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Topic: output to remote sound server on LAN (Read 12722 times) previous topic - next topic
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output to remote sound server on LAN

Hi, I'd love to run foobar on my laptop, and output its sound via TCP/IP on another soundserver machine in the network.

So, the idea is to output foobar sound via LAN to a remote computer -- the sound server in my LAN with the audiophile soundcard, right by my stereo

There are several sound protocols that are "network transparent" (i.e. a music program must not run on the same machine as the soundserver), mostly for Linux:
* ESD / ESounD / Enlightened Sound Daemon
* PulseAudio / PolypAudio
* Arts / Advanced Linux Sound Architecture / now Phonon
* Jack
* Network-Integrated Multimedia Middleware (NMM)

For some of them, for sure ESD, a Windows driver is available, so that -- if foobar had a foo_out_ESD component -- music could play straight from foobar2K to the ESD sound server.

Anyone underway with the same idea?  It would be so great to play foobar on a remote sound server via LAN!

I might try to develop foo_out_SoundServer myself... IF the foo_out library was OK to use, but last time I checked, further development on foo_out was disencouraged.

What do you think: are there some remote sound solutions for foobar on Windows already underway? Is it worthwile to try develop it?

Thanks!
Ulf

output to remote sound server on LAN

Reply #1 –
If there is a Windows driver for ESD or PusleAudio, is it necessary to develop a plugin for each application? Can't foobar take the ESD driver for a real soundcard, then let ESD do the network stuff?

output to remote sound server on LAN

Reply #2 –
There is WinESD, a windows sound driver acting as an esound client. It's buggy and the development stopped several years ago.
Then there is C-Medias Wi-Sonic windows sound driver (multichannel capable), but their protocol, called 'WSAS' is proprietary, so it can't be hooked to a standard linux box.

I would love to see an esd or better, a pulseaudio output plugin for foobar2000. Winamp 3 already has an esound output plugin with free source code. So at least foo_out_esound should be fairly easy to write.

Would it be possible or is it  supported to write a pulseaudio output plugin?

output to remote sound server on LAN

Reply #3 –
Any news on this?
I've been doing intensive search for something like this for ore than a week without any encouraging luck. I'm starting to think about dropping the idea...

PS: This is the closest I got.

output to remote sound server on LAN

Reply #4 –
you could also remote control foobar on the remote server via web page:
http control

output to remote sound server on LAN

Reply #5 –
If you'd show me something made with/for that component that looks and feels like the real thing I'd use it!

output to remote sound server on LAN

Reply #6 –
Quote from: loft on
If you'd show me something made with/for that component that looks and feels like the real thing I'd use it!

In theory you should be able to come pretty damn close - But only in theory. I'm not a very good web-programmer (anymore).

getid3 is an extensive library for PHP that supports most formats and tag-types. Running a webserver, this would allow searching and eventually modifying files in the library. Together with a optimized UI for foo_http including ajax support, it would make hell of a webcontrolled interface for foobar2000.

Anyone up for it?

(Actually one might wonder why anyone in the skinning-community has not yet taken this to next level - It's far more customizable than foobar2000 itself...)
Can't wait for a HD-AAC encoder :P

output to remote sound server on LAN

Reply #7 –
I just came by this forum to check if something like that is already available!

I just set up my HTPC and connected my high quality USB-DAC to that pc. Currently I'm using HTTP-Control in foobar but a) the default interface kinda sucks and b) you can't browse the music library (only folders).

Maybe a smart programmer picks up this idea and creates a nice foobar client/server plugin! Shouldn't be too hard, I believe much more complex were made for foobar in the past (not saying it is easy though - but should be possible within a reasonable timeframe).

output to remote sound server on LAN

Reply #8 –
I've tried some different configurations using Linksys WRT54GL as the link between the two computers. I'm mentioning the router because, from what I've read, this is quite a good one. The best transfer speed I've got (different files, using Total Commander v7.04a) peaks at 1.8-2 MB/s (14-16 Mb/s).
So what I've done was feeding a local foobar (on the server) with flacs from the notebook (password protected share), and the results were not so good: every now and then there were pauses (around 1 second long) in the songs and gaps between songs could get to as high as 2-3 seconds. Just like the transfer from the notebook to the server was not so good. Setting foobar to cache 16 second of music eliminated only the in-song gaps.
This makes me wonder if the wireless networks are as good as advertised... If this happens with a router seen as above average, what should I expect from the cheapest?
Because I've just bought a new HDD for my notebook, the old one would take the responsibilities of backing up my collection and feeding a foobar on the server.
Still, I don't give up the idea I've put in this thread because I dream of a house with many sound systems (dormitory, living room, porch, kitchen) fed by the system I have close (notebook, desktop, PDA, etc).
Cheers!

