HydrogenAudio

I am pleased to announce that Nero has released big update of Nero package just few minutes ago.

http://www.nero.com/nero7/eng/11793.html (http://www.nero.com/nero7/eng/11793.html)

List of the new and updated features is quite impressive, but for HA users I think the most interesting update is completely new AAC encoder in the Nero Burning Rom / Wave Editor and SoundTrax.

This update represents a new Nero 7 milestone in the long list of free monthly updates! It is packed with new features for your favorite applications and even offers Blu-ray Disc data recording support.

In addition to this update, there will be one major suprise this week, especially targeted to audio communities. So, stay tuned.

Could you give more information about the new AAC encoder? What are the changes? Are there new features?

The new AAC encoder sounds great, but is it worth the hassle of a mandatory NeroHome & ShowTime?
If Nero shipped with a version of NCAB I'd be all over this one

edit - almost forgot Nero scout!  There are instructions to delete most of the unwanted features (remind anybody of Roxio in the bad old days?) but this is too much work.
Something like this would be ideal:  http://www.msfn.org/board/index.php?act=ST&f=80&t=44603 (http://www.msfn.org/board/index.php?act=ST&f=80&t=44603)

Hard to say what has been changed as the whole encoder and the plug-in for Nero are completely new

Encoder is built on our new technology, it supports ABR, CBR and quality-based VBR coding modes and it fixes issues that were known with the old encoder - it should also be noticeably faster than the old AAC encoder.

It supports HE-AAC, HE-AAC v2 and LC-AAC.  SBR mode has been proven to be leading the HE-AAC encoder race, and hopefully LC-AAC in this new AAC will follow, as the ABR bug is fixed.

Also, as I mentioned - there will be an additional big surprise for audio communities, which will also add the first in the world public 2-pass AAC encoding as well as some very hot things - but about this, I will give more details later this week

The new AAC encoder sounds great, but is it worth the hassle of a mandatory NeroHome & ShowTime?

Nero Home and ShowTime are also great products

But - yes, for AAC lovers there will be a very nice surprise this week which might help in this case, too

But - yes, for AAC lovers there will be a very nice surprise this week which might help in this case, too

Is it that what I think it is?

Oh come on. I'll be the first one to admit that it's bloated. But.. The installer is 100MB. In the age of broadband, that is nothing.

Some people don't have access to such technologies (for financial or geographic reason). I recall that the full package is necessary even for correcting a small bug. There's probably a solution for pleasing people who can't easily download 124 MB (Nero 7.0 was 100 MB: from where are these 24 MB coming from? BluRay support?) and that's probably why people are complaining about. Imaging Windows Update forcing people to download 1GB each month because we're in the broadband age  Bugfixes are mostly available for less than 1 MB - thus available for everyone.

Well, the only thing that disturbs me is that Nero doesn't officially offer BT downloads (or do they?). I am currently downloading at 10 KB/s although I could download 20x faster than that. Going to offer a torrent after having the file on my HDD.

Well, the only thing that disturbs me is that Nero doesn't officially offer BT downloads (or do they?).

Please check the facts, before complaining. Thanks. BT support has been offered for several months.

http://nero-mirror.com/software/Nero7/7.2....ytb.exe.torrent (http://nero-mirror.com/software/Nero7/7.2.0.3/Nero-7.2.0.3_all_no_ytb.exe.torrent)

Edit: Unfortunately, that server is *also* overloaded by now 

(Nero 7.0 was 100 MB: from where are these 24 MB coming from? BluRay support?)

Working online updates 

Edit: *sigh*

Hard to say what has been changed as the whole encoder and the plug-in for Nero are completely new

Encoder is built on our new technology, it supports ABR, CBR and quality-based VBR coding modes and it fixes issues that were known with the old encoder - it should also be noticeably faster than the old AAC encoder.

It supports HE-AAC, HE-AAC v2 and LC-AAC.  SBR mode has been proven to be leading the HE-AAC encoder race, and hopefully LC-AAC in this new AAC will follow, as the ABR bug is fixed.

Also, as I mentioned - there will be an additional big surprise for audio communities, which will also add the first in the world public 2-pass AAC encoding as well as some very hot things - but about this, I will give more details later this week

Thanks for answering
What about the VBR profiles? Are they still present or are they replaced by something else (like a slider alla faac, vorbis, mpc...)? Could you be more precise about the gain speed (I know it usually depends on CPU, but an approximative % would be nice)? Is Intensity Stereo available for low-bitrate LC encodings?

To be honest, I kinda liked Nero 4 and 5 best. I had OEM Versions (and still have a Nero 6 OEM) and the reason why I always preferred Nero to WinOnCD, especially in the days of Nero 4 was the size and the functionality. I think Nero 4 was 10 MB to download. I can imagine that there are some people like me who don't need all these media thingies. I'd like to try out Nero AAC (though I don't own a DAP that supports it) and use the burning interface. I don't need a media center. I don't need Nero Video, as I use x264. To be honest, I don't even need Nero AAC, but I'd like to try it . Not that Nero's current way is a wrong one; I'm pretty sure there are people out there who like it, but I'd better like a non- bloated version, the same (burning)capabilities, but less eyecandy etc.

http://nero-mirror.com/software/Nero7/7.2....ytb.exe.torrent (http://nero-mirror.com/software/Nero7/7.2.0.3/Nero-7.2.0.3_all_no_ytb.exe.torrent)

Wow, 542 megabytes for an update! Sounds reasonable!
</sarcasm>

Really, aren't there smaller packages? BTW, I couldn't find the BT links on Nero's homepage.

Quote from: Ivan Dimkovic on 2006-04-25 18:14:45

Hard to say what has been changed as the whole encoder and the plug-in for Nero are completely new

Encoder is built on our new technology, it supports ABR, CBR and quality-based VBR coding modes and it fixes issues that were known with the old encoder - it should also be noticeably faster than the old AAC encoder.

It supports HE-AAC, HE-AAC v2 and LC-AAC.  SBR mode has been proven to be leading the HE-AAC encoder race, and hopefully LC-AAC in this new AAC will follow, as the ABR bug is fixed.

Also, as I mentioned - there will be an additional big surprise for audio communities, which will also add the first in the world public 2-pass AAC encoding as well as some very hot things - but about this, I will give more details later this week

Thanks for answering
What about the VBR profiles? Are they still present or are they replaced by something else (like a slider alla faac, vorbis, mpc...)? Could you be more precise about the gain speed (I know it usually depends on CPU, but an approximative % would be nice)? Is Intensity Stereo available for low-bitrate LC encodings?

VBR profiles are now working as the full quality scale.  As far as the speed goes I have no exact figures here  as it has been long time I checked the old encoder out, but I'll see if I can dig something.

Quote from: Garf on 2006-04-25 19:17:30

http://nero-mirror.com/software/Nero7/7.2....ytb.exe.torrent (http://nero-mirror.com/software/Nero7/7.2.0.3/Nero-7.2.0.3_all_no_ytb.exe.torrent)

Wow, 542 megabytes for an update! Sounds reasonable!
</sarcasm>

Really, aren't there smaller packages? BTW, I couldn't find the BT links on Nero's homepage.

