home) came up.
This does not happen in folders with 15 files.

I think this problem is fixed in Mr QuestionMan ME 0.6.2. Still, some confirmation is welcomed.

Quote
Good coding and co-operation 
[a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=282941"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Mr QuestionMan 0.6 released

Reply #48 –
Quote
I think this problem is fixed in Mr QuestionMan ME 0.6.2. Still, some confirmation is welcomed.

I have 381 files here (work), and the column header acts as expected.

Edit: Shouldn't we really move any 0.6.x ME-specific discussion to its [a href='index.php?showtopic=32441']own thread[/a], and any open source/copyright-related discussion to a new thread?.  This thread should really be for feature requests and feeback for 0.6.  It's getting way too confusing.  Could a moderator consider this problem please?
I'm on a horse.

Mr QuestionMan 0.6 released

Reply #49 –
I wait for the day to see my modified double my parentz and some other will love a bit more, hope so... if the good ol' man and his tuning factory will get it
I will not be able to confirm it - it will not change your life *bow*

..aah, Synthetic    can (of course, it's phun)