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Topic: Normalization (Read 4711 times) previous topic - next topic
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Normalization

Hi folks. Thank you for allowing me to be a part of your Community. I have been using Acoustica's "MP3 CD Burner" for several years. I am very pleased with it and the extras the Program has on it such as being able to adjust the volume on a song and "Boost" which changes Dynamic Compression.
As a matter of fact I found you all via "Acoustica's" "Table of Contents". As I searched your site for ways to better Normalize my MP3's and WAV Files, I read stuff that is way over my head. Any help or advice I could get, would be greatly appreciated.

Normally I convert my MP3's to WAV Files in MP3 CD Burner. I am able to get the songs pretty close to the same Volume.
However, I thought I would try making an MP3 Disc last week. That was my first one. I had a lot of songs I wanted to put on one CDR. I only used about 400 MB's. I tried to Normalize them manually as well as using the "Automatic Loudness Balancing" That didn't do anything. I never have tried the "Normalizing the Track" acording to the percentage you type in the box according to the "Loudest Track" or "Maximum Level". I have no idea what to set the Percentage.


In reading about convering tracks to "OGG Vorbis", which I never tried, it seems to be very popular with those who know and understanding "Normalization". If you have tracks that are 128, 160, 192 or 256 kbps, "Ogg Vorbis cannot take a 128 kbps and make it sound like a 192 kbps can it? What does converting MP3's to Ogg Vorbis or another type do for your music? Do they make it easier to "Normalize" your tracks?
Are there any good "Programs" that are very good at Normalizing automatically that a novice such as myself could use? Can you reach the same quality of Normalization as a Commercial CD?
Thanks, ptfitzy

Normalization

Reply #1 –
Try MP3Gain
http://mp3gain.sourceforge.net/

This can adjust MP3s without having to decode them, so there is no quality loss.
You should read the help about "track gain" and "album gain".

This uses "Replaygain" which is different to "automatic loudness control" and considered by many to be better, at least for listening on your stereo, rather than a noisy environment like a car.

Quote
Ogg Vorbis cannot take a 128 kbps and make it sound like a 192 kbps can it? What does converting MP3's to Ogg Vorbis or another type do for your music? Do they make it easier to "Normalize" your tracks?

Ogg can't improve the sound. You already have compressed audio (MP3). Converting to a different compression will only degrade them.

Besides, MP3s are much more compatible with players and software.

Normalization

Reply #2 –
Thanks a lot.
I need some help though. I have a file of an "MP3 CD Burner" I saved in Documents. In Documents I saved it as "oldies". With "MP3 Gain" I clicked on "Add Files" and in the box of MP3 Gain under "Path File" it says "C:\Users\ptfitzy\Documents..."
How do I get those MP3's into the MP3 Gain Box?
Thanks, ptfitzy

Normalization

Reply #3 –
If MP3Gain won't add them from a Docs and Settings folder (don't know why) you can drag 'n' drop MP3's onto its window, it's the same really as using Add Files(s).

Normalization

Reply #4 –
ptfitzy,
Just some things for you to think about....

The perception of loudness is complicated.  Tools like MP3gain and ReplayGain are better than normalization because they analyze the frequency content and the average volume. 

NOTE - Most songs are already normalized/maximized.  In order to match the volume of all your files, MP3gain and ReplayGain have to reduce the volume of most files.

Normalization (usually) adjusts the volume to the point where the peaks are at (or near) the digital maximum (0dBFS).  This is the best way to maximize volume without otherwise altering the sound.    But, because it has nothing to do with the average level, the normalized songs will not all sound equally loud.  And as I said, most songs are already normalized so re-normalizing often does nothing.

Dynamic compression can increase the average level (and perceived loudness) without increasing (and without clipping[/color]) the peaks.  However, it will alter the sound.  (Do you really want a whisper to be as loud as a scream/shout?, or a quiet acoustic guitar part to sound as loud as a cymbal crash?)  Most modern music is already over-compressed (see Loudness War[/color]).  Radio stations add more compression.

Quote
Can you reach the same quality of Normalization as a Commercial CD?
When a commercial CD is "mastered", the volume/compression are adjusted "by ear".  The goal isn't always to make all of the songs equally loud.  The CD should "sound right" when played in sequence, and sometimes there are loud songs and quiet songs on the same CD. 