It's 120M as noted above. Only the all languages thing is so big. BT links are in "Download Mirrors"

OK, I think I will have to correct my statement a bit. I have nothing against the installer, if it would actually work. When I unselect something, it usually means that I DON'T want it installed. Not in the Nero world:
(http://www.burrrn.net/stuff/nero.png)

Nero Scout ? seems like a search files function but you can disable it.

Nero Scout ? seems like a search files function but you can disable it.

The point is, I didn't even install it. So why should I have to disable it now?

Not sure if you need my help, but here is a hint:

(http://www.maresweb.de/miscellaneous/neroscout.png)

Nero Scout ? seems like a search files function but you can disable it.

Which is another reason I have to dick around with hijackthis and spybot after installing beasts like this.

Ahead's problem is they consider their bloat to not be a problem, but only in isolation. Real, Microsoft, Adobe and countless other companies assume that you want all theirs too - their startup items and 'search' bars, automatic indexing (with associated system tray icons), automatic 'updates' that remind you to buy the new version... etc. In isolation they're tolerable, but when >1 of these fat apps is installed together they hog resources and make my machine take appreciably longer to load and run stuff.

This is on top of the huge Creative audio drivers, plus the digital camera ones with their media detectors and online printing service links, printer tray applets and toner reminders, antivirus apps with their ridiculous 100mb+ installs and multiple tray icons... etc.

Ahead has great developers, I just don't like their marketing department.

Ivan, I see you cannot "fine-tune" the encoder using the Nero front-end any longer, which I see as a plus since the old dialog was buggy and confusing.
I take that the encoder triggers SBR and PS according to the target bitrate desired, but when is it actually triggered?

Great! 

2 pass mode in future?

Yes,  encoder now decides which mode is the best for the bit-rate.

SBR/PS trigger depends on few parameters, but for 44.1 kHz, Stereo it happens at:

- SBR is used for bit-rates less than 96 kbps
- PS is used for bit-rates less than 48 kbps

The point is, I didn't even install it.

This is automatically installed with (choose what you want here below) :

• Nero PhotoSnap
     
• Nero Burning ROM
     
• Nero Express
     
• Nero Vision
     
• Nero SoundTrax
     
• Nero WaveEditor

So why should I have to disable it now?

to avoid to be paranoid ?? 

Great! 

2 pass mode in future?

This week most likely

EDIT.... ivan beat me to it

hundreds of megabytes while most of this forum are just concerned for few kilobytes.

Bloat my system babe!  --I dont touch this thing

i don't get your points - it isn't so huge......

i live in a village, where is a verry poor internet coverage - i'm conected on a mobile phone and it will take 4 hours to download it...

you should turn on the download and check it next morning - so will do i....

I have downloaded the new version.
I have installed and go right to the encoder. There i see a line, from left to right, that tells me "encoder quality" kbs, small size----high quality.
Is this normal? 
Than i have put one mp3 for encoding, choose the highest quality [440 kbs] (just fot test) and...after a few seconds....i have a brand new file @ 224kbs

You know, I don't really care that much about having to download 130 MB or whatever it is, even though my "broadband" is dog slow. What bothers me more is that I'm forced to download things I don't need. You're slowing me down, because you force me to install these useless things, that you think I want.

I haven't seriously tried Nero 7 yet, but I get the feeling from this thread, that you can now mostly choose what components you want. That's great. There's nothing I hate more than applications doing things behind my back. Installing useless services, stealing associations, and putting retarded toolbars and widgets all over. I just want to record files to a disk. Why can't I have a say in the matter? Some people want all of this, and that's fine, but I and many others don't, so accept that not everyone want's your packaged multimedia solution and give us a choice.

I'm not questioning the competence of Nero developers... I figure some mouth breather in marketing concocted this scheme.

Quote from: Gambit on 2006-04-25 20:34:53

The point is, I didn't even install it.

This is automatically installed with (choose what you want here below) :

• Nero PhotoSnap
     
• Nero Burning ROM
     
• Nero Express
     
• Nero Vision
     
• Nero SoundTrax
     
• Nero WaveEditor

Quote from: Gambit on 2006-04-25 20:34:53

So why should I have to disable it now?

to avoid to be paranoid ?? 

Here's a solution for Nero Scout. (http://www.help2go.com/Tutorials/Software_Utilities/Disable_Nero_Scout_in_Nero_7.html)  It's a bloody nuisance, & the reason why my copy of Nero 7 has lain dormant in favour of Nero 6.6.  If you use NCAB you can get Recode2, Nero Burning ROM, NVE all in about 26MB total size.  The point is, that extra 100MB is basically useless cruft.  Even Microsoft Office (the crowned king of bloat) doesn't install crap you explicitly UNcheck during the setup procedure.

I'm installing v7 today for use with MeGUI.  See what those low bitrates can do.  Testing now.....

I have it! After 7h40minutes, yeah!

I can't use it anymore with foobar2000 0.9.1. So I can't compare the speed in the same way. I tested it with one file:
- aac 4.2.4.8 = speed was between x5.8 and x7.3; avg=x6.3
- aac Apr 19 2006 = speed is between x6.5 and x8; avg=???
Speed is ~15% faster on my computer

I just finished my first encodings, at 128 kbps (is it ABR or VBR? The bitrate's fluctuation is limited according to faad_test). Quality is pleasant of course. Some previous issues I noticed in the past are not present anymore:
- distortions with highly tonal instrument (organ, bagpipe) are gone or highly reduced and without any bloat anymore [for memory: older encoders were excellent with "fast" mode but bitrate was used to explode]
- ringing with low volume signal is also not an issue anymore.

I nevertheless noticed irritating smearing with different samples. If people are interested to check if I'm not dreaming:

- Nero Digital (http://gurusamples2.free.fr/ndaac/S15_KEYBOARD_Harpsichord_E.mp4)
- iTunes (http://gurusamples2.free.fr/ndaac/S15_KEYBOARD_Harpsichord_E.m4a)

There are also audible problems with micro-impulse like signal, but considering the bitrate, it's more or less the case for all encoders/formats.

Much more anedoctal: the ultra-low 16 kbps bitrate sounds weird. Considering the bitrate it must be normal, but... Winamp's encoder sounds very differently. In comparison, the new Nero suffer from a strong "underwater" effect (whereas Winamp's/CT AAC is very scr...scrr...scratchy).

Nero 16 kbps (http://gurusamples2.free.fr/ndaac/V06_CHORUS_Mixed_B_Nero_16kbps.mp4)
Winamp 16 kbps (http://gurusamples2.free.fr/ndaac/V06_CHORUS_Mixed_B_Winamp_16kbps.m4a)

So, could anyone tell me why i have a 244 kbs file, after reencoding an mp3 to mp4 @ 440 kbs?
A few posts upper, i have told you a few more things about this problem. thanx

Tried with a short sample at different bitrate:

200 => 189 kbps
240 => 210 kbps
280 => 223 kbps
320 => 252 kbps
360 => 261 kbps
400 => 266 kbps
440 => 216 kbps 

The 400 kbps has no lowpass at all whereas the "440" one is lowpassed at 17 Khz. Anyway, the second half of the current slider looks completely inaccurate.

Nero Plug-in does not use CBR which is the reason why sometimes 448 kbps cannot be reached.

For people that wish to use pure CBR 448 kbps, there will be a separate solution this week - that has this mode.

I will look at the lowpass thing now.

