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Topic: Channel Mixer (foo_channel_mixer) (Read 533439 times) previous topic - next topic
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Channel Mixer (foo_channel_mixer)

Reply #175
cant wait for the updated version its keeping me from making the switch on my main rig........

Channel Mixer (foo_channel_mixer)

Reply #176
Channel Mixer 0.9.3 preview for foobar2000 0.9.

This is a preview version for testing purposes only, no profiles as well.

Download and version history:
http://www.skipyrich.com/foobar/foo_channel_mixer.ptml
My English is very good!
...in comparison with my Korean language...

Channel Mixer (foo_channel_mixer)

Reply #177
Works great for me, thanks so much!  This was one of my favorite plugins in 8.3, and once it has profiles it'll be perfect.  Thanks for you hard work!

Channel Mixer (foo_channel_mixer)

Reply #178
[deleted]

Channel Mixer (foo_channel_mixer)

Reply #179
working well for me to.

Nice one.

Channel Mixer (foo_channel_mixer)

Reply #180
Wonderful! Thank You!

Channel Mixer (foo_channel_mixer)

Reply #181
After some subwoofer volume tweaking (Audigy 2 and Channel Mixer subwoofer levels seem to "add up") it works great! I didn't even notice the center speaker was mute before - now suddenly everything sounds like crap when not using Channel Mixer. Imagine what I missed all the months!

THANK YOU skipyrich!

edit...
Note to self: NEVER do subwoofer volume tweaking at 4 AM in a dormitory!
Nothing is impossible if you don't need to do it yourself.

Channel Mixer (foo_channel_mixer)

Reply #182
TNX, skipyrich
great plugin and it works fine

Channel Mixer (foo_channel_mixer)

Reply #183
How do I install it? Sorry I am a newbie to fubar2000. I liked it but was unable to get 5.1 sound and found this plug-in. But the .dll download does not work for 0.9. Neither does the '7z' file. I am using xp pro sp2.

I tried AT surround. While that works, it alters the sound quite adversely.

Channel Mixer (foo_channel_mixer)

Reply #184
How do I install it? Sorry I am a newbie to fubar2000. I liked it but was unable to get 5.1 sound and found this plug-in. But the .dll download does not work for 0.9. Neither does the '7z' file. I am using xp pro sp2.

I tried AT surround. While that works, it alters the sound quite adversely.

1. Extract foo_channel_mixer.dll into your foobar2000\components folder
2. (Re-)start foobar2000
3. Open Preferences (Ctrl-P)
4. Go to Playback -> DSP Manager
5. Add "Channel Mixer" to your Active DSPs

edit:
The .7z file is a GNU-licensed compression archive. You need this or WinRAR for un7zipping.
The .zip file won't work, as it's the version for foobar2000 0.8.3
Nothing is impossible if you don't need to do it yourself.

Channel Mixer (foo_channel_mixer)

Reply #185
6. Don't forget to configure Channel Mixer

Version: 0.9.4

- added: Profiles. NOTE: Any changes applies only if you press OK button.
- fixed: Some interface problems.

Plugin download and version history:
http://www.skipyrich.com/foobar/foo_channel_mixer.ptml
My English is very good!
...in comparison with my Korean language...

Channel Mixer (foo_channel_mixer)

Reply #186
Thank you very much for this nice update!

Channel Mixer (foo_channel_mixer)

Reply #187
1. Extract foo_channel_mixer.dll into your foobar2000\components folder
2. (Re-)start foobar2000
3. Open Preferences (Ctrl-P)
4. Go to Playback -> DSP Manager
5. Add "Channel Mixer" to your Active DSPs

edit:
The .7z file is a GNU-licensed compression archive. You need this or WinRAR for un7zipping.
The .zip file won't work, as it's the version for foobar2000 0.8.3


Thanks. Will try it and report.

Channel Mixer (foo_channel_mixer)

Reply #188
Hi,
first I have a suggestion for channel mixer plugin. How about a matrix like in AC3-filter?
AC3 Filter
It would be much easer to config your plugin! And much more powerful because you can e.g. give every output channel the amount of LFE you want. (of course high frequenzies have to be cut off first - low pass filter? - if impossible forget my suggestion)

next two problems I experience with channel mixer 0.9.4 + foobar 0.9.
Soundcard is a Soundblaster Live 5.1 Platinum, kX Audio Driver 3538j
a) when I choose 6channel in general tab everything works fine. But when I choose 5 channels center-option does not work, center is always off
b) 6channel choosed, but e.g. front-speakers disabled. Then choosing "copy" in upmix-tab: Frontspeakers start playing!

