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Topic: are there 2 wavpack tagging formats ? (Read 14021 times) previous topic - next topic
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are there 2 wavpack tagging formats ?

is there more than one type of wavpack tag ?

i use eac to rip to wavpack, but i save the wav files, for audio editing.

i use audacity to edit my wav files.

i then use foobar to transcode them to wavpack.

i had been using foobar to do the tag editing.

i then use mediacoder to transcode from wavpack to mp3 (lame 3.98, i think).

with this method, it drops the "number of tracks" on my mp3 files that have been tagged with foobar. but the original wavpack file ripped by eac - i get the number of tracks.

foobar does not see the "number of tracks" on the eac ripped file. but tag'n'rename does not see the "number of tracks" on the eac file, either. and both foobar and tag'n'rename see the edits i made in foobar with that field. all other fields (artist, title, album) are seen by all programs.

so at least the way i have them currently set up, foobar and tag'n'rename see the same info.

and eac and mediacoder see the same info. if eac puts it out, mediacoder brings it in.

i suspect that there must be some slight difference in the way that the "number of tracks" is tagged.

any ideas ?

are there 2 wavpack tagging formats ?

Reply #1 –
Maybe you're using ID3 tags when tagging with EAC, make sure the tags used are APEv2 (only Wavpack standard). Take a look at the Wiki to know how to properly setup EAC for tagging your songs.
Allegari nihil et allegatum non probare, paria sunt.

are there 2 wavpack tagging formats ?

Reply #3 –
Quote from: ssjkakaroto on
Maybe you're using ID3 tags when tagging with EAC, make sure the tags used are APEv2 (only Wavpack standard). Take a look at the Wiki to know how to properly setup EAC for tagging your songs.


hi ss,

i checked, and have it set up correctly.  the id3 tag is not selected.  i am not sure how to verify that i am using apev2 tags.  but i do have the screen set up as the wiki shows.

wavpack4.31-win32\wavpack.exe - is the name of the folder that contains wavpack, and the one that eac is using.  i actually had to download it.  i am using version 0.95 beta 4 from 21 february 2006

however, i dont recall foobar, mediacoder or tag'n'rename looking for an external wavpack. 

i am using foobar 2000 v0.9.4.2,  tag & rename 3.3, mediacoder 0.5.1 - but dont know and cant tell how to verify which version of wavpack is being used by these programs, as they all seem to be internal to the programs.

are there 2 wavpack tagging formats ?

Reply #4 –
i just did a check on mediacoder.  i dont know what it was using, but the current version is running with wavpack 4.40.  so i went ahead and downloaded that version.

perhaps i should update 4.31 on my computer to 4.40, and have eac use it ?  maybe my foobar and tagnrename are on 4.40 already ?  i just downloaded these programs more recently than i did with eac.

are there 2 wavpack tagging formats ?

Reply #5 –
well i am now on 4.4 with eac and mediacoder.  now i dont get the number of tracks even with the eac ripped files.  i am now suspecting that i was already on 4.4 with foobar and tag n rename - and that there is a bug in 4.4.

the eac files coded in 4.31, and mediacoder was also using 4.31 - and found them.  but when i went to 4.4, it no longer even finds them.

i am just updating that field on the mp3 files, which is no big deal.  however, i hope the bug is just in transferring them, not labelling them.  i would hate to not have that field on all of my lossless files at some time in the future.

are there 2 wavpack tagging formats ?

Reply #6 –
Well, I've read this thread a few times and still don't exactly understand what's going on. But I think the best thing to try would be use the wvunpack command-line program with the -ss option to find out exactly what kind of tag is on your files and it will also display the tag information exactly as it appears (foobar2000 sometimes uses different display names for some fields).

As you can read in this thread, there were some changes to the tag reading code in the WavPack library at some point that could have something to do with this (although foobar2000 does not use WavPack to read or write tags; it does that internally). To test this you can download the old 4.3 version (not 4.31!) of the WavPack command-line programs from here and see if using -ss with that version of wvunpack gives different results (than 4.40) on your files.

That should give you enough information to figure out what's going on, and please let me know if you find out something.

are there 2 wavpack tagging formats ?