Tried with a short sample at different bitrate:

200 => 189 kbps
240 => 210 kbps
280 => 223 kbps
320 => 252 kbps
360 => 261 kbps
400 => 266 kbps
440 => 216 kbps 


The 400 kbps has no lowpass at all whereas the "440" one is lowpassed at 17 Khz. Anyway, the second half of the current slider looks completely inaccurate.

Known issues, fixed in latest version, but that couldn't make the commercial release as it had to go through QA.

Selecting maximum quality will select a special "pure psymodel VBR" mode. This is a development feature that should have been disabled.

As for quality slider, also known and fixed. It does actually work, but it's not a linear scale, and this becomes a bit too obvious at the high end. New one is completely linear.

Could someone see what happens when this sample (http://gurusamples2.free.fr/ndaac/prelude.wv) is encoded at "440" kbps? On my side, the encoding is amazingly fast, but the resulting file is corrupted. The bug looks identical to the one submitted just before the 48 kbps listening test begins. It doesn't seem to affect all other settings (only tried once though).

Ok Garf. So, i just have downloaded 122 mb for a few kbs (the encoder) and those kbs are not good? Because the very latest aac encoder couldn't make the commercial release?
This reminds me of the first Nero 7 release.
I aslo downloaded 122 mb for something not finished, and that "should have been disabled"?
So, if the new slider is "New one is completely linear", then i think that in a few weeks i'll have to download again those 122 mb. Am i right?
Maybe we should have an option to download ONLY new versions of Nero's AAC Encoder.
Don't get me wrong. I love Nero, i love Nero's AAC. But i'm just tired to be dissapointed with every release, with bugs, issues, and with a promise that the next version will be better.
Anyway, contratulations for Ivan, Garf and the rest of the Mp4 developing team. And a big    for the marketing team.

Don't shoot the marketing team, please!

CBR 448 kbps is not even planned for the Nero plug-in as the plug-in is not using CBR anyway.

We have a solution for your need, this week - and, no, you will NOT have to download 120 MB again

Oookyyy doookkyyy 
I'm waiting

Known issues, fixed in latest version, but that couldn't make the commercial release as it had to go through QA.

That's the quote of the year. You should make it your new signature.

Just bear in mind that many companies out there do not even communicate with the customers and communities this way - leave alone listen to the requests and work on wished features and bugfixes with communities.

So, I apologise for some borderline settings that might not work correctly in the current release, but we are really doing all we can to make sure everything is top-notch quality, which I believe it already is

Concerning the "next release"  I think people waiting for perfect 448 CBR, VBR and 2-pass can wait a day or two more

And, yes, bugs reported are fixed already - and fixes will be there, too.

Ok Garf. So, i just have downloaded 122 mb for a few kbs (the encoder) and those kbs are not good? Because the very latest aac encoder couldn't make the commercial release?
This reminds me of the first Nero 7 release.
I aslo downloaded 122 mb for something not finished, and that "should have been disabled"?
So, if the new slider is "New one is completely linear", then i think that in a few weeks i'll have to download again those 122 mb. Am i right?

I don't get what you are complaining about. We continously improve the software, and each new release has new features. Each time we release something, the very latest development version is already" better" and we try to get that into the *next* release. If you don't ever want to be surprised by a new version that is better than the one you just encoded your entire collection with, then for the love of god, use some dead format, and not Nero AAC, because we're actually improving it!

Al i have allready said: Anyway, contratulations for Ivan, Garf and the rest of the Mp4 developing team
I am using Nero AAC and intend to buy the suite.
I am waiting for the "surprise" announced by Ivan
Ivan: "Just bear in mind that many companies out there do not even communicate with the customers and communities this way - leave alone listen to the requests and work on wished features and bugfixes with communities." = AGREE

Just bear in mind that many companies out there do not even communicate with the customers and communities this way - leave alone listen to the requests and work on wished features and bugfixes with communities.

Excuse me, but the only changes Nero did on behalf of the community were the codec tunings. And let's be honest. The contribution from the community are highly profitable for you and help you in pushing and improving your AAC codec. Eg, the input from all the tests Guru is doing is of immense value for you. It's the work your testing department should be doing. Instead you get it for free from Guru.

As far as I can see it, all other community requests and wishes, are mostly ignored by Nero. Even more importantly, even basic bugs take ages to get fixed. As other people already said, we are highly thankful and happy with the work you audio guys at Nero are doing. Not so with the rest of the company.

Quote from: Ivan Dimkovic on 2006-04-26 10:20:29

Just bear in mind that many companies out there do not even communicate with the customers and communities this way - leave alone listen to the requests and work on wished features and bugfixes with communities.

Excuse me, but the only changes Nero did on behalf of the community were the codec tunings. And let's be honest. The contribution from the community are highly profitable for you and help you in pushing and improving your AAC codec. Eg, the input from all the tests Guru is doing is of immense value for you. It's the work your testing department should be doing. Instead you get it for free from Guru.

As far as I can see it, all other community requests and wishes, are mostly ignored by Nero. Even more importantly, even basic bugs take ages to get fixed. As other people already said, we are highly thankful and happy with the work you audio guys at Nero are doing. Not so with the rest of the company.

Agreed. I want a disc burner, not "Yet Another All In One Media Solution" that I spend money on but still have to run cleanup tools on afterwards. You'd have thought by spending money i'd get what I need but no, apparently it means I have to give up my system to Ahead so they can leverage this.

I mean, come on, who uses Nero Scout? Has the 'bug' where it automatically gets installed even when deselected been fixed? I'd imagine the marketing department will have a say in that.

I don't get what you are complaining about. We continously improve the software, and each new release has new features. Each time we release something, the very latest development version is already" better" and we try to get that into the *next* release. If you don't ever want to be surprised by a new version that is better than the one you just encoded your entire collection with, then for the love of god, use some dead format, and not Nero AAC, because we're actually improving it!

The fact that each major release of Nero contains an uncomplete encoder and/or buggy GUI is maybe a reason to complain, especially when you have to download a bloated installer, uninstall programs you don't need (Scout) and delete by hand 500 MB of temporary datas in an hidden folder (documents & settings\...\local setting\temp\NeroDemo9918).
If you take a look on similar products offering AAC (or something else), there are no problem like these: Winamp, iTunes, WMP are all fine in that aspect... If you set "x kbps" it gives you "~x kbps" and not "1/2 x kbps" and it doesn't enable a debugging -moreover buggy- mode. Nero GUI is inaccurate for more than two years. And now it has been redesigned, it's still not working and really looks unfinished (no choice for MP4/M4A, no choice for using LC if you want LC, etc... I bet it will change in a near future).

The funniest is that you're apparently aware about these bugs, but strictly don't bother to inform us. I count 6 messages from you and Ivan in the first page of this announcement: we can learn that a surprise is planned, that BluRay is supported and online update too, but there's not one mention about "known issues" reported by users. Are you considering us as "beta tester"? I think it wasn't the case (http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/index.php?act=ST&f=13&t=37999&hl=beta&view=findpost&p=337339), contrary to less respectful companies...

I could understand that you don't master the planning of release and that you're sometimes forced to release something which is not polished enough. But if you're aware about problems, there's something you can and should really do: it's to inform people about it. You're talking about "new features" new Nero always has: but current one has clearly less future and doesn't really look safe to use.