Quote
Normally I convert my MP3's to WAV Files...  In reading about converting tracks to "OGG Vorbis"...
  MP3, OGG, AC3, etc., are lossy compression.  When you convert to WAV and then back to MP3, or when you convert from one lossy format to another, you are going through more than one lossy compression step which can potentially degrade the audio quality.  Sometimes you can't avoid re-compression, but this is something you should be aware of.

Quote
Acoustica's "MP3 CD Burner" for several years. I am very pleased with it and the extras the Program has on it such as being able to adjust the volume on a song and "Boost" which changes Dynamic Compression.
For audio editing (changing volume, compression, EQ, etc.) you might want to try an audio editor.  An audio editor will also allow you to open a file in one format, and save it in another (although this is not the main purpose).    Audacity is FREE!!!      Just be aware that when you edit a compressed file with an audio editor it has to be de-compressed first, and then re-compressed when you re-save.  (There are special purpose MP3 editors that can do very limited editing without de-compressing/re-compressing.)

Normalization

Reply #5 –
Quote from: ptfitzy on
Quote from: Andavari on
If MP3Gain won't add them from a Docs and Settings folder (don't know why) you can drag 'n' drop MP3's onto its window, it's the same really as using Add Files(s).



I'm sorry to be clueless and I really appreciate all your help but:
If I open the file I saved titled "Oldies" listed in Documents, the "MP3 CD Burner" program opens. There are the MP3's listed that I previously burned with the program. Essentially, all I have to do is "Click" on "Burn" and it will make another CD. Could this be why I can't take those songs and "Drag and Drop" them? I clicked on one song and tried dragging it over to "MP3" Gain. As soon as I clicked on the song and started to drag over to "MP3 Gain", the song disappeared.

I noticed if I look up each song in my "Music File", I am able to drag it over to MP3 Gain. However, many of those songs' sounds were changed by reducing songs with too much Bass or adding "Dynamic Compression" on some. 
Do I have to start over dragging each song from the original "Music Files" and if so, how will I be able to mix them to sound like the original CD when I made corrections in their "Bass" or "Dynamic Compression"?

If I put the original CD where I already made "Sound changes" I burned in "MP3 CD Burner" is there a way to add those songs off the CD to "MP3 Gain"?
And I noticed in "MP3 Gain" there are a lot of things you can do. On there is "Target Normal Volume", which I think is all I want to do. I just want to make a CD where all the Tracks are the same volume or close to the same volume. It doesn't have to sound real loud. And if I can insert a CD with MP3 Tracks or drag an drop them in from my Music File, do I have to click on each song or will it adjust them all one after the other.
Sorry if I'm asking too many questions.
ptfitzy

Normalization

Reply #6 –
I hope you get this "Reply". When I click "Reply" to your response there is nowhere to type. I just wanted to thank you as well for the help. I have learned so much from you all just the last 2 Days.
If you know the answers to any of my questions I posted reference using "MP3 Gain", I sure would appreciate it.
ptfitzy

Normalization

Reply #8 –
@ptfitzy 

Reply and Quote generally work the same, they will quote the selected post in totality which for many forums unless it is
absolutely necessary is frowned upon. It is preferable to select a bit of text that best makes your point and use "wrap in
quote tags" like I did with your comment below. 

Quote from: ptfitzy link=msg=0 date=
When I click "Reply" to your response there is nowhere to type

In your case the quote was so large the editor window was full, you only needed to find the close quote - "/quote" - and begin your
response below. If you select Quote, nothing will happen, you can select the fast reply editor to type your response or, after selecting
fast reply click more options which will bring up an advanced editor that will allow you to preview your post before posting. 

Normalization

Reply #9 –
Cleaned things up a bit. Hopefully I didn't screw anything up too badly...

Normalization

Reply #10 –
I'm sorry but I'm still kind of lost. Whenever I see a reply to my E Mail like yours above, is there always a "Quick Reply" such as what I'm typing?
And can I use that or are you saying just start typing in the same box as the person who sent mea replyby continuing on. I think that is what you mean?
 

Normalization

Reply #11 –
ptfitzy you could create a test thread in the Off-Topic forum area just for practicing how the quoting features and such work.