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Topic: Sort Order tags (Read 7414 times) previous topic - next topic
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Sort Order tags

Foobar won't seem to write OR read proper TSOP/TSOA/TSOT tags, despite claiming to work with id3v2.4

I can tell foobar to create a tag with the field name "TSOP" and write data to it... but when I load the file into MP3tag, it shows up as a field with the name "TSOP", not the actual sort-order tag. If I use MP3 tag to write an ArtistSortOrder tag (their name for the TSOP entry field), and then load the mp3 back into foobar, foobar doesn't display a tag for TSOP, for ArtistSortOrder, or anything. It looks exactly as if no TSO* tags were present.

Evidently, foobar is completely incapable of recognizing this tag? That seems very odd, what am I missing?

_jp

EDIT: updating foobar to the latest version has added support for ArtistSortOrder, AlbumSortOrder, and TitleSortOrder... but NOT BandSortOrder, which both iTunes and MP3tag recognize.

Sort Order tags

Reply #1 –
Those frames are not officially part of the id3v2.4 standard.
elevatorladylevitateme

Sort Order tags

Reply #2 –
Quote from: shakey_snake on
Those frames are proprietary to iTunes, and while many other programs might have adopted them, fb2k has not.

You're telling me it's adopted SortAlbum, SortArtist, and SortTitle, but SortBand is somehow different?

Sorry, but that doesn't make any sense.

Quote
Perhaps this needs to be revisited, but considering it would be stupid to support the tags without implementing using the "sort" frames, which would require re-writing a bunch of things like the Album List, as well as adding some sort of remapping for other file formats, I doubt it will happen.

I only want this to tag my files for Rockbox, I don't care if foobar can USE them as long as it can see them and write them... which it can for three of them, just not the last one (BANDSORTORDER).

Sort Order tags

Reply #3 –
I believe the TSO2 tag is a more recent addition from iTunes.

When things aren't part of the standard, it becomes difficult to keep track of the mess.
elevatorladylevitateme

Sort Order tags

Reply #4 –
So what is the field name I'm supposed to use to sort artists by? TSOP? Or maybe ARTISTSORTORDER or SORTARTIST? I've been using ARTIST SORT because I didn't know any better, what frame would that be in? What's the difference between a frame and a field name anyway?

Thanks.

Sort Order tags

Reply #5 –
The Foobar2000 ID3 Tag Mapping page in the wiki explains it very well. After a table of all field names that are mapped to ID3 frames it states:
Quote
All non-native supported field names will be stored in the TXXX (User defined text information) frame except for field names starting with "WWW" which will be stored in WXXX (User defined URL link frame) frames.

So field name is an arbitrary string you can choose to name your fields. Commonly used ones (ALBUM, ARTIST, TITLE, ...) are mapped to corresponding ID3 tag frame. All others are stored in the TXXX frame.

Sort Order tags

Reply #7 –
Sure, that's why
Quote from: Toxikator on
EDIT: updating foobar to the latest version has added support for ArtistSortOrder, AlbumSortOrder, and TitleSortOrder... but NOT BandSortOrder, which both iTunes and MP3tag recognize.
Full-quoting makes you scroll past the same junk over and over.

Sort Order tags

Reply #8 –
Quote from: ojdo on
So field name is an arbitrary string you can choose to name your fields. Commonly used ones (ALBUM, ARTIST, TITLE, ...) are mapped to corresponding ID3 tag frame. All others are stored in the TXXX frame.


OK thanks, so my ARTIST SORT would be in TXXX, but if I make an ARTISTSORTORDER field it will be put into TSOP? Is that the correct way to do it, is it better than just having ARTIST SORT in TXXX?

Sort Order tags

Reply #9 –
It appears that foobar2k does have mapping for ARTISTSORTORDER and other sort order tags, but it is not documented in http://wiki.hydrogenaudio.org/index.php?ti...ID3_Tag_Mapping
In fact, I couldn't seem to find it anywhere except for this thread itself!

I wish the mapping of metadata tags and ID3 frames will not only be properly documented, but customizable!

Sort Order tags

Reply #10 –
Quote from: Yaniv Kunda on
It appears that foobar2k does have mapping for ARTISTSORTORDER and other sort order tags, but it is not documented in http://wiki.hydrogenaudio.org/index.php?ti...ID3_Tag_Mapping
In fact, I couldn't seem to find it anywhere except for this thread itself!

I wish the mapping of metadata tags and ID3 frames will not only be properly documented, but customizable!


Basically,
if you write your tags in Mp3tag, which is designed as a tagging program first, and then use foobar more as a player than a tagger, you'll be fine...

(the only real problem is when foobar can't read the tags, ala TitleSortOrder, then you can bug devs on IRC until it gets fixed )

Sort Order tags

Reply #11 –
So, maybe this is a stupid question, but I've been using Mp3Tag to create some of these sort order tags, so that I can make Foobar sort by the way I want them sorted.
Based on http://wiki.hydrogenaudio.org/index.php?ti...ID3_Tag_Mapping, none of these sort order tags are supported (ALBUMSORT = TSOA, ALBUMARTISTSORT = TSO2, TITLESORT = TSOT, etc., per Mp3Tag mapping).
Is there some way to access this data anywa, so that for instance, I can say that in my album view command, $if(%albumartist%,%albumartistsort%)?
Meaning, can I access $if(%albumartist%,TSO2)? Right now foobar lets me use $if(%band%,%band%) which in its mind is TPE2 = Mp3Tag's ALBUMARTIST, but I can't find how to access any of the sort tags.
Thanks!