The above post should have had an address line, and with guruboolez's latter(?) acknowledgement, i would add it:

TO: NERO Project Managers

The point is that it is not these guys/developers you talk to on these forums are the ones responsible for what you are complaining about. They do their work of development and they do it well AFAIK.

However, the project managers that are responsible for the build-test-release cycle are the ones to be busted here. Their visors are focused on 3 things:

• money
• money, and
• money

Therefore the more they can release (with even more eye candy than before), the more they can sell. It is just because 99.0% of the population having ANY type of relation with the computers are attracted by eye-candies. They will end up selling ONLY eye-candy without functionality and that will be the point when a general meeting will be called, some managers fired, the company rebranded, the software "rewritten from scratch" and some quality issues discussed.

HOWG, I have spoken.
Matyas

TO: NERO Project Managers

The point is that it is not these guys/developers you talk to on these forums are the ones responsible for what you are complaining about. They do their work of development and they do it well AFAIK.

Me being the overall project and product manager for Nero Digital Audio and Mobile efforts in Nero I can speak at least for the projects involved here

Please be assured that opinions on HA and the issues found here are of the very big importance for the Nero Digital Audio - and, like I said, this week there will be some major changes in how do we handle Nero Digital Audio towards the communities.

I will post some more info soon.

I feel this thread is beginning to be hijacked as a bitching session about peoples various issues regarding Nero.  And while I have my own personal annoyances with Nero, and agree with what people have said about the size of the downloads every month, Nero Scout, etc.  I don't feel its productive getting upset with the Nero team who frequent the forums, as we have no idea what input they have outside of the Nero digital encoder.  I would hope that they would pass some comments to those at Ahead who do have influence, but overall I think we should be thankful for the level of input and feedback we get from the Nero Digital team.

The fact that each major release of Nero contains an uncomplete encoder

Well, I hope that the encoder is never complete, because that would mean there is nothing to improve any more.

The funniest is that you're apparently aware about these bugs, but strictly don't bother to inform us.

  I don't consider these bugs significant since they only affect stereo  AAC encoding at > +-240kbps VBR, and I think that such modes are not  very useful (I know that people have been asking for them regardless).  The choice was and always is between shipping a new encoder with these  issues or not shipping a new encoder at all, and I think everybody is  better served by having the new one.

If you are asking me to list all known bugs and deficiencies in the current encoder: no. One notable thing that has been problematic is 5.1 channel VBR, but see below.

I count 6 messages from you and Ivan in the first page of this announcement: we can learn that a surprise is planned, that BluRay is supported and online update too, but there's not one mention about "known issues" reported by users. Are you considering us as "beta tester"? I think it wasn't the case (http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/index.php?act=ST&f=13&t=37999&hl=beta&view=findpost&p=337339), contrary to less respectful companies...

You aren't a "beta tester" for the two bugs that have been mentioned here: I already knew about them. You will find bugs in any software and there are certainly a few left in Nero. Does that make you a "beta tester"? As for my remark linked, I don't think it would have been acceptable to stop the release or remove the new encoder for a bug in a mode that shouldn't really be used.

Note that Recode still uses the old encoder, because of the above issue, but also because the Recode team had to choose between integrating the new one or fixing more bugs. They fixed more bugs.

I don't consider these bugs significant since they only affect stereo  AAC encoding at > +-240kbps VBR, and I think that such modes are not very useful

 
This is not a really professional answer in my opinion. If Nero offers high bitrate encoding mode, users (which have normally paid for this product) should get a working piece of software and not such answer. If high-bitrate encodings are not useful and if bugs affecting that mode are considered as not significant enough, it would be wise to remove them from the available choice; then people won't risk to get corrupted encodings.

The choice was and always is between shipping a new encoder with these  issues or not shipping a new encoder at all, and I think everybody is  better served by having the new one.

It's the same story at each "major" release. I hope you'll understand that people could be seriously bored by this explanation.

If you are asking me to list all known bugs and deficiencies in the current encoder: no.

Even nicer... Thank you. So whay HA.org users have to expect from you is more and less announcement of "surprises" but definitely no transparency about the current state of the encoder?

You aren't a "beta tester" for the two bugs that have been mentioned here: I already knew about them. You will find bugs in any software and there are certainly a few left in Nero. Does that make you a "beta tester"?

I'm sorry: I'm not considering myself as a beta tester. But I'm very disappointed by your attitude. It only takes one hour to find few bugs (call them "unsignificant" if you want...) and now it appears that I've only wasted my time to find out issues you're perfectly aware but you didn't bother to mention to your public.

As for my remark linked, I don't think it would have been acceptable to stop the release or remove the new encoder for a bug in a mode that shouldn't really be used.

Nobody requested it. But warning users about issues they could perfectly be subject to would be very easy... and kind. The forum looks like a suitable place for this kind of warning.

I nevertheless noticed irritating smearing with different samples. If people are interested to check if I'm not dreaming:

- Nero Digital (http://gurusamples2.free.fr/ndaac/S15_KEYBOARD_Harpsichord_E.mp4)
- iTunes (http://gurusamples2.free.fr/ndaac/S15_KEYBOARD_Harpsichord_E.m4a)

There are also audible problems with micro-impulse like signal, but considering the bitrate, it's more or less the case for all encoders/formats.

I think Ivan may already had ideas in mind to fight with these two kind of artefacts because he have a theory of how these originated.

Next major release? 

No, starting from now - Nero AAC will be updated in much more frequent manner - and this week you will see how

Oh come on. I'll be the first one to admit that it's bloated. But.. The installer is 100MB. In the age of broadband, that is nothing. And you can install only the parts that you want. So it's like bitching that you get stuff for free. That's like... well, dumb. What you should bitch about, are the shitloads of unfixed bugs. Though I have to admit I haven't tried this new version. But I'm sure there are still some left.

While i love Neros Burning Rom, and Nero's Recode, i don't see why do i have to download a whole 100MB installer, that uncompresses to 500MB at my temp folder. If you can select what parts to install, is obvious nero knows what to include on the installer, and what not. Why not offer a "complete installer", and a splitted one? One of the reasons Nero started to get more customers, apart from the burning quality, was that it was non-bloated. They are forgeting this.

Just bear in mind that many companies out there do not even communicate with the customers and communities this way - leave alone listen to the requests and work on wished features and bugfixes with communities.

thats true, but the criticism here comes because we respect nero, and whant it to succeed. And because we don't want the marketing department to ruin it

So, I apologise for some borderline settings that might not work correctly in the current release, but we are really doing all we can to make sure everything is top-notch quality, which I believe it already is

no need to apologise.

And, yes, bugs reported are fixed already - and fixes will be there, too.

allways good to see the devs are the ones in the know

I still remember how i liked Easy CD Creator, when it was still part of corel, or something, and it was 3.5mb. Then some companies bought it, and at the end, it was a 500mb beast nobody here cares about any more. Don't let that happen to Nero. Split the installer. Let people choice ?.

I would kindly ask people to, at least for the moment, stop complaining about Nero7 size if they only want AAC - like I said, we are working on the solution and this solution will be out this week (or, in the worst of the worst case - next one),  not next month or next year - I think 2 more days is not so much, isn't it?

Purpose of my post here on HA is the new AAC stuff we put into N7.2 - it is pretty new and, yes, it is quite powerful as it was shown on the last 48 kbps listening test.  Also, the bug found in the 128 kbps test is of course fixed.

