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Topic: Soundcard for ripping vinyl? (Read 12479 times) previous topic - next topic
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Soundcard for ripping vinyl?

Reply #25 –
Quote from: freddy687 on
Whether I am a professional or not still doesn't nullify my point.

What is your point?


Your kidding, right?  Did you even read my post?  A number of people have been suggesting using USB connections as a means of recording.  My point?  "...USB recording systems can be occasionally frustrating even with supposedly highly rated equipment."


I never said a lack of being a professional nullified your point, I said that your experience was probably not relevant to this thread because you seem to have had some weird technical problem that other people probably won't experience.

Soundcard for ripping vinyl?

Reply #26 –
Admittedly a weird technical problem but still i think worth mentioning to someone thinking of getting into this.  Especially given my experience in the area having used a variety of USB devices and certainly not expecting any problems.  And by the way, I believe you are not correct in your statement,  "USB connections don't have a "quality". Even if they did, that certainly won't cause noise."  By USB connections I was referring to the quality of the cable connecting the ADC to the computer.  There may not be a difference in the digital signal between cables (digital is digital) but I believe there is a difference in the shielding and the potential for interference and influencing background "noise".  Again in this case the background noise (a little over 4000Hz) from the ADL was fairly noticeable with a Wire World Starlight Red USB 2.0 Audio Cable and was a different frequency and much less noticeable with a Belkin Premium braided shielded USB 2.O cable.  But still there.  No high pitched noise what so ever with ZPhono or USB Phonoplus as the ADC. All grounded in the same manner.  So yes, the cable didn't "cause" the noise but its construction influenced the degree of noise.  Whether you consider that "quality" I don't know but there was a difference.    Again, have recordings of each scenario that I submitted to the company.

Just my experience.

Soundcard for ripping vinyl?

Reply #27 –
Quote from: freddy687 on
Admittedly a weird technical problem but still i think worth mentioning to someone thinking of getting into this.


I think if you have some weird technical problem, you should say so, and not try to generalize your peculiar circumstances to everyone else. 

Quote from: freddy687 on
And by the way, I believe you are not correct in your statement,  "USB connections don't have a "quality". Even if they did, that certainly won't cause noise."  By USB connections I was referring to the quality of the cable connecting the ADC to the computer.


Yes I know you were referring to that, and no, they do not have a quality.  Absolutely not. 

Quote from: freddy687 on
There may not be a difference in the digital signal between cables (digital is digital) but I believe there is a difference in the shielding and the potential for interference and influencing background "noise".


In a USB ADC, the ADC converts the analog audio signal to digital before the cable (which cannot carry an analog signal at all).  Interference along the cable from lack of shielding is therefore impossible.  Either the cable will work and the ADC will be usable, or it will not work and the ADC will not be usable. 

Quote from: freddy687 on
Again in this case the background noise (a little over 4000Hz) from the ADL was fairly noticeable with a Wire World Starlight Red USB 2.0 Audio Cable and was a different frequency and much less noticeable with a Belkin Premium braided shielded USB 2.O cable.  But still there.  No high pitched noise what so ever with ZPhono or USB Phonoplus as the ADC. All grounded in the same manner.


This is a wiring problem with your setup. It has nothing to do with the ADC or the cable.

Soundcard for ripping vinyl?

Reply #28 –
You just don't get it do you.  For all of your supposed education you can't understand a controlled study in which only one variable is changed, the USB cable.  If the cable was not a
contributor to the noise problem then why would there have been a difference in the level and type of noise between the two cables when there were no other variables?

Its too bad that someone can't offer an opinion from experience on this forum without being blasted for not having enough credentials or supposedly generalizing my situation to the
experience of the rest of the world.  Just trying to help someone who is in the same boat I was.

I'm done.  You won't have any more of my supposedly inaccurate and irrelevant input. 

Soundcard for ripping vinyl?

Reply #29 –
Quote from: freddy687 on
For all of your supposed education you can't understand a controlled study in which only one variable is changed, the USB cable.  If the cable was not a
contributor to the noise problem then why would there have been a difference in the level and type of noise between the two cables when there were no other variables?


This isn't good reasoning.  If changing a digital cable changes an unrelated analog signal, the logical conclusion is not that the ones and zeros on the cable are actually an analog signal.  It is that you have made a bad assumption somewhere else in the system, probably due to a wiring problem, and you need to troubleshoot your problem.  Finding that any difference seemingly existed between two lossless devices should be the beginning of your investigation, not its conclusion. 

Quote from: freddy687 on
Its too bad that someone can't offer an opinion from experience on this forum without being blasted for not having enough credentials or supposedly generalizing my situation to the
experience of the rest of the world.


You can offer your opinion, but if your opinion is based on a misunderstanding or misconception, expect people to challenge it.  This is an internet forum after all, not your personal diary.  We are not obliged to agree with you, especially not when you are incorrect.  Rather, the purpose of this forum is to educate you. 

