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Topic: Foobar 1.4 beta 1 - couple of comments (Read 8541 times) previous topic - next topic
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Foobar 1.4 beta 1 - couple of comments

Peter, there is nothing better as a gift for Christmas than a new foobar version :) . Thank you kindly :)

However - I have some comments and I think I might found slight bug.

1. The supposed bug (or feature :)  :
There is new value "Maximum presents in context menu" for Converter, in Advanced preferences. Default value is 20. Well, it seems I have few more than 20 and it resulted in fact that I have seen no presents at all without opening full Converter dialog. Is it supposed to be like that? I expected that it will cut the list just to first N presents or that maybe each preset will have additional checkbox "show in presets list". In current state there is just "nothing or all" choice, depending how big number you define in Adv prefs.

2. Comments:
- for DSP manager: I would welcome to still have "Up" and "Down" buttons as an alternative to drag and drop. I have also seen post in this forum from a blind user of foobar, who uses it with text reader. If I understand correctly without buttons he is unable to order the list.
- for Decoders order:  I would welcome to still have "Up" and "Down" buttons as an alternative to drag and drop - same as above. Plus I would like to ask why all these SNESAPU, GEP, ZXTUNE etc decoders aren't visible? Is this matter of some API updates that could enable their visibility in this window when components will use certain (newly introduced) function?

This is just for now - if anything else will come out in usage I will report it back.

Re: Foobar 1.4 beta 1 - couple of comments

Reply #1 –
Well, I found something weird, but I don't know if it is v 1.4 fault or if it was present in previous version too...
There is a repeated crash when you do following things:
- open foobar
- add "Skip Silence" DSP into chain (built in, not Case's external version)
- start playback OR not start playback
- go to menu bar and choose: "View" / "DSP" / "Skip Silence"
- crash appears almost immediately

All crashes have the same reason stated in crash dump files:
Crash location:
Module: KERNELBASE
Offset: C54Fh
Symbol: "RaiseException" (+58h)

No other DSPs that I daily use cause this (romor's Dynamic DSP, lvqcl's Graphic Equalizer, mudlord's Playback / Tempo / Pitch shifters). It only happens when I choose "Skip Silence" to be viewed from main menu. At the same time I can configure it when I go directly to DSP Manager in Preferences and click on "..." next to "Skip Silence".

Re: Foobar 1.4 beta 1 - couple of comments

Reply #2 –
Quote from: EpicForever on
Plus I would like to ask why all these SNESAPU, GEP, ZXTUNE etc decoders aren't visible? Is this matter of some API updates that could enable their visibility in this window when components will use certain (newly introduced) function?
Requires changes to the component and a new SDK.

Quote from: EpicForever on
There is a repeated crash when you do following things:
- open foobar
- add "Skip Silence" DSP into chain (built in, not Case's external version)
- start playback OR not start playback
- go to menu bar and choose: "View" / "DSP" / "Skip Silence"
- crash appears almost immediately
Note that this View menu DSP shortcut isn't native feature in foobar2000. I believe it comes from @mudlord 's Effect DSP component.

Re: Foobar 1.4 beta 1 - couple of comments

Reply #3 –
I think you're wrong @Case . I removed foo_dsp_effect and started foobar. And this menu persists (while DSP effects from mudlord's package only show empty entries in DSP tree and invoked menu). And I am sure it was present at least in v 1.3.16. I don't have time at the moment to check with which version it appeared for the first time.

EDIT:
Ah, and by the way - I crashed foobar again, with mudlord's DSP effect NOT present, by doing the same thing as previously. Exactly the same error appeared.
OK, I have found the culprit. Webpage that have opened after crash occurred was right - it is foo_vst's fault. It is foo_vst which adds this menu and after removing it from config that menu disappears.
OK, we know the overall problem source, but here is the question - why external DSPs are not causing this crash, while inbuilt one does? For me this menu is very useful, I wasn't aware that it comes from 3rd party component, I thought it came somewhere in v 1.3.x...  I very rarely use main functionalities of this plugin, but now knowing it adds this menu I am highly reluctant for deleting it...
[EDIT ENDS HERE]

I have question regarding current development path:
I noticed that now in foobar's installation directory there is ca 50 DLLs. And they all are loaded when app starts. Doesn't it work towards 128 DLLs limit and further limits how many input/effect/utility plugins we can have added to the app?

Re: Foobar 1.4 beta 1 - couple of comments

Reply #4 –
Looks like a regression that was causing a shit ton of crashes with the converter is fixed in the beta.  I didn't notice it until a couple of days ago (and a whole day of grief) with a certain combination of DSPs and that goes back a few versions.

foobar2000 1.4 beta 1 fixed that.