For testing VBR and 2-pass modes, please wait 2 more days - I am quite sure this waiting will pay off

No, starting from now - Nero AAC will be updated in much more frequent manner - and this week you will see how

I wonder why no one tried to make some wild guess, given the hints provided by Ivan?

Does the AAC encoder go open source, or become a separate free download that anyone can use for free?

Does the AAC encoder go open source, or become a separate free download that anyone can use for free?

Now you're asking me to reveal all my secrets.  What will be the surprise then?

No, starting from now - Nero AAC will be updated in much more frequent manner - and this week you will see how

Let me guess, Nero AAC is going open source, or partially open source?

I guess we should stop the bi**ing around and wait 'till the new annoucement by Ivan.

... and then we can continue with it 

It would be great if Nero's AAC encoder will be a separate free download.
Then i will install only Nero Burning Rom & the encoder on my PC. 
....and Nero Scout, of course

Now you're asking me to reveal all my secrets.  What will be the surprise then?

Oh, then I'd better keep waiting.

Keep up the good work. Your work, and Garfs', are appreciated. guruboolez too, your work in testing the new Nero is remarkable and admirable.

It is understandable that it is difficult to be perfect, programming included, and it is usually the case that imperfections are found after the product is delivered. All developers can do is improve on it.

So, please, everyone, please stop the blaming and criticism. Please remember that everyone here wants to help and benefit the whole community, and everyone gains from it.

And I thank you for that.

There's another issue occuring with gapless feature this time. It's not completely OK and have troubles in some cases.
My gapless suite (http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=40995) revealed additionnal noise ("pop") between transitions 03-04; 08-09; 09-10 & 16-17. All other transitions are played gaplessly by foobar2000.

Screenshots (09-10):

Merged reference samples (http://gurusamples2.free.fr/ndaac/gapless_reference.png)
Merged encoded samples (http://gurusamples2.free.fr/ndaac/gapless_nero.png)

It was encoded with default setting (i.e. 142 kbps).

Do you know what the problem is? Lame has also issues with these samples (gapless issues I also noticed on real track separation).


EDIT: also tried with the highest working bitrate (438 kbps) and the problem is also here.

I feel like it's somewhat obvious what's going to be released in a couple of days, given everything that has been said by the developers in this thread. 

@guruboolez,

I forwarded a link to this problem to our engineers responsible for gapless and they will check this out asap.

I can't use it anymore with foobar2000 0.9.1.

Works fine here with the NeroAACWrapper...

Do you know what the problem is? Lame has also issues with these samples (gapless issues I also noticed on real track separation).

I think that this is not related to the meta-information (storing delay/padding values), but due to the quantization of separate tracks.
On track boundaries, the boundary is affected by quantization. This is not a problem in isolation, but when you join two encoded/decoded tracks, the boundaries do not match anymore, even if the sample positions are right.

If that is the problem (different quantization on track boundaries), we also have a solution for these kind of encodes in Nero Digital Audio, and also the package we will release by the end of this week will also solve these in a very nice way, too.

Quote from: guruboolez on 2006-04-26 07:16:02

I can't use it anymore with foobar2000 0.9.1.

Works fine here with the NeroAACWrapper...

I cannot encode using fb2k 0.9.1 either.

It seems that people have a different experience of Nero's new encoder.
I can't use foobar2000 for encoding; my mp4 files have this information: tool = Nero AAC codec / Apr 19 2006

kurtnoise can use the encoder with foobar2000 and the files are reporting this: tool = Nero AAC Codec 4.2.9.11

source (http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/index.php?s=&showtopic=43267&view=findpost&p=386564).
Is there a problem on my side?

To remove Nero Scout, just execute:
regsvr32 /u "%COMMONPROGRAMFILES%\Ahead\Lib\MediaLibraryNSE.dll"

I haven't downloaded the new package so I didn't tried it but it seems to work.

My encoder is reported as: tool = Nero AAC codec / Apr 19 2006
Can't use Foobar for encoding.

There appears to be 2 different encoders:

• Nero Digital Audio (HE-AAC) - used by NeroAACWrapper.exe in foobar, produces files that say encoding tool = Nero AAC Codec 4.2.9.11
• Nero Digital Audio - only usable via Nero, encoding tool = Nero AAC codec / Apr 19 2006

Not sure if these are different methods for accessing the same underlying encoder, or if Nero Digital Audio (HE-AAC) is still based on the old encoder.

New AAC encoder always outputs tool info as "Nero AAC Codec / __DATE__"  - if the output is different, it is not encoded with the new encoder.

Ivan, any idea why it doesn't work with fb2k?

could it be that foobar is pointed at the wrong version of the encoder on your system.... might be worth a try...

Any idea what registry key it is checking?

New AAC enocer is excelent . But  there is no 48 kbit bitrate. 
44 kbit/s  and then jump directly to 50 kbit/s. 
44 kbit/s PS+SBR f gives 51 kbit/s real bitrate (more than 50 kbit SBR).

Maybe it was done puprosely to choose on 48 kbit/s  SBR or SBR+PS

Hopefully some issues will be fixed in upcoming "surprise"  version.

What surprise it can be? If I would think about Spatial 5.1 but it would be too much to ask. There is already great HE-AAC stereo codec. 

I have a problem with encoder versions as well...

I was using one of the beta encoders before.  After installing the new Nero release, I now had both Nero Digital (HE-AAC) and Nero Digital listed as formats in the encode files dialog.  Thinking this a problem, I uninstalled Nero, used the Nero clean tool to remove all directorys and registry entiries, rebooted, then installed Nero on what should have been a fresh install.  No Nero Digital is not even in the encode files dialog or listed in the options as an audio plugin.  The others (AIFF, OGG, MP3, etc) are there, only Nero Digital is missing.

Tim

I have a problem with encoder versions as well...

I was using one of the beta encoders before.  After installing the new Nero release, I now had both Nero Digital (HE-AAC) and Nero Digital listed as formats in the encode files dialog.  Thinking this a problem, I uninstalled Nero, used the Nero clean tool to remove all directorys and registry entiries, rebooted, then installed Nero on what should have been a fresh install.  No Nero Digital is not even in the encode files dialog or listed in the options as an audio plugin.  The others (AIFF, OGG, MP3, etc) are there, only Nero Digital is missing.

Tim

I thought it was something along those lines.  The next question is does doing this allow foobar to use the new encoder?  My guess is no, and that there will have to be a new version of NeroAACWrapper.exe.

I thought it was something along those lines.  The next question is does doing this allow foobar to use the new encoder?  My guess is no, and that there will have to be a new version of NeroAACWrapper.exe.

Just use Nero Frontends (http://www.rarewares.org/files/aac/nero_fends.rar) along with the necessary .dlls.  In foobar's converter options you can specify a custom encoder with whatever commandline options you want.

foobar will always support new encoders as long as they can be run from the command line.

nero_frontend is working with foobar2000.
Some difference though...

tool = Ahead AAC Encoder ver: "4,2,9,11". Command line frontend v0.79.065 by © LoggerSoft 2005 (logger@mts-nn.ru).
bitrate = 128[/color]
samplerate = 44100
channels = 2
codec = AAC
encoding = lossy
codec_profile = LC
----------
1809408 samples @ 44100Hz
File size: 666 678 bytes


tool = Nero AAC codec / Apr 19 2006[/color]
bitrate = 128
samplerate = 44100
channels = 2
codec = AAC
encoding = lossy
codec_profile = LC
----------
1809276 samples @ 44100Hz
File size: 667 472 bytes

length isn't the same (bit-to-bit comparison doesn't work for that reason). On this sample, I achieve to get the same size for:
nero_frontend -cbr 128
officiel nero 133 kbps
But the encodings are different.