Reply #7 –
hi bryant,

i will try to do as you ask.  i am unfamiliar with wvunpack.  is it a program that unpacks a wavpack file into another format ?

is there somewhere you can point me, so that i can read about wvunpack, and how to use it ?

btw, i am also new to lossless encoding.  i had previously just used itunes to go from cd to mp3.  i am realizing that i want lossless files from my ripped cds.  and decided to go with wavpack instead of flac.

although it is my understanding that it probably is not a big deal to take my lossless files and transcode them across to some other lossless format, should i need to.  i just dont want to re-rip any cds, since i am editing most of the songs, and am keeping a lossless edited version, since editing takes some time, as well.

are there 2 wavpack tagging formats ?

Reply #8 –
Quote from: HA-User on
[...]i will try to do as you ask.  i am unfamiliar with wvunpack.  is it a program that unpacks a wavpack file into another format ?

is there somewhere you can point me, so that i can read about wvunpack, and how to use it ?[...]

Yes, but it also displays information about your .WV files with the switch suggested, download it from the link David gave you, instructions here.
Quote
-ss = display super summary (including tags) to stdout (no decode)

This option is similar to -s except that information from any valid tag found (either APEv2 or ID3v1) is also listed.


Quote from: HA-User on
[...]i just dont want to re-rip any cds, since i am editing most of the songs, and am keeping a lossless edited version, since editing takes some time, as well.
You won't have to, it's very unlikely experimenting with tags will corrupt your files.
WavPack 5.6.0 -b384hx6cmv / qaac64 2.80 -V 100

are there 2 wavpack tagging formats ?

Reply #9 –
Foobar2000 can tell you the tag type.

Right click on file in playlist > Properties > Properties tab > Tag Type.
daefeatures.co.uk

are there 2 wavpack tagging formats ?

Reply #10 –
Quote from: evereux on
Foobar2000 can tell you the tag type.

Right click on file in playlist > Properties > Properties tab > Tag Type.
Yup, but Foobar uses internal code to do that, the test suggested by David is supposed to check if there are relevant differences between the 4.3 and 4.40 WavPack decoder.
WavPack 5.6.0 -b384hx6cmv / qaac64 2.80 -V 100

are there 2 wavpack tagging formats ?

Reply #11 –
thanks guys,

i will need to do some reading on the links you gave me.

i thought i would post the "additional command line options" that i am using.

-w "Artist=%a" -w "Title=%t" -w "Album=%g" -w "Year=%y" -w "Track=%n" -w "Genre=%m" -h %s %d

i cut and pasted it right from the eac/wavpack instructions.  i know in 4.31, eac put "number of tracks" in to the tag.  while with 4.40, it does not.

one thing i have never been able to find is a listing of all the tag options that wavpack has.  i know there are many more tags, such as "composer", etc. that the mp3s have.

perhaps, i need to add something like -w "number of tracks" in my additional line options.
 

are there 2 wavpack tagging formats ?

Reply #12 –
i was not sure just how to go about running the wvunpack program.  it was already in my 4.40 folder.

i am running xp-pro.

i clicked "start", and then "run", and then typed in the following command :

C:Music\WavPack\wavpack-4.40\wavpack\wvunpack.exe [-ss] J:\Rips\Spiders\The Imperial Sessions disc 1\The Real Thing

C:Music\WavPack\wavpack-4.40\wavpack\wvunpack.exe    this is where the program is.

i just eac ripped this cd (J:\Rips\Spiders\The Imperial Sessions disc 1\The Real Thing), and havent touched it yet.  so i figured it would be a good place to start.

anyways, when i hit return, my computer immediately displayed the folder where this file was in, but nothing else that i could see.

i then added .wv to the end of my run string, but it did the same thing.

are there 2 wavpack tagging formats ?

