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Hosted Forums => foobar2000 => Development - (fb2k) => Topic started by: EpicForever on 2018-03-23 17:12:18

Title: foobar going 64bit?
Post by: EpicForever on 2018-03-23 17:12:18
A simple question regarding development path:
Is foobar going to become 64 bit app in near future? There would be one advantage of such move - bigger memory usage, which could allow for speeding up for example ML search functionalities for very large libraries. But of course there are those side effects, like causing all current plugins being incompatible / requiring recompiling/additional development.

So is something like this considered or no? I am just curious, nothing more.
Title: Re: foobar going 64bit?
Post by: jazzthieve on 2018-03-23 17:43:50
Good question, I'm curious about that too although I don't have my hopes up.
Title: Re: foobar going 64bit?
Post by: lvqcl on 2018-03-23 18:58:04
It can't become 64-bit while still supporting WinXP, and

foobar2000 still supports Windows versions as old as Windows XP - and that's not expected to change this decade

BTW, I will miss foo_jesus and foo_chacon.
Title: Re: foobar going 64bit?
Post by: Peter on 2018-03-23 20:40:32
This was actually done as early as 2005 with 0.9 alpha series on Windows XP 64-bit but there were no interesting benefits beyond the potential ability to index larger libraries / load larger playlists - but the performance would still suck due to loading on startup and saving on shutdown.

The main problem with 64-bit build is that no existing component will work. Maintaining separate 64-bit and 32-bit builds of every single component would have created a huge mess, that's why I abandoned the idea.

There are other options for improving large media library search performance at cost of component compatibility, for an example replacing the ancient metadb design with a modern SQLite backend - which would solve slow search, slow startup, slow shutdown and large memory usage.

That said, every flavour of foobar2000 mobile does have a 64-bit compile available and even the experimental Mac version is 64-bit.
Title: Re: foobar going 64bit?
Post by: jazzthieve on 2018-03-23 20:49:08
Loving the sqlite idea. I'm doing that already using an ancient wsh script but it's more to store data and display graphs and not for searching. I often wondered why foobar doesn't go the more true database route.
Title: Re: foobar going 64bit?
Post by: Peter on 2018-03-24 06:38:54
Basically I can't redesign foobar2000 database without making existing components not work - the metadb interface presented to components has very strong ties to the existing database design.

foobar2000 mobile - and foobar2000 for Mac prototype - already all use SQLite.
Title: Re: foobar going 64bit?
Post by: EpicForever on 2018-03-24 19:34:40
Thanks for answers :)
Title: Re: foobar going 64bit?
Post by: Euathlus1985 on 2018-05-08 22:42:21
Hi, why not making Windows Store foobar 64bit, addons are not working there anyway, even if it would some day.

BTW: When is Store version updated to Beta 12?
Title: Re: foobar going 64bit?
Post by: tlen on 2018-11-21 13:10:21
+1 for a 64bit build.

In my case i use some VST plugins wich unfortunately (or fortunately?) are starting to drop x86 version support.

I already have the new version of my beloved IRCAM Hear v3 that doesn't support x86 anymore :(
Title: Re: foobar going 64bit?
Post by: kode54 on 2018-11-23 01:08:22
That is not necessary for VST plugin support. My foo_midi component, for instance, already supports 64 bit VST instruments, since they are loaded out of process anyway.
Title: Re: foobar going 64bit?
Post by: TheEmpathicEar on 2020-02-05 01:41:35
[long time...] I just bought a new Windows 10 Pro x64 PC. [Of course, almost all PCs are 64-bit now?] If I don't hear back here, I'll try starting a new thread.
Title: Re: foobar going 64bit?
Post by: loft on 2020-02-05 06:19:19
In my very humble opinion there will only be a 64 bit version of foobar2000 when Windows is going to force it by dropping support for 32 bit apps.
Title: Re: foobar going 64bit?
Post by: Melchior on 2020-02-27 04:10:55
all the game music Components I use written by Kode54... he is a great programmer so I have no doubt he could rewrite them for 64bit some day... lol ;) ^_^ :D

and I too would like to see a native build for 64bit Windows 7+ lol
if possible... its just installing the new version in such a way as to import existing settings files and DB files.. as I save the settings and db files and playlist internally to the Foobar2000 program folder...
Title: Re: foobar going 64bit?
Post by: tlen on 2020-10-15 15:32:46
That is not necessary for VST plugin support. My foo_midi component, for instance, already supports 64 bit VST instruments, since they are loaded out of process anyway.
That makes perfect sense.

Unfortunately there are no news on the internal vst wrapper for 64bit VST support.
 
Title: Re: foobar going 64bit?
Post by: 920619lqy on 2021-02-04 01:03:16
A prototype of 64bit version could be a try.
It does not need to be compatible with all extensions, just integrated components only is fine for now. Some audio formats which need external decoders (such as .ape, .tak, .tta) can be just fed to ffmpeg and it can deal with them.
Title: Re: foobar going 64bit?
Post by: kode54 on 2021-02-04 02:15:04
Going ARM serves about as much purpose, and breaks just as much. Also not likely to ever happen.
Title: Re: foobar going 64bit?
Post by: im_special on 2021-02-04 11:30:16
It's really sad seeing this (again) knowing that foobar will "probably" never see any significant performance gains because of old outdated and some probably unmaintained components. As my music collection keeps ever growing, foobar degraded performance does too. That SQLite backend stuff would be like a dream come true.
Title: Re: foobar going 64bit?
Post by: Cannonaire on 2021-02-04 11:59:16
I'm very happy with the performance of Foobar2000 and the components I use. I'm just concerned that someday 32-bit support in Windows might be deprecated, and I'll have to make due without components I've come to rely on.