I would only use nero_frontend with caution. Several things have changed with the new encoder (for example, the gapless engine - hence the difference is length) and I'm not sure that the old frontend is suitable. Or does someone find a way to get identical results between the official GUI et nero_frontend?

I would strongly advise against using third-party tools that fork somehow into the Nero AAC plug-in DLLs - because DLLs change very often as well as internal APIs, etc... .

We will release a solution in the next day or two that also caters to this problem perfectly and I hope it will be an universal solution - and it would be fully official and certified, too

allright! bring on the standalone encoder   

You know,  I would love a Nero AAC encoder for the Mac...

It would be pretty cool to encode true VBR AAC files

allright! bring on the standalone encoder   

Are you going to celebrate your 1,000th post? 

And yes, a standalone encoder would be nice, but I'm not going to get my hopes up.  Either way, I am eagerly awaiting this "solution."

I hear the complaints about Nero loud and clear.  Back in the day (perhaps a couple years ago), Nero was far and away my favorite CD-Burning application... it seemed quite elite and suited to advanced users.

It seems that those days may have come to an end, with SmartStart and such things.  The bloat is absolutely ridiculous, and there are so many features and accessories that I wouldn't even think about using.  I used to automatically install Nero onto a computer of mine, but now I really have to think about it first.  Sometimes I figure it's just not worth it, and use a slim tool.

The AAC codec interests me, even though in many applications it doesn't seem to be the most useful codec, but it's such a pain in the ass to download and install a big program like Nero just to do some tests with a codec.

I'm greatly looking forward to an independent or official command line AAC encoder that is reasonably priced (or free). It would sure make life easier when dealing with AAC, that's for damn sure!

I've used Nero 6 on and off for the past year and got V7 2 weeks ago. Unlike V6, which had the annoying but reliable multiple install, V7 has a single file installer and, in my case, running the install was a horrible experience. Ultimately I had to manually uninstall all previous versions (the automatic uninstall failed every time) and jump through a variety of hoops to complete the install. It took about 5 hours to get up and running.

Then I found that there is a bug in the license module so that you can't enter the Nero/Lame unlimited mp3 license and then I discovered that the wav files created in the Nero Wave Editor can't be read by any other software that I currently own. Oh, not entirely true. The Windows Medial Player can play open/play the wav files but Real, WinAmp, Itunes, LP Ripper can't. The license problem is a known bug but tech support's response about the wav file issue was "How can this be?" I'm waiting for a response to the info I sent them yesterday.

It's entirely possible that my install problems caused the wav problem, but I'm in no hurry to open that can of worms again. The whole experience has been a big disappointment and symptomatic of the way so many software companies "improve/enhance" their products right off users' computers.

Finian

I am using Nero's software from...1998.
NEVER had ANY KIND of problem with install/uninstall.
Maybe those new versions are "a little" too big. But, my friends, as Garf said to me: you don't love it? Don't use it!

I just downloaded and installed the Nero 7 update.  At the end of the long process, it said it couldn't find a certain file in the CAB and was rolling back the installation, and said I should try to update again later.  But when it finished, I discovered it had completely uninstalled Nero 7 from my PC.  I no longer have an app to update; it's all gone.  WTF?
    BTW, it's 3 months and counting since I sent in my competitive upgrade rebate form to Ahead.  They say it's still in processing.  I switched from Roxio for this?

So, please, everyone, please stop the blaming and criticism. Please remember that everyone here wants to help and benefit the whole community, and everyone gains from it.

And I thank you for that.

Eh? It's perfectly valid in a thread about a new version to question why 'bugs' and packaging issues are not resolved.

The devs have discussed the AAC issues, but have still avoided the packaging and SmartStart/Scout ones.

You know until this thread i'd completely forgotten how lightweight Nero used to be a few years ago. How times change, it's almost as if I married it

The devs have discussed the AAC issues, but have still avoided the packaging and SmartStart/Scout ones.

Because this is an audio board, and the people who are posting here are the audio developers, perhaps?

Quote from: seanyseansean on 2006-04-27 09:56:20

The devs have discussed the AAC issues, but have still avoided the packaging and SmartStart/Scout ones.

Because this is an audio board, and the people who are posting here are the audio developers, perhaps?

Fair enough but I thought at least one of you was involved in project management, and it's still on topic anyways.

Apologies if I seem combative on this - i'm not, i'm just frustrated with the app. As you're here, are there any chances of a cut down burner only version for us old skool lot?

Thanks

The devs have discussed the AAC issues, but have still avoided the packaging and SmartStart/Scout ones.

If that helps a bit - I do forward the opinions of people posted here to the responsible persons for overall PC-desktop strategy.  I cannot give you more details unfortunately as my domain is audio (technology) and mobile (products) - so not really connected to the Burning that much

But please be assured that your opinion is heard - of course, there are lots of things being taken into consideration in overall product and strategy planning - but user opinion matters a lot,  so I am sure this subject will be reviewed.

Quote

The devs have discussed the AAC issues, but have still avoided the packaging and SmartStart/Scout ones.

If that helps a bit - I do forward the opinions of people posted here to the responsible persons for overall PC-desktop strategy.  I cannot give you more details unfortunately as my domain is audio (technology) and mobile (products) - so not really connected to the Burning that much

But please be assured that your opinion is heard - of course, there are lots of things being taken into consideration in overall product and strategy planning - but user opinion matters a lot,  so I am sure this subject will be reviewed.

Thank you, it's appreciated.

Well, I don't mean to add to the negative comments but I am having a few issues:

1.  When selecting the option to rip audio CD's to Nero Digital Audio, I get an error that the audio encoders aren't available and that the CD can't be stored.  However, the option to save a CD to audio files works fine, I can even encode to AAC through this method without any problems.  It is a little strange as I have completely removed Nero 7.2 (using Nero's cleaning tool) and re-installed it.

2.  The files AAC files created, when using Nero's CD ripping service, don't play correctly in QuickTime 7.  They sound muffled, a 160kbps VBR LC-AAC will sound like a 48kbps VBR LC-AAC.  The files play fine in foobar2000 and iTunes but they don't play correctly in QuickTime.

3.  (This is more of a complaint)  I don't like the sliding quality control bar.  I would rather be able to pick a preset and have a known quality instead of a known bitrate.  Again, just a personal preference.  The presets still work when using "Nero Frontends" (LoggerSoft) and EAC.  When doing a bitrate comparison between the older version of Nero's AAC encoder (included with the last version of Nero 7) and the new AAC encoder, the bitrates were about the same when using the "streaming" preset (~160kbps VBR).

4.  (This has to do with video encoding)  Although the iPod AVC proile in Nero Recode 2 has been greatly updated (as it can now encode at resolutions different from 320X240), I am still experiencing pixelaation issues.  If a scene changes too quickly or if numerous lights are flashing, the entire video will become pixelated (using iPod AVC profile at 768kbps 2-pass system).  I do not have these issues with other mpeg-4 AVC encoders at the same settings.