It also brings up a checkbox asking which files I want to overwrite if files with the same name are in the destination directory.  Nice.

Re: Foobar 1.4 beta 1 - couple of comments

Reply #5 –
Quote from: EpicForever on
OK, I have found the culprit. Webpage that have opened after crash occurred was right - it is foo_vst's fault. It is foo_vst which adds this menu and after removing it from config that menu disappears.
Ah, memory error then. I see now that foo_dsp_effect only lists its own DSPs in the main menu. I remembered mudlord talking about the menu causing crashing in the past so made a mis-association.

Quote from: EpicForever on
OK, we know the overall problem source, but here is the question - why external DSPs are not causing this crash, while inbuilt one does?
Probably luck. It does something incorrectly and it sometimes works and sometimes doesn't. Possibly depending on the memory location of the dlls.

Quote from: EpicForever on
I have question regarding current development path:
I noticed that now in foobar's installation directory there is ca 50 DLLs. And they all are loaded when app starts. Doesn't it work towards 128 DLLs limit and further limits how many input/effect/utility plugins we can have added to the app?
The player and the bundled components now use dynamic C-runtime linking. The limit you talk about isn't DLL limit but FLS limit. Each dll that uses static C-runtime allocates new FLS slots but components using dynamic runtime all share the same slots. The change allows using more components.

I posted new builds of most of my components specifically for foobar2000 v1.4 to further help reduce the FLS slot usage. You can find them here: https://hydrogenaud.io/index.php/topic,115163.msg949940.html#msg949940.

Re: Foobar 1.4 beta 1 - couple of comments

Reply #6 –
OK, so do I get correctly, that to fully benefit from this new development path all plugins developers should switch to dynamic C-runtime linking (as I assume now everybody use static linking when coding for foobar...)?

Re: Foobar 1.4 beta 1 - couple of comments

Reply #7 –
Full benefit comes from that. But that includes the benefit of reduced component size. The more statically linked components you replace with dynamic runtime using ones the more available FLS slots you have for everything else.

But the dynamic linking requires the user to either have foobar2000 v1.4 that bundles the required runtime dlls or manually installing the runtime redistributable. Component repository needs changes perhaps so it can offer statically linked components for people using older foobar2000 version.

Re: Foobar 1.4 beta 1 - couple of comments

Reply #8 –
Quote from: EpicForever on
(romor's Dynamic DSP, lvqcl's Graphic Equalizer, mudlord's Playback / Tempo / Pitch shifters).
Graphic Equalizer developer is xnor :D
| QAAC ~ 192 kbps |

Re: Foobar 1.4 beta 1 - couple of comments

Reply #9 –
Well, I'm the one who always starts setting up new OS installation from applying all M$ updates first, then all VC++ CRTs starting from v. 2005 , then drivers... then anything else. From time to time I am looking for updates for all these CRTs - like a while ago. But that's just me, I don't expect others to go that way.
So I assume, at least for a couple of non-further-maintained plugins we will never achieve certain benefits coming from fopobar's internal changes and there will be still some concern about FLS or TLS slots... Similarly to listing some of them in "decoder components order" (when/if SDK will be updated).

And sorry for messing developer name for Graphic Equalizer :) . That's indeed xnor.

Re: Foobar 1.4 beta 1 - couple of comments

Reply #10 –
The foo_vst bug is caused by shittastic code on the VST wrapper dev's part for that menu. The code done in that plugin is extremely moronic.

My old code for dsp_effect used to use the identical method, but ever since I worked out how to enumerate/alter/add DSP instances to the DSP chain *properly* and without crashes (using documented and proper means), thats no longer a problem.

Re: Foobar 1.4 beta 1 - couple of comments

Reply #11 –
I noticed one more thing when looking into Console. It happens when process of waveform signature extraction runs in the background. A lot of similar errors:

DCA decode error: Invalid deficit sample count (..\..\libdcadec\core_decoder.c : 103)
Error parsing DTS packet: Unsupported feature
(mostly occuring)

DCA decode error: Invalid number of PCM sample blocks (123) (..\..\libdcadec\core_decoder.c : 113)
Error parsing DTS packet: Unsupported feature
(number of blocks sometimes is different - like 119. Occurs rarely than above error)

DCA decode error: Unsupported audio channel arrangement (62) (..\..\libdcadec\core_decoder.c : 127)
Error parsing DTS packet: Unsupported feature
(seems to be very rare)


All these files are CD sourced, stereo files, encoded with various versions of FLAC.
I am not sure what should I blame - foobar's core, HDCD decoder (I noticed in the past it sometimes interfere with DTS files), DTS decoder, or Waveform Seekbar?