Reply #13 –
Quote from: HA-User on
i was not sure just how to go about running the wvunpack program.  it was already in my 4.40 folder.

i am running xp-pro.

i clicked "start", and then "run", and then typed in the following command :

C:Music\WavPack\wavpack-4.40\wavpack\wvunpack.exe [-ss] J:\Rips\Spiders\The Imperial Sessions disc 1\The Real Thing

C:Music\WavPack\wavpack-4.40\wavpack\wvunpack.exe    this is where the program is.

i just eac ripped this cd (J:\Rips\Spiders\The Imperial Sessions disc 1\The Real Thing), and havent touched it yet.  so i figured it would be a good place to start.

anyways, when i hit return, my computer immediately displayed the folder where this file was in, but nothing else that i could see.

i then added .wv to the end of my run string, but it did the same thing.
I suggest you download and install the Open Command Window Here Power Toy (get it from this page, it's an official and free Microsoft add-in), then move or copy wvunpack.exe to your C:\WINDOWS (that is to a folder which is surely in your system's path), afterwards you'll be able to right click on the folder containing your WavPack files and select Open Command Window Here context menu option, finally simply run "wvunpack -ss *.wv" within the Command Prompt window (type it without the quotes and press the Enter key) to have all the files there scanned.

EDIT: Bold.
WavPack 5.6.0 -b384hx6cmv / qaac64 2.80 -V 100

are there 2 wavpack tagging formats ?

Reply #14 –
i did that.  with my other files, i have already edited them, so i dont know what was initially placed in them for sure.  with this last rip, i havent touched yet.

it shows 4 apev2 items, and then lists the artist, title, album and track.

so i did not get any genre or number of tracks.

this was done with wavpack 4.40.

are there 2 wavpack tagging formats ?

Reply #15 –
Since your command line has '-w "Track=%n" -w "Genre=%m' it seems EAC isn't passing those values to wavpack.exe, are you sure you've configured EAC correctly? Can you provide a screenshot of the whole configuration tab where you enteredyour WavPack parameters?

On a side note, I'd change the '-h' portion to either '-hm' (no toll on encoding speed and calculates plus stores the MD5 checksum) or even '-hxm' (slower encoding but better compression and no toll on decoding).

EDIT: Grammar.
WavPack 5.6.0 -b384hx6cmv / qaac64 2.80 -V 100

are there 2 wavpack tagging formats ?

Reply #16 –
i just ran eac with 4.3.1 (still have that on my computer).  wvunpack 4.4 still shows just the same 4 fields.  i dont have wvunpack 4.3.1.

but when i run foobar - it also just shows the 4 items on both the 4.3.1 and the 4.4 eac encoded files.  however, foobar never showed the number of tracks field.  mediacoder would transcode the number of tracks field on the eac-ripped file, even though foobar wouldnt recognize that the "number of tracks" field had anything in it.

but that was with the version of mediacoder that had 4.3.1 in it.  the current mediacoder, with 4.4, doesnt bring the number of tracks over, either.

i think at this point, it is best to go forward.  is there a way to have wavpack 4.4 put in the "number of tracks" ?

perhaps the problem is with the accessing of freedb ?  i am not sure just how the number of tracks is gotten.  if it just counts up the items, then the problem can not be freedb, since the number of songs is there.  if there is supposed to be a field in the freedb database with "number of tracks" on it, then it could be a problem with either freedb or wavpack's ability to get the info.

are there 2 wavpack tagging formats ?

Reply #17 –
It'd be better to determine if your EAC configuration is 100% correct, also David Bryant provided you with a link to the 4.3 version of wvunpack.exe, anyway can you try editing the tags with AudioShell adding the track number and genre and see if wvunpack.exe sees them?
WavPack 5.6.0 -b384hx6cmv / qaac64 2.80 -V 100

are there 2 wavpack tagging formats ?

Reply #18 –
Quote from: DARcode on
Since your command line has '-w "Track=%n" -w "Genre=%m' it seems EAC isn't passing those values to wavpack.exe, are you sure you've configured EAC correctly? Can you provide a screenshot of the whole configuration tab where you enteredyour WavPack parameters?

On a side note, I'd change the '-h' portion to either '-hm' (no toll on encoding speed and calculates plus stores the MD5 checksum) or even '-hxm' (slower encoding but better compression and no toll on decoding).