Other than those 4 issues, I think the updates are welcome.  I have been holding off on converting all my concert and music video DVD's for my iPod as I wanted to take advantage of the new Nero AAC encoder.

Hopefully, as others have speculated, we will get a stand alone encoder/jukebox that will enable us to rip CDs or encode audio files as well as managing a library (aka, Nero's iTunes).  Thanks to the development team for continually updating Nero to include fixes for past problems while adding some new features.

I will do some of my own listening tests and will await others before deciding if I should switch digital audio formats.

It's a shame I can't burn a single audio CD with Nero 7 because of the horrible mp3 plugins

See more info here:
http://www.cdrinfo.com/forum/tm.asp?m=120993&mpage=6 (http://www.cdrinfo.com/forum/tm.asp?m=120993&mpage=6&#129434)

Is there something new in the 7.2.0.3b release concerning aac encoder ?

FYI

Tonight, with nothing to lose, I decided to run the Upgrade tool. It downloaded and installed 60+ megs of updates which resolved all the issues I'd been having. It was as painless as the install was painful.

How exactly do I start the updater? If I set SmartStart to expert mode and tell it to launch the Nero ProductSetup and finally click on Update, two or three dialogs pop up, then I am being told that the connection is being established, then about 2 MB of data is downloaded (occurring at the step "Checking Engine" or similar - I am using the German version) and then another window pops up that tells me something along the lines "Updates contain the latest free functions / bug fixes for your installed Nero products". After that, I am brought back to the dialog where I can select what the ProductSetup should do.

Aren't Blu-Ray discs supported in v6.6.1.4 too?

Aren't Blu-Ray discs supported in v6.6.1.4 too?

Why don't you try it and tell us.... 


Seriously, does this even matter to anybody yet?

Since it seems atleast Ivan wants to fix bugs here is an old one that were never fixed: in recode when you reach the 2. pass recode will output to tv-out even when preview is disabled. That is quite annoying.

Speaking of annoying bugs... When you try to rename a file and press the "Delete" key, it asks you if you want to delete the file, instead of deleting the character.

Did anyone notice that selecting that you want to burn an image file to CD or DVD from within SmartStart (normal mode, not expert mode!) will only launch Nero Express? Hope it's not only on my side.

I'm cool now.
Just waiting for Ivan's surprise

the suspense is killing me!:)

Sorry, surprise had to be pushed for the next week - but it will definitely be online by then.

Anyone can tell me what's been added with 7.2.0.3b please?
Also, are the audio CD from MP3's probs solved?
Thanks.

Did anyone notice that selecting that you want to burn an image file to CD or DVD from within SmartStart (normal mode, not expert mode!) will only launch Nero Express? Hope it's not only on my side.

Same here... 

There is a long way to have Nero 7 stable... I just feel that it is in BETA... and we are betatesters... is a shame... I keep my Nero 6.6 

Well, I have to say this: Nero guys acting, lately, very strange. We, common users know when some product is buggy.

Nero have to work very very hard.

Ivan, please tell us what's new in 7.2.0.3b.
Are there any changes regarding AAC encoder.
Should we download this version?
Thank you.

Hi,

There are no changes in 7.2.0.3b with regards to AAC encoder.  As far as MP3 is in question I will check this next week (Tuesday) and come back to you.

Release date for the 'surprise' is most likely Tuesday or Wednesday latest.

I jsut purchased Nero 7.2.  For some reason I'm not getting the screen that downloads my CD titles form the internet.  When I try to encode a CD to AAC I'm not getting the CD titles.  Has anyone else had this issue with the software, and if you did, how did you fix it.  Thanks.

Thank you Ivan.
I'll wait.
Have a nice night/day.
Iulian

I am going to get a new mobile phone that supports AAC this week. Hope the new surprise really surprises me.

I have to admit, I'm a smidge hesitant when it comes to using the new AAC encoder. Just watching the bitrate barely change concerns me. Granted, I haven't performed any ABXes myself. It just seems bizarre that the bitrate doesn't really jump anymore than +/- 10kbps. Is it really VBR? I used to use the "Extreme" profile with the old encoder. With the new slider I tend to have it at 192kbps. I tried moving the slider up to 200kbps and the filesizes were EXACTLY the same as the ones encoded with the slider at 192kbps. I know Ivan mentioned that this new encoder would choose the best option automatically, but I don't like that idea. It's too "driving automatic" once you're used to "driving standard."

As for Ivan's "surprise," I'm skeptical. Then again, I'm skeptical by nature. It helps with not being let down.

if its open source ill donate at least $50 to HA with in a month of its release, anyone else in?

*edit* and 25 if it isnt *edit*

Donating money to HydrogenAudio is good, but I'm not totally sure how that relates to Nero AAC being open source.

I think that it's just a little unlikely that's going to happen though.

Most of gurus here will be satisfied if the 'surprise' happens to be standalone command line aac encoder (better free of charge). 

>>Most of gurus here will be satisfied if the 'surprise' happens to be standalone command line aac encoder
Sure 

A free stand-alone encoder is the most likely scenario IMO, as Ahead's major competition has already gone that way.

And yes: donating to HA is always good no matter what  .

I've got even better news:  Nero 7 Lite! (http://www.msfn.org/board/index.php?act=ST&f=80&t=69886)
Now we can finally enjoy the encoder without 800MB of crap floating around.  I went from 800MB to around 40MB just by using this app & a new install of Windows to get all the junk out. 
540MB in the temp folder + 220MB of unwanted NeroScout etc + 40MB of actual burning program was my former installation, now it's much faster & cleaner.  Lite is the ONLY way to go.

I have to admit, I'm a smidge hesitant when it comes to using the new AAC encoder. Just watching the bitrate barely change concerns me. Granted, I haven't performed any ABXes myself. It just seems bizarre that the bitrate doesn't really jump anymore than +/- 10kbps. Is it really VBR?

Yes.

Bitrate depends on the playback application. The more it averages, the less "flex" you will see.

I used to use the "Extreme" profile with the old encoder. With the new slider I tend to have it at 192kbps. I tried moving the slider up to 200kbps and the filesizes were EXACTLY the same as the ones encoded with the slider at 192kbps.

Please read the thread you are replying to, it should become clear why that happens. (Basically, increasing quality/bitrate slider in the GUI has a minimal effect at high bitrates/quality levels. This behaviour is already changed for the next version.)

I've got even better news:  Nero 7 Lite! (http://www.msfn.org/board/index.php?act=ST&f=80&t=69886)
Now we can finally enjoy the encoder without 800MB of crap floating around.  I went from 800MB to around 40MB just by using this app & a new install of Windows to get all the junk out. 
540MB in the temp folder + 220MB of unwanted NeroScout etc + 40MB of actual burning program was my former installation, now it's much faster & cleaner.  Lite is the ONLY way to go.

Wow! This is awesome!

I've got even better news:  Nero 7 Lite! (http://www.msfn.org/board/index.php?act=ST&f=80&t=69886)
Now we can finally enjoy the encoder without 800MB of crap floating around.  I went from 800MB to around 40MB just by using this app & a new install of Windows to get all the junk out. 
540MB in the temp folder + 220MB of unwanted NeroScout etc + 40MB of actual burning program was my former installation, now it's much faster & cleaner.  Lite is the ONLY way to go.

