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Topic: Burning vs. Drag and Dropping? (Read 12472 times) previous topic - next topic
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Burning vs. Drag and Dropping?

What's the difference between the two in storing back up data, other then the fact that one over the other forces you to electronically remove information rather then just doing so manually?  Or, when you're just making a transfer from one computer to another, is it really necessary?  Are you gaining anything in taking the extra step? 

Also, when you burn the audio to be played back on a CD player, the burn process re-encrypts each song individually as if it were a store bought CD to begin with, right? 

Thanx.

Burning vs. Drag and Dropping?

Reply #1 –
Excuse me Aaron5604, but I don't understand what you mean by the title of this topic. As I know burning is the operation by which you put some date on an optical media and drag&drop is a easy way tu manipulate files on a visual (not command line) operating system. They are quite different concepts.

Do you mean burning audio CDs versus data CDs (Red Book versