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Topic: NOS R2R simulator // foo_nos_r2r (Read 1183 times) previous topic - next topic
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Re: NOS R2R simulator // foo_nos_r2r

Reply #1 –
Dear @zhgutov, I would be interested to listen to two music samples in any format (up to 30 seconds, according to the rules), one of which has been processed by this plugin in such a way that you can clearly hear the difference on the computer with 44.1 kHz 16-bit output. Of course, if it is at all possible in the mentioned scenario.
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Re: NOS R2R simulator // foo_nos_r2r

Reply #2 –
Quote from: Kraeved on
Dear @zhgutov, I would be interested to listen to two music samples in any format (up to 30 seconds, according to the rules), one of which has been processed by this plugin in such a way that you can clearly hear the difference on the computer with 44.1 kHz 16-bit output. Of course, if it is at all possible in the mentioned scenario.

Looks like you are asking about R2R effect alone. This might be as hard as to find the difference in this test:
https://archimago.blogspot.com/2020/05/blind-test-results-part-i-is-high.html

Despite the fact that the distortion is clearly measurable in such scenario, is can be hard to perceive on short fragment or in ABX test after a couple of back and forth switches. At least unless you exaggerate it intentionally or implement this effect in a wrong way.

But I think you will likely be able to tell this two fragments apart:
SQÜRL - Funnel of Love (feat. Madeline Follin)
SQÜRL - Funnel of Love (feat. Madeline Follin) (R2R)

This is preset 332 from the screenshot above, but with 1% tolerance and with Target sampling rate set to "Same as source".
16 bit dithering has been applied to R2R transform result using Smart Dither plugin.

Re: NOS R2R simulator // foo_nos_r2r

Reply #3 –
Quote from: zhgutov on
But I think you will likely be able to tell this two fragments apart:
SQÜRL - Funnel of Love (feat. Madeline Follin)
SQÜRL - Funnel of Love (feat. Madeline Follin) (R2R)

@shadowking, can you hear the difference between these two samples?
• Join our efforts to make Helix MP3 encoder great again
• Opus complexity & qAAC dependence on Apple is an aberration from Vorbis & Musepack breakthroughs
• Let's pray that D. Bryant improve WavPack hybrid, C. Helmrich update FSLAC, M. van Beurden teach FLAC to handle non-audio data

Re: NOS R2R simulator // foo_nos_r2r

Reply #4 –
No I could not hear difference yet.

Re: NOS R2R simulator // foo_nos_r2r

Reply #5 –
Dear @zhgutov, thank you for your effort to provide samples so that we can get acquainted with the effect of your R2R plugin. As you can see, another user besides me, who is known for his passion for listening tests, also has difficulty discovering the difference between them. By the way, this melody is familiar to me from the film “Only lovers left alive” about a pair of artistic vampires who have spent centuries watching humanity, which brings the warmest memories. I hope your plugin finds the ears you wanted to please.
• Join our efforts to make Helix MP3 encoder great again
• Opus complexity & qAAC dependence on Apple is an aberration from Vorbis & Musepack breakthroughs
• Let's pray that D. Bryant improve WavPack hybrid, C. Helmrich update FSLAC, M. van Beurden teach FLAC to handle non-audio data

Re: NOS R2R simulator // foo_nos_r2r

Reply #6 –
Quote from: Kraeved on
Dear @zhgutov, thank you for your effort to provide samples so that we can get acquainted with the effect of your R2R plugin. As you can see, another user besides me, who is known for his passion for listening tests, also has difficulty discovering the difference between them. By the way, this melody is familiar to me from the film “Only lovers left alive” about a pair of artistic vampires who have spent centuries watching humanity, which brings the warmest memories. I hope your plugin finds the ears you wanted to please.

There are at least two aspects of the difference. One of which is more related to harmonic distortion. Another one can be described as the noise correlated with the signal and can affect the dynamics and smoothness.

I tested this samples on two completely different systems with three different headphones ($100-$4000), all of them allow me to hear the difference. Actually this particular example is not completely fair. Because you can pick the right sample by the difference which I suppose is not expected as a valuable part of the effect. But anyway, it is strange you both didn't notice any of this.

It is also strange that your conclusion about the plugin is based on the samples in 16/44 format, which are inevitably affected by the digital filter in your DAC. Whereas the plugin itself tries to bypass that digital filter.

Re: NOS R2R simulator // foo_nos_r2r

Reply #7 –
Anyway, even if some people can hear differences with low quality setting, low quality is... low. Who wants low quality? And with high quality settings differences will be inaudible.
 

Re: NOS R2R simulator // foo_nos_r2r

Reply #8 –
Quote from: Bogozo on
Anyway, even if some people can hear differences with low quality setting, low quality is... low. Who wants low quality? And with high quality settings differences will be inaudible.

I think I can hear the difference down to the "euphonic" level described in the research mentioned above. Maybe with some uncertainty, but I think this is even better. This is exactly what I want, and probably I am not the only one.

On the other hand, this plugin is called a simulator. There are no claims that your ears will be pleased or something like that. You can match the distortion with the existing DAC and check if you can hear the difference or compare them directly if you want.

This plugin was originally developed to check if I want to buy a new DAC ;)

Use it or not - it is for you to decide.