 

Channel Mixer (foo_channel_mixer)

Reply #189
a) when I choose 6channel in general tab everything works fine. But when I choose 5 channels center-option does not work, center is always off
b) 6channel choosed, but e.g. front-speakers disabled. Then choosing "copy" in upmix-tab: Frontspeakers start playing!

a) This seems to be a "normal behaviour, but buggy interface" case. I think 5 channel mode is intended for 4.1 speaker setups, so there would be no point in sending a center speaker signal, as there is no center speaker. However, assuming this premise is correct, the wrong option is greyed out when selecting 5 channel mode. While the center option is still switchable (but has no effect), the LFE option is disabled.
@skipyrich: Please correct me if I'm wrong.

b) When upmix is in "Copy" mode, there are some strange results when experimenting with the channels. For example, switching both left channels off has no effect in 5 or 6 channel mode, whereas with 4 channel mode the left side is muted correctly. In fact, in 5 or 6 channel mode it doesn't even matter at all which channels are switched on or off, with the exception of the LFE.
However, when in "Surround" mode, correct upmix results are achieved with every channel configuration. Channel switching also works perfectly with original 5.1 sources, no matter if it's downmixed (for 2 channel mode) or not.
Nothing is impossible if you don't need to do it yourself.

Channel Mixer (foo_channel_mixer)

Reply #190
How about a matrix like in AC3-filter?

Maybe in next generation of plugin...

next two problems I experience with channel mixer 0.9.4 + foobar 0.9.
Soundcard is a Soundblaster Live 5.1 Platinum, kX Audio Driver 3538j
a) when I choose 6channel in general tab everything works fine. But when I choose 5 channels center-option does not work, center is always off


a) This seems to be a "normal behaviour, but buggy interface" case. I think 5 channel mode is intended for 4.1 speaker setups, so there would be no point in sending a center speaker signal, as there is no center speaker. However, assuming this premise is correct, the wrong option is greyed out when selecting 5 channel mode. While the center option is still switchable (but has no effect), the LFE option is disabled.
@skipyrich: Please correct me if I'm wrong.

You're right in case of foobar2000 0.9. In 0.8.3 5-channel mode output is L/R/C/LFE/RL. 
I never tested this mode before...
In other hand, in 5-channel sample sent by Borisz channel configuration is L/R/C/RL/RR. 
Has anyone have another samples or specs?

b) 6channel choosed, but e.g. front-speakers disabled. Then choosing "copy" in upmix-tab: Frontspeakers start playing!


b) When upmix is in "Copy" mode, there are some strange results when experimenting with the channels. For example, switching both left channels off has no effect in 5 or 6 channel mode, whereas with 4 channel mode the left side is muted correctly. In fact, in 5 or 6 channel mode it doesn't even matter at all which channels are switched on or off, with the exception of the LFE.
However, when in "Surround" mode, correct upmix results are achieved with every channel configuration. Channel switching also works perfectly with original 5.1 sources, no matter if it's downmixed (for 2 channel mode) or not.

Will be fixed soon.

2Infernus 2Silversight: Thank you for your reports.
My English is very good!
...in comparison with my Korean language...

Channel Mixer (foo_channel_mixer)

Reply #191
You're right in case of foobar2000 0.9. In 0.8.3 5-channel mode output is L/R/C/LFE/RL. 
I never tested this mode before...

Kind of a funny setup. 

In other hand, in 5-channel sample sent by Borisz channel configuration is L/R/C/RL/RR. 
Has anyone have another samples or specs?

I only found AC3 files with the same channels, and I doubt there are many other 5-channel configurations, as L/R/C/RL/RR is pretty much the only way to maintain "true" 5.1 playback with a 5-channel sample. As the LFE doesn't need positional information, it can be lowpass-derived from the other channels without great loss and thus can leave a free channel for the center signal.

The problem is that the 5 channels provided by these AC3 files (despite the fact that AC3 is capable of 6 channels) are not the same channels as those a typical user of 5-channel mode has speakers for. That typical 5-channel mode user has a 4.1 speaker system (I assume this, though I have no statistical evidence; I've just never heard of a 5.0 speaker system) and no use for a center signal, so even for 5-channel mode a 5-channel source has to be re-mixed. My suggestion is to leave LFE enabled in 5-channel mode - as its users most likely do have subwoofers - and mix the otherwise unusable center signal into the L/R channels.
In that context, maybe it could also help to rename the modes according to the speaker setups they are best suited for - for example: 1, 2.0/2.1, 4.0, 4.1 and 5.1/more.

2Infernus 2Silversight: Thank you for your reports.

You're welcome! Thank you for your efforts. 

edit:
As for me, I have a 5.1 speaker system.

edit 2:
As for samples: Some free AC3 music tracks can be downloaded here.
Nothing is impossible if you don't need to do it yourself.

Channel Mixer (foo_channel_mixer)

Reply #192
A Question.

I have the following order (from top to bottom) in my DSP manager:
  • Resampler
  • Channel Mixer
  • Advanced Limiter
Is this order appropriate or better to be changed?

Channel Mixer (foo_channel_mixer)

Reply #193
I have the following order (from top to bottom) in my DSP manager:
  • Resampler
  • Channel Mixer
  • Advanced Limiter
Is this order appropriate or better to be changed?

It's OK.
My English is very good!
...in comparison with my Korean language...

Channel Mixer (foo_channel_mixer)

Reply #194
Hi. Do you plan to support new DSP Presets feature, that was introduced in new foobar2000 beta?