Is that the surprise? I was hoping for a free standalone nero aac encoder.
*disappointed*

Quote from: riggits on 2006-05-03 10:09:59

I've got even better news:  Nero 7 Lite! (http://www.msfn.org/board/index.php?act=ST&f=80&t=69886)
Now we can finally enjoy the encoder without 800MB of crap floating around.  I went from 800MB to around 40MB just by using this app & a new install of Windows to get all the junk out. 
540MB in the temp folder + 220MB of unwanted NeroScout etc + 40MB of actual burning program was my former installation, now it's much faster & cleaner.  Lite is the ONLY way to go.

Is that the surprise? I was hoping for a free standalone nero aac encoder.
*disappointed*

This is not from Nero and is probably not legal.

Quote

I used to use the "Extreme" profile with the old encoder. With the new slider I tend to have it at 192kbps. I tried moving the slider up to 200kbps and the filesizes were EXACTLY the same as the ones encoded with the slider at 192kbps.

Please read the thread you are replying to, it should become clear why that happens. (Basically, increasing quality/bitrate slider in the GUI has a minimal effect at high bitrates/quality levels. This behaviour is already changed for the next version.)

Oh, I read that part of the thread. I was just under the impression that it only started happening past the 280/320kbps range. 189kbps for a setting around 200kbps seems moderately reasonable to me. However 261kbps for 360kbps and 266kbps for 400kbps seem to be a bit ridiculous. Good to know it's been fixed in the new version though (remember reading that as well, two replies down... I do pay attention).

Well, it's Wednesday, so today's "the latest" by which the surprise should be revealed to us. Dare I say that I'll be checking back frequently over the next 24 hours?

This is not from Nero and is probably not legal.

Not from Nero.
Not legal.

But it shows:

1) what people thinks about bloat (can you say nlite, 98lite, etc?)
2) people would take the issue in they own hands if nero doesn't do anything about it.

Well, it has been 8 days since the update, any news on that "surprise" coming?

Just a note, I have also downloaded the latest version of Nero that they released only a few days (or maybe day) after the 25th of April.  I am still having the same video problems when using the iPod AVC profile in Nero Recode 2 to encode some unencrypted DVD's.

I still can't select the option to save CD's to Nero Digital Files as well, I must go through the other option to rip CD's then select Nero's AAC encoder as an option.  Kinda frustrating.

Just a note, I have also downloaded the latest version of Nero that they released only a few days (or maybe day) after the 25th of April.  I am still having the same video problems when using the iPod AVC profile in Nero Recode 2 to encode some unencrypted DVD's.

maybe that is why we haven't seen the surprise yet.

2pass and stand alone Command encoer would be nice.

then i could move from .ogm to .mp4 for my movies

Quote from: Jan S. on 2006-05-03 13:35:25

This is not from Nero and is probably not legal.

Not from Nero.
Not legal.

But it shows:

1) what people thinks about bloat (can you say nlite, 98lite, etc?)
2) people would take the issue in they own hands if nero doesn't do anything about it.

It's legal in my country & it's the free demo version of Nero 7.  The only difference between Lite & official is that this installer is a lot more honest than the official one.  If you don't want a pseudo-database sneakily installed behind your back then you won't be forced to suffer it. 

Sadly the AAC encoder isn't working with MeGUI.  Anybody have a workaround?

Quote from: kwanbis on 2006-05-03 14:00:55

Quote from: Jan S. on 2006-05-03 13:35:25

This is not from Nero and is probably not legal.

Not from Nero.
Not legal.

But it shows:

1) what people thinks about bloat (can you say nlite, 98lite, etc?)
2) people would take the issue in they own hands if nero doesn't do anything about it.

It's legal in my country

I wonder what country you live in that doesn't have copyrights.

Developers and deadlines

Will the "surprise" be ready before midnight as stated by Ivan Dimkovic?

Hi,
There are no changes in 7.2.0.3b with regards to AAC encoder. As far as MP3 is in question I will check this next week (Tuesday) and come back to you.

Release date for the 'surprise' is most likely Tuesday or Wednesday latest.

Will developers keep their promises and hang on to their deadline schedule?

You can see it next week on another episode of HydrogenAudio TV. ;)

Don't blame the developers, we finished our part last week already

Developers and deadlines

Will the "surprise" be ready before midnight as stated by Ivan Dimkovic?
Will developers keep their promises and hang on to their deadline schedule?

Calm down, take a deep breath and relax. You'll get your new toy. 

In case we can't get the surprise today can we learn more details about what it is as we've been heard so interesting things and had expected to have it available right now?

kinda feels like chrsitmas now doesn't it? 

Just hope it's coming out before the weekend...

I hate waiting for christmas (well not realy)

Will developers keep their promises and hang on to their deadline schedule?

To release a product there is much more that needs to be done than just development - sometimes, it is hard to predict exact ETAs of these tasks especially in a dynamic software industry enviroment.

That said, I am really hoping the solution will be out soon - it is basically finished and there are just a few remaining tasks that are not of development nature - and I really expect them to be completed asap.

In case we can't get the surprise today can we learn more details about what it is as we've been heard so interesting things and had expected to have it available right now?

I can only say it has lots of things in common to one idea people speculated here

Don't blame the developers, we finished our part last week already

I don't want to be annoyed but  encoder included in the last 7.2 package has only cbr mode and it hasn't 48 kbits/s bitrate only 50 kbits/s.

The conditions for including of Nero beta 4.9.9.5/6 to 48 AAC+ test  were that during 3 months  AAC new encoder 48 kbit/s VBR. will be included.

But a few days doesn't make a big difference. 
It's already  planned that there will be updated encoder shortly. If it will be today ( 3d or 4th of may)  you will be very precise. Exactly 90 days (3 months) 

?!?! The encoder is Nero 7.2 should be VBR. That's exactly why people have problems to get it above 260kbps...

?!?! The encoder is Nero 7.2 should be VBR. That's exactly why people have problems to get it above 260kbps...

Hm, Sorry  I'm wrong. I just see that bitrate  hasn't a big varience during playback by foobar 0.9.1. It's certainly VBR.

But there is still no 48 kbit/s.

Quote from: kornchild2002 on 2006-05-03 18:42:23

Just a note, I have also downloaded the latest version of Nero that they released only a few days (or maybe day) after the 25th of April.  I am still having the same video problems when using the iPod AVC profile in Nero Recode 2 to encode some unencrypted DVD's.

maybe that is why we haven't seen the surprise yet.

You can switch to MP4 using MeGUI and x264 codec. You can also convert losslesly you OGM to MP4 or MKV. I see no use in OGM today, the format is not developed anymore for a long time and there is no support for it.

What I would really like to see, is Nero asking me what filters I want to have installed. Why puts Nero in my system over 50 DirectShow filters which I don't want a which are often causing problems? For example MP4 parser/splitter doesen't output TTXT subtitles (which are part of MPEG-4 standard). MPEG-4 ASP decoder has problems with a lot of AVIs and so on. That's why I want to use my own filters.

So no "surprise" this week?

So no "surprise" this week?

You haven't read the news?

 http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/index....showtopic=44275 (http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=44275)

So no "surprise" this week?

Doesn't look like it unfortunately

Doesn't look like it unfortunately

yep, no surprise (http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=44275) really.

Wow! How could I have missed that? I'm really sorry, but at the same time very glad that I was wrong