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Topic: Altmann Tera Player (and light model) (Read 13919 times) previous topic - next topic
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Altmann Tera Player (and light model)

Reply #25 –
Quote from: lovemyTera on
The thread starter asked, and I responded to the best of my ability.  I'm really happy with Tera -- cheers!

The thread starter asked for getting answers the way our TOS works and you accepted them when registering. Silly wine anectodes don't serve anyone.
Is troll-adiposity coming from feederism?
With 24bit music you can listen to silence much louder!

Altmann Tera Player (and light model)

Reply #26 –
Quote from: Wombat on
Now that are enough times reported about its sound i vote for the Recycler! Every single post.


I'll leave you folks alone then.  Perhaps I mistook the question of the sound in audiophiledom as paramount over features and accessories.  Tera has little to offer other than sound, simplicity, and durability.  Since  it is  so subjective,maybe we should all just agree not to discuss sound on this forum.
Let Rock Reign !!!

Altmann Tera Player (and light model)

Reply #27 –
It is painfully obvious that you didn't read the rules of this forum, and now you suggest what they ought to be?!?  Can you see how this might be considered offensive to the people who know what the rules actually are?  The golden rule here is TOS #8. By disrespecting it, you disrespect this community.

The fact remains that there is a method to objectively substantiate your subjective impressions of this media player.  As a contributing member (meaning that you've posted), it is your responsibly to apply it. Otherwise your comments about sound quality are hollow. I will even go so far as to suggest that they are most likely nothing more than a construct of your imagination.  The only other possible alternative is that this player does sound different, which would imply inferior quality since it is pretty well established that mainstream players are competently designed not to impart any type of coloration, except possibly when driving difficult load impedances.  I doubt this player performs any better under those circumstances.

Altmann Tera Player (and light model)

Reply #28 –
I'm really unprepared to provide graphs and stats to describe a perception or flavor.  As such, I believe it appropriate to bow out of this group even as the sole person who has actually heard the Subject of this thread.  It was a bargain at 840 euros... I want another.
Let Rock Reign !!!

Altmann Tera Player (and light model)

Reply #29 –
Your reading skills leave something to be desired, since the rule explicitly states that graphs aren't acceptable.

I trust your listening abilities even less.

Altmann Tera Player (and light model)

Reply #30 –
I think it is pretty well known that in the configuration used the DAC ignores the sampling theorem and basically just produces square waves at the amplitude of each sample.


This obviously gets a lot worse at high frequencies.

The analog filter after the DAC may smooth the square waves a bit, but could add large amounts of phase shift in the audio range.
I wouldn't be surprised if the roll-off and phase shift were actually audible.


As I said before ... I don't get this product, but then I understand what is going on (or not) in many audiophile brains.
"I hear it when I see it."

Altmann Tera Player (and light model)

Reply #31 –
I had no idea the DAC in that piece of shit was so primitive.

...or maybe I did and have since forgotten as we already covered the Altmann Tera Snake Oil Player.

Altmann Tera Player (and light model)

Reply #32 –
So long folks! I purchased a player, not a hobby.  These forums quickly devolve into judgements.  For those in the market I recommend an audition.
Let Rock Reign !!!

Altmann Tera Player (and light model)

Reply #33 –
Quote from: lovemyTera on
It was a bargain at 840 euros... I want another.

Now that was a joke! Wasn't it? I still don't get it...
Is troll-adiposity coming from feederism?
With 24bit music you can listen to silence much louder!

Altmann Tera Player (and light model)

Reply #35 –
Quote from: xnor on
I think it is pretty well known that in the configuration used the DAC ignores the sampling theorem and basically just produces square waves at the amplitude of each sample.


This obviously gets a lot worse at high frequencies.

The analog filter after the DAC may smooth the square waves a bit, but could add large amounts of phase shift in the audio range.
I wouldn't be surprised if the roll-off and phase shift were actually audible.
Am I right in the assumption that this would be less of a (audible) problem with an oversampling DAC, i.e. if the time between rising and falling edge of the square waves is way shorter than 50 us (1/20kHz)? You'd still deliver excessive energy in high frequencies which may be damaging to equipment, but at least the waveform is approximated better.
It's only audiophile if it's inconvenient.

Altmann Tera Player (and light model)

Reply #36 –
Yeah a "modern" DAC will oversample, i.e. follow the original waveform much more closely, which also makes the analog filter much simpler since it can operate far outside the audio range.

There's always some high frequency noise but the result will be much closer to the original waveform: little to no roll-off at 20 kHz, less phase shift ...
"I hear it when I see it."

Altmann Tera Player (and light model)

Reply #37 –
Quote from: xnor on
I think it is pretty well known that in the configuration used the DAC ignores the sampling theorem and basically just produces square waves at the amplitude of each sample.


This obviously gets a lot worse at high frequencies.

The analog filter after the DAC may smooth the square waves a bit, but could add large amounts of phase shift in the audio range.
I wouldn't be surprised if the roll-off and phase shift were actually audible.


It is not clear to me from the marketing materials, which is the extent of online technical analysis that seems to be readily available, how this area (or any other area) of the machine is made in detail.


The mention of a NOS R2R DAC suggests the use of the classic TI/BB PCM1704 or the Phillips TDA1543, but they were apparently not the final choice:


I found more info here: Altman Interview Link

"So I found another Philips DAC, with improved SNR and THD over the TDA1543,
smaller package and lower power consumption. This sounded very good from the
start, but I still have spent another year on the final implementation for
perfecting the sound quality to its full potential."

We thus know what it is not, but probably not what it is.

Quote
As I said before ... I don't get this product, but then I understand what is going on (or not) in many audiophile brains.


The device seems to be a full-force excursion into audio mysticism. Thus previous comments about its salient properties being non-measureable seem to relate.

Altmann Tera Player (and light model)

Reply #38 –
Yeah probably a TDA1541.
But it doesn't really matter. He clearly states no oversampling or digital filtering and a R2R DAC. So expect 5 dB roll-off at 20 kHz with CD audio, phase shift, and probably high noise and distortion coming from this old chip.
I wouldn't be surprised if performance is somewhere below 13 bits. That's probably why everyone frowns upon doing measurements..

I throw up a bit every time I see the blatant lies on his website ("world's best sounding player", "only portable player with bit-perfect playback" and many others), so I'm done with this topic.
"I hear it when I see it."
 

Altmann Tera Player (and light model)

Reply #39 –
Quote from: xnor on
Yeah probably a TDA1541.


He seems to imply something more modern,

Quote
But it doesn't really matter. He clearly states no oversampling or digital filtering and a R2R DAC. So expect 5 dB roll-off at 20 kHz with CD audio, phase shift, and probably high noise and distortion coming from this old chip.


It is possible that there is no formal low pass filtering at all. This has been stylish among the placebophile set, lately.

The old TDA1541 is pretty good.  The major impact of no formal filtering is a lot of artifacts at 22 KHz and up. Of course we don't hear so well up there, so it might even be fairly benign.

TDA 1541 data sheet.

Quote
I wouldn't be surprised if performance is somewhere below 13 bits. That's probably why everyone frowns upon doing measurements..


A valid measurement would show all the > 22 KHz trash, right?


Quote
I throw up a bit every time I see the blatant lies on his website ("world's best sounding player", "only portable player with bit-perfect playback" and many others), so I'm done with this topic.


It's revealed truth to the placebophile set, ;-)