The truth is that of course I am unable to tell if this happened in the past or is is specifics of v 1.4. I just accidentally ordered foobar to extract seekbar signatures for a very long playlist and at the moment I am bit reluctant to kill this process, as I am not sure what final state I will achieve (if wavecache.db would be broken or not). Plus this is not straightforward procedure.

Re: Foobar 1.4 beta 1 - couple of comments

Reply #12 –
Quote from: EpicForever on
- for DSP manager: I would welcome to still have "Up" and "Down" buttons as an alternative to drag and drop. I have also seen post in this forum from a blind user of foobar, who uses it with text reader. If I understand correctly without buttons he is unable to order the list.
- for Decoders order:  I would welcome to still have "Up" and "Down" buttons as an alternative to drag and drop - same as above.
I use Foobar with screen reader and would welcome the buttons back too. I also can't browse the lists in both DSP and Decoders pages, as they aren't identified as lists by the screen reader.
The new controls in the Search dialog aren't accessible too.

This is what I found so far, there might be more of this in the areas I haven't checked yet...

Thanks.

Re: Foobar 1.4 beta 1 - couple of comments

Reply #13 –
Quote from: EpicForever on
I am not sure what should I blame - foobar's core, HDCD decoder (I noticed in the past it sometimes interfere with DTS files), DTS decoder, or Waveform Seekbar?
Those messages come from the DTS decoder and you would have had them with earlier foobar2000 version too.

Re: Foobar 1.4 beta 1 - couple of comments

Reply #14 –
I see that smooth scroll removed from Default UI. Any reason, why?

Re: Foobar 1.4 beta 1 - couple of comments

Reply #15 –
Beta 2 posted, various bugs have been addressed, and some new minor features added - see change log.

Regarding smooth scrolling, I thought it was annoying when enabled; it was removed as a part of code cleanup as the playlist code is now reused all over the app. If it's wanted badly enough, I'll re-add it.

Regarding screen readers - the issues are known and on my todo list.
Microsoft Windows: We can't script here, this is bat country.

Re: Foobar 1.4 beta 1 - couple of comments

Reply #16 –
Regarding smooth scrolling (my personal 2c) :
I am a fan of giving user an option what/how application should do. Is it possible to have a checkbox in Preferences/Display/DUI or maybe in Adv prefs to enable/disable smooth scrolling? Personally I would keep it disabled...

Re: Foobar 1.4 beta 1 - couple of comments

Reply #18 –
Regarding smooth scrolling, that's fine if it's removed from Default UI since it affect visualisations and I guess not much people enable it. I personally enabled it as I don't use any visualisations on foobar2000. Anyway If I need it again, I could just install SimPlaylist and it performs well with visualisations enabled.

Re: Foobar 1.4 beta 1 - couple of comments

Reply #19 –
1.4 beta 2 has problems with seeking in mka. It randomly skips some chapters. Enabling "Slow but accurate seeking" make situation even worse. 1.3.16 works OK.
For example, in this video you can see that 1.4 skips to 9 chapter when i'm trying to play 3rd chapter (and with option "Slow but accurate seeking" enabled it completely skips all chapters when i'm trying to play 2nd chapter): https://youtu.be/dMKVtCVBH1A
I also tried clean portable installation but it didn't help.

Re: Foobar 1.4 beta 1 - couple of comments

Reply #20 –
issue with DSP manager
I just installed  Effect DSP components and Available DSPs are not sorted into alphabetical order like latest stable. I think Available DSPs looks better if its sorted and maybe also turn off drag and drop on this part. Maybe there's another better suggestion for this. Thank you. Regards :)

Re: Foobar 1.4 beta 1 - couple of comments

Reply #21 –
The idea is that you can keep most used DSPs at the top of the list for easy usage. Right click context menu has command to sort the list alphabetically. New one pops on top so it's easy to find.

Re: Foobar 1.4 beta 1 - couple of comments

Reply #22 –
Thanks Case for explain, I finally understood. I didn't realize there's right-click behavior before and thanks for mention it. Regards. :)
 

Re: Foobar 1.4 beta 1 - couple of comments

Reply #23 –
Thanks for screen reader improvements in beta 3.
Would it be possible to add something like Add to active DSPs / Remove from active DSPs to the DSP Manager context menus? I figured out that Enter and Delete works but it might be perhaps more user friendly for some users relying on keyboard-only operation.

Re: Foobar 1.4 beta 1 - couple of comments

Reply #24 –
I had to register an account just to say THANK YOU SO MUCH for adding the output switcher to the menu bar. I've wasted so much time going through the preferences and adjusting, and it was recently compounded by me finally buying speakers for my computer (as opposed to using just headphones for 15+ years). Most meaningful Foobar2000 improvement to me in ages.