PS: While I was writing I came upon another idea: 1 server, many clients, many sound systems (no. of clients = no. of sound systems). The client connects to the server, chooses a playlist, chooses a sound system and relaxes. For example I'm in the living room listening to my music (I have my PDA to control the playlist) while my wife listens to her music in the kitchen (using an embedded computer as the controller) and my mother-in-law listens to religious in the guests' bedroom with a RF remote in her hand. All the music is on the server (except for the religious songs which are on a pen drive her mother brought with her, but plugged in), every listener listens to whatever he/she wants, no interaction between them. Each sound system is connected wirelessly. Enough of dreaming!

output to remote sound server on LAN

Reply #9 –
Quote from: tst on
Maybe a smart programmer picks up this idea and creates a nice foobar client/server plugin!

Maybe foo_upnp suits you better? Otherwise take a look at the foo_httpcontrol thread. Recently a webdev published a very nice layout that he promised he would release the files for sometime. However, don't expect to be able to browse the library this way I think...
Quote from: tst on
Shouldn't be too hard, I believe much more complex were made for foobar in the past (not saying it is easy though - but should be possible within a reasonable timeframe).

Well, unless you're that programmer that can easily create such thing, don't speak on behalf of others if you don't have a clue about what you are talking about!
Quote from: loft on
every now and then there were pauses (around 1 second long) in the songs and gaps between songs could get to as high as 2-3 seconds.

I have the same problem with my gigabit (!!!) connection between my Windows HTPC (sharing drives) and workstation.
Can't wait for a HD-AAC encoder :P

output to remote sound server on LAN

Reply #10 –
Quote from: odyssey on
Maybe foo_upnp suits you better?

Great, will check it - thanks. Sounds like that is what I actually want.

Quote
Otherwise take a look at the foo_httpcontrol thread. Recently a webdev published a very nice layout that he promised he would release the files for sometime. However, don't expect to be able to browse the library this way I think...

Yeah, noticed that and as this is the best solution so far, I'm really looking forward to this! Sure it can't browse the library as no such interface exists.

Quote
Well, unless you're that programmer that can easily create such thing, don't speak on behalf of others if you don't have a clue about what you are talking about!

I'm a fulltime professional programmer, I do know what I'm talking about. If I had the time right now, I would try to implement it, but I just can't.

Quote
Quote from: loft on
every now and then there were pauses (around 1 second long) in the songs and gaps between songs could get to as high as 2-3 seconds.

I have the same problem with my gigabit (!!!) connection between my Windows HTPC (sharing drives) and workstation.

I never had those problems. I used a Win2k3 for several years for my music library (until last week when I finished the HTPC). Right now I'm only connected with 100mbit and it works flawlessly using standard windows shares on the HTPC (and I'm playing FLACs most of the time).

output to remote sound server on LAN

Reply #11 –
Quote from: :ub: on
Hi, I'd love to run foobar on my laptop, and output its sound via TCP/IP on another soundserver machine in the network.

Hi,
Airfoil can output the sound from foobar2000 to an airport express, a computer running windows or mac os, an ipod touch or an iphone.

output to remote sound server on LAN

Reply #12 –
It works exactly as I wanted! ...except for the 2 seconds delay and occasionally drops, maybe caused by the wireless network - yet to be tested.
Thanks!

output to remote sound server on LAN

Reply #13 –
Quote from: loft on
It works exactly as I wanted! ...except for the 2 seconds delay and occasionally drops, maybe caused by the wireless network - yet to be tested.
Thanks!


And now it works worse. 

Quote
Hi Tom,

I'm Lee, one of the engineers working on Airfoil for Windows.

Unfortunately this problem is caused by how Foobar handles stopping. It appears to leave the last bit of audio in the sound buffer rather than clearing it out. This causes the loop that your hearing.

You can see other cases of this in situations unrelated to Airfoil:

http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/lofive...php/t71771.html
http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/lofive...php/t76586.html
http://forums.anandtech.com/archive/index.php/t-39673.html
http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/lofive...php/t66424.html

Other audio players such as winamp and iTunes should work fine however.

Hope that helps!

--
Lee Falin
Rogue Amoeba Software, LLC



-----Original Message-----
From: tom
Date: Tue, 3 May 2011 09:55:49 -0400
To: airfoilwindows@rogueamoeba.com
Subject: RE: (Case RA-36181) Stuttering loop

>Well, at the very least I got to pay $10 to be a beta site! 
>
>Running the old version of everything now.
>
>> Date: Sat, 23 Apr 2011 14:12:47 -0400
>> From: airfoilwindows@rogueamoeba.com
>> To: tom
>> Subject: Re: (Case RA-36181) Stuttering loop
>>
>> Hi Tom,
>>
>> Thank you for providing that information. At this point, I'm going to have to pass along your issue to our engineering team.
>>
>> They may take a few days to analyze it and get to work with you, so keep a lookout for email from us - we will follow up with you as soon as we can.
>>
>> --
>> Chris Barajas
>> Rogue Amoeba Software, LLC
>>
>>
>>
>>

output to remote sound server on LAN

Reply #14 –
So wait, their hardware requires you to clear a DirectSound buffer out before stopping it, or else the device will loop the last contents of the buffer forever? That's brilliant!

output to remote sound server on LAN

Reply #15 –
Airfoil is a program that's used with an Apple AirPort Express.

Officially only iTunes is able to stream sound to an AirPort Express.
Windows 10 Pro x64 // foobar2000 1.3.10