EDIT: Grammar.


hi dar,

did not see this post until i posted again.  the track number is being given.  is number of tracks on cd supposed to be part of the track number ?

freedb does not always have a genre for the cds, so this could be a freedb problem.  i would have to test a disc that comes up with a genre in freedb, and still doesnt come across in wavpack thru eac.

i dont know how to do a screenshot.  i can tell you though that you cant see the entire  command line options in one screenshot, since that field is twice as long or more than the screen display.  but i did cut and paste the whole line, which is what i posted in the above post.


i just put the disc back in, and brought up eac.

eac actually has 2 fields.  1 called  genre, and the other called freedb.

the genre field is blank.  the freedb field has "blues" in it.

are there 2 wavpack tagging formats ?

Reply #19 –
hi dar,

i will look at audio shell later.  since i had foobar already on the computer, i thought i would try that first.  when i put in the genre with foobar, wvunpack saw it.

wvunpack also shows the track as xx/xx when the track number has been edited.

since mediacoder no longer brings that info over, either - i must assume that i am not getting the info during the eac rip.

are there 2 wavpack tagging formats ?

Reply #20 –
The genre field is the relevant one, you need to manually type it there if it isn't retrieved from freedb.

Do you mean total tracks on an album by "number of tracks"?
WavPack 5.6.0 -b384hx6cmv / qaac64 2.80 -V 100

are there 2 wavpack tagging formats ?

Reply #21 –
in the id3 tag screen,

i clicked use 1.1 instead of 1.0

i clicked to additionally write v2 tags with 4kb padding

i did not click to use 4.0 tags instead of 3.0 tags

i clicked to use xx/xx format, for the track number.

my filename title is %T, which is what i want.  i dont want the artist as part of the filename, just the name of the song.

on the offset screen, i am not using offset correction.

i am writing the freedb id into the comment field.

on the external compression screen,

i am using an external program for compression

passing scheme - user defined encoder

use file extension - .wv

the bit rate shows 320 kb

high quality is checked

delete wav, use crc check, add id3 tag, check for return code - none of these are checked.

i already posted the path name for wavpack and the command line options.



Quote from: DARcode on
The genre field is the relevant one, you need to manually type it there if it isn't retrieved from freedb.

Do you mean total tracks on an album by "number of tracks"?


yes, number of tracks is total tracks on the album.

so when i convert it to an mp3 and then to itunes, it shows the track number as 4 of 17, instead of just 4.

i am not that concerned about the genre field, as i always change that when after importing into itunes.  i have close to 100 genres, so i can get to an artist more quickly.  for example, i have oldies a, oldies b, etc. - this way i click on genre, then click the genre that i am looking for, and then there is usually no more than about 10 artists to pick from. 

i have 30 gigs of music loaded, and will eventually have another 30.  i hope itunes eventually develops a sub-genre, which there has been some talk about doing.

are there 2 wavpack tagging formats ?

Reply #22 –
Quote from: rjamorim on
Quote from: ssjkakaroto on
Maybe you're using ID3 tags when tagging with EAC, make sure the tags used are APEv2 (only Wavpack standard).


WavPack also endorses ID3v1 (but not v2)

OT: thx for the clarification Roberto, I always assumed APEv2 only because of foobar2000 

HA-User: try to uncheck "use xx/xx format, for the track number." see if it helps. IIRC that format does not work with APEv2 in the same way it works with ID3v2, APEv2 needs different fields for Track Number and Total Tracks.
Allegari nihil et allegatum non probare, paria sunt.

are there 2 wavpack tagging formats ?

Reply #23 –
hi dar,

i did change the h to hxm.  if the encoding is too slow, i can always remove the "x".

btw, is bryant and david the same person ?

hi ss,

i unchecked the xx/xx format - it did not make any difference.  it still placed just the track number in the field.  so i went back and checked it, because i think the original instructions told me to do so.

thanks for the suggestion.

are there 2 wavpack tagging formats ?

Reply #24 –
David Bryant, aka bryant on these forums, is the brilliant and very kind inventor/developer of WavPack, post # 7 is his.

I don't think EAC is capable of passing the track number in a xx/xx format WavPack can add to an APE tag, maybe with wapet or tag, but I've never tried myself, perhaps Synthetic Soul can comment on this.
WavPack 5.6.0 -b384hx6cmv / qaac64 2.80 -V 100