My opinion doesn't count for much, but I think the earlier a 64-bit version is available, the earlier people can start supporting it with good components. Start too late and you'll miss the opportunity to get some component developers on board.
Title: Re: foobar going 64bit?
Post by: TheQwertiest on 2021-02-04 12:13:39
I'm just concerned that someday 32-bit support in Windows might be deprecated, and I'll have to make due without components I've come to rely on.
You don't have to worry about it. This won't happen in the near future.
Windows is hell-bent on backward-compatibility and the amount of still-in-use 32bit-only applications is staggering (heck, even MSI binary is 32bit-only).
Windows is not MacOS =)
Title: Re: foobar going 64bit?
Post by: Porcus on 2021-02-04 12:40:12
Windows is hell-bent on backward-compatibility

Yeah, I mean ...
* Jumping from Windows 8 to Windows 10 in order not to break software that would identify Windows 95 and 98 by "Windows 9"
* Micros~1 - the 8.3 filenames.
* "Long" pathnames are still an issue because they dare not change that constant. Trying to move stuff with Windows Explorer, and Windows will rather have you lose files than allowing long names. (But if you are lucky you can use the 8.3 ...)

... oh but we all got fsck'd when Microsoft deprecated drive names like "]:", didn't we?
Title: Re: foobar going 64bit?
Post by: 2tec on 2021-02-04 14:16:43
So, how about starting a 64 bit *nix version in co-development? maybe open-source?
Title: Re: foobar going 64bit?
Post by: TheQwertiest on 2021-02-04 14:44:19
maybe open-source?
- Why no open-source?
- https://hydrogenaud.io/index.php/topic,31222.msg270982.html#msg270982
Title: Re: foobar going 64bit?
Post by: TheQwertiest on 2021-02-04 17:08:54
@kode54 , @Peter,
do you think it would  be possible to add the following questions to the FAQ? Since they are being asked regularly and they always result in long threads of same arguments being made over and over again...

- Why is there no 64-bit foobar2000?
- Why is there no native dark theme?
- Why is there no Linux-native foobar2000?
- Why is foobar2000 not open-source?

I can even grep some replies with quotes from this board if you want :D
Title: Re: foobar going 64bit?
Post by: TheQwertiest on 2021-02-04 17:11:12
Oh and of course:
- Why is there no support for WinAmp skins?
- Why is there no WinAmp skin?

:DDD
Title: Re: foobar going 64bit?
Post by: U2021 on 2021-04-06 15:29:49
Hello friends. Everything is going to ARM64. I do not know what will happen to foobar, which does not even support x64 natively. how do you run foobar on Apple M1?
Title: Re: foobar going 64bit?
Post by: kode54 on 2021-04-06 22:14:50
foobar2000 for Mac is built for x86_64+arm64 already.

foobar2000 for Windows does run under CrossOver for Mac, even on M1. There may be some limitations, such as OpenGL stuff working or not, if you install such things.
Title: Re: foobar going 64bit?
Post by: Melchior on 2021-04-06 22:20:19
Kode54, can you update all of your plugins for 64bit if Foobar2000 goes 64bit for Windows some day?
is it possible?
Title: Re: foobar going 64bit?
Post by: kode54 on 2021-04-07 01:59:48
Certainly, I'll do that for everything I can recompile that doesn't depend on some third party code I can't recompile myself. That basically means the TAK plugin will need to be dissolved and replaced with FFmpeg, preferably by foobar itself and not a component bundling its own FFmpeg. And the TTA plugin, too, because that's closed source. And SNESAPU, because that's not just 32 bit, it's 32 bit assembly language.
Title: Re: foobar going 64bit?
Post by: Melchior on 2021-04-07 02:11:41
kool ty, but the SNESAPU... does that mean you can't update the foo GameEmuPlayer to 64bit?
ooh noes... I guess were stuck with a 32bit Foobar2000... as I use these Foobar2000 components on a daily basis...
 :(  :(
Title: Re: foobar going 64bit?
Post by: kode54 on 2021-04-07 03:40:39
Game Emu Player is entirely C and C++ code, so of course I can update it for 64 bit. It already exists as 64 bit in foobar2000 for Mac, 64 bit x86 and 64 bit ARM in foobar2000 Mobile for Android, 64 bit ARM in foobar2000 Mobile for iOS, and 64 bit x86 and 64 bit ARM in Cog for macOS.

The code is even endian portable, but all the above systems are little endian anyway.
Title: Re: foobar going 64bit?
Post by: Melchior on 2021-04-07 04:13:10
great!, ty 64bit here we come lol  8)  ;D  :D  ;)
right.. I use Foobar2000 ANDROID mobile version often listening to video game music files
like SNES, Genesis, and PS1 and PS2 no problem...
Title: SPLIT: U2021 going offtopic
Post by: Peter on 2021-04-10 08:45:13
One or more of the messages of this topic have been moved to 3rd Party Plugins - (fb2k) (https://hydrogenaud.io/index.php?board=33.0) - https://hydrogenaud.io/index.php?topic=120823.0
Title: Re: foobar going 64bit?
Post by: prince1908 on 2021-05-31 06:46:06
hello
Is it possible foobar play 24 192 clear in windows 10 64bit?
Title: Re: foobar going 64bit?
Post by: NetRanger on 2021-05-31 12:47:43
fb2k plays 24bit files just fine
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