And another question: what values should I use for "Rear in front" and "Front in rear"? Should they sum to 1.00 ?? I've discovered, that (on my 5.1 sound system), it's the best when i use smth about 1.6 / 0.9 - but I think I'm doing something wrong

Channel Mixer (foo_channel_mixer)

Reply #195
Hi. Do you plan to support new DSP Presets feature, that was introduced in new foobar2000 beta?

It's already done. Therefore, you can't hear changes in realtime, but you can use different setups for playback and converting.

And another question: what values should I use for "Rear in front" and "Front in rear"? Should they sum to 1.00 ?? I've discovered, that (on my 5.1 sound system), it's the best when i use smth about 1.6 / 0.9 - but I think I'm doing something wrong

Your setup is for widening the stereobase.
The "correct" setup is FIR=0, RIF=1.0, but there are no "correctness" of a sound after Channel Mixer surround upmixing - stereo sound must be heard on 2-channels system at all, therefore use such setup, which is comfortable for you.
My English is very good!
...in comparison with my Korean language...

Channel Mixer (foo_channel_mixer)

Reply #196
Can annyone recommand some settings for a 5.1. Teufel Magnum M System? Right now I can't access it. But in one week university starts again - then I'll play around ab it

Channel Mixer (foo_channel_mixer)

Reply #197
Yes. Works quite well. I think this is a tad better in overall sound as well as complete control over each channel as compared to Creative's CMSS 3D, though I feel Winamp+CMSS is a tad cleaner. But this might just make me switch. Thanks Skipyrich and all who helped. I will try out some further settings later today.

How does Foobar bypass Creative's processing? Even with foo_channel_mixer, if I set 2 speakers for normal stereo, I need to enable bass redirection in Creative Speaker settings. If I set it to 6 ch, I actually need to disable the bass redirection in Creative Speaker settings to get the sub to work.

Channel Mixer (foo_channel_mixer)

Reply #198
Yes. Works quite well. I think this is a tad better in overall sound as well as complete control over each channel as compared to Creative's CMSS 3D, though I feel Winamp+CMSS is a tad cleaner. But this might just make me switch. Thanks Skipyrich and all who helped. I will try out some further settings later today.

How does Foobar bypass Creative's processing? Even with foo_channel_mixer, if I set 2 speakers for normal stereo, I need to enable bass redirection in Creative Speaker settings. If I set it to 6 ch, I actually need to disable the bass redirection in Creative Speaker settings to get the sub to work.


bass redirection in the creative speaker settings? i have the panel in front of me, and even i don't see what you mean
anyway, the cleanliness may be obtained by lowering the 'rear in front' and 'front in rear' values to very low ones (it actually causes saturation even at medium volume levels for some (soprano) arias, and it isn't my speakerset that's crappy).. anyway, the whole point of this is that you get it to upmix/duplicate (though i prefer the 'surround' feature on the channel mixer to the cmss-3d 'upmix' feature, as the stereo image adjustment does jack shit in the Creative version, while it works just fine in foo_channel_mixer)

anyway, cmss-3d only works on 2-channel audio.. so if you get foobar to upmix it to 6-ch audio already it'll be bypassed..

anyway, my original intention was to ask skipy if the 'front in rear' and 'rear in front' really are supposed to cause saturation (the total gain seems a bit much even at .75 level for both of them).. either that or explain the workings of them a bit better (it saturates at 50% volume on my speakers with them both at .8 while the song with FiR+RiF on 0 it doesn't even saturate at 90% max speaker volume)

thanks for the plugin

Channel Mixer (foo_channel_mixer)

Reply #199
anyway, my original intention was to ask skipy if the 'front in rear' and 'rear in front' really are supposed to cause saturation (the total gain seems a bit much even at .75 level for both of them).. either that or explain the workings of them a bit better (it saturates at 50% volume on my speakers with them both at .8 while the song with FiR+RiF on 0 it doesn't even saturate at 90% max speaker volume)

I'm afraid that my English will not allow me to clearly explain this thing, but I'll try...
The principle of surround upmix is to move "out-of-phase" signal from the front speakers to the rear. I.e.:
make center channel by removing out-of-phase signal from L/R:
C=(L+R)/2
extract out-of-phase signal from L/R then send it to RL/RR:
RL = L-C
RR = R-C
That's all, nothing more!
But the sound in RL/RR channels is too dry and inexpressive, therefore I have added two additional settings: "front in rear" and "rear in front". FiR controls how many of initial signal will be in rear channels. RiF controls how many of extracted signal will be in front channels. I.e.:
L = L-RL*(1-RiF)
R = R-RR*(1-RiF)
RL = RL+L*FiR
RR = RR+R*FiR
If you set RiF to '0', then you will receive just mono signal in front speakers:
L = L-RL => L-(L-C) => C
R = R-RR => R-(R-C) => C
If you set FiR to '1', then you will receive expanded stereo in rear speakers:
RL = RL+L*FiR => 2L-C
RR = RR+R*FiR => 2R-C

My favorite settings is: FiR=0.3, RiF=0.7
My English is very good!
...in comparison with my Korean language...