Quote from: freddy687 on
Just trying to help someone who is in the same boat I was.


Then you should listen to greynol's advice:

Quote from: greynol on
I think the community would be far better served with samples rather than with anecdotes.


Soundcard for ripping vinyl?

Reply #30 –
Quote from: freddy687 on
You just don't get it do you.  For all of your supposed education you can't understand a controlled study in which only one variable is changed, the USB cable.  If the cable was not a  contributor to the noise problem then why would there have been a difference in the level and type of noise between the two cables when there were no other variables?

...


Sidenote from E-MU 0404 USB UG EN (page 12):

Quote
WARNING!
Use only a USB 2.0 certified Hi-Speed cable (like the one supplied) for the USB connection. Using a USB 1.1 cable may cause erratic behavior and degraded
performance.



Remember 0404 USB isn't bus powered device!
 

Soundcard for ripping vinyl?

Reply #31 –
Quote from: freddy687 on
The guy asked for an opinion and I gave it.  Years of practical experience working with a variety of platforms.


Please explain the vast collection of USB-attached audio devices that I have before me that operate free of audible noise.

For example I have an EMu 0404 USB that has about 110 dB dynamic range, which is way deep into overkill. And that's with randomly-chosen commodity USB cables.

I have to admit that I know that USB adds a layer of complexity and opportunity for problems to every device that is based on it. However, a lot of stuff I've tried makes the cut.

Quote
And I think I know the difference from record noise and other.  And since I don't get any of this noise on my current setup I'm pretty sure its not that.  It varied also with the quality of the USB connection but still didn't disappear.  The problem I had may very well have been a grounding issue but tried a variety of solutions with ADL's help and nothing worked to completely eliminate it. They even sent a new one which was better but still had the problem.  Not as much problem with some of the other units such as my ZPhono but as mentioned they were limited in the ability to record higher rates.


I see the conflation of a number of points, for example the fact that a wide variety of USB devices depend on the default drivers that are supplied as part of most releases of Windows which are in turn limited to 44 or 48 KHz.

That's just life, and besides there are few logical reasons for trying to surpass 44/16.

Soundcard for ripping vinyl?

Reply #32 –
Quote from: Arnold B. Krueger on
Quote from: doomslug on
About six or seven years ago I was doing some vinyl rips with a M-Audio 2496 card and a Technics SL-1200mk5 with decent results.  I still have the Technics and I'm thinking about building a new PC to get back to ripping some of my collection.  I only have an old Macbook at the moment.  All of my knowledge is severely out of date.  Could anyone recommend a decent audio card out there for what I'm doing?


Vinyl technology hasn't changed appreciably since the early 1970s, and PC's still often have PCI slots for that AP2496.

Why not just carry forward?


Drivers support may be lacking for a newer version of windows.

Soundcard for ripping vinyl?

Reply #33 –
Quote from: Tuxon86 on
Quote from: Arnold B. Krueger on
Quote from: doomslug on
About six or seven years ago I was doing some vinyl rips with a M-Audio 2496 card and a Technics SL-1200mk5 with decent results.  I still have the Technics and I'm thinking about building a new PC to get back to ripping some of my collection.  I only have an old Macbook at the moment.  All of my knowledge is severely out of date.  Could anyone recommend a decent audio card out there for what I'm doing?


Vinyl technology hasn't changed appreciably since the early 1970s, and PC's still often have PCI slots for that AP2496.

Why not just carry forward?


Drivers support may be lacking for a newer version of windows.


I'm having good performance with Delta series cards and Windows 7.1/64.

Soundcard for ripping vinyl?

Reply #34 –
Quote from: Arnold B. Krueger on
That's just life, and besides there are few logical reasons for trying to surpass 44/16.

I can think of a few, but "bigger is always better" or "my ears can hear a difference in a sighted evaluation" don't exactly qualify.
 

Soundcard for ripping vinyl?

Reply #35 –
Quote from: Arnold B. Krueger on
Quote from: Tuxon86 on
Quote from: Arnold B. Krueger on
Quote from: doomslug on
About six or seven years ago I was doing some vinyl rips with a M-Audio 2496 card and a Technics SL-1200mk5 with decent results.  I still have the Technics and I'm thinking about building a new PC to get back to ripping some of my collection.  I only have an old Macbook at the moment.  All of my knowledge is severely out of date.  Could anyone recommend a decent audio card out there for what I'm doing?


Vinyl technology hasn't changed appreciably since the early 1970s, and PC's still often have PCI slots for that AP2496.

Why not just carry forward?


Drivers support may be lacking for a newer version of windows.


I'm having good performance with Delta series cards and Windows 7.1/64.


Yes, but keep in mind that those card aren't certified for windows passed version 7. They may work in 8/8.1 and 10 since Microsoft doesn't seem to have modified the underlying drivers architecture for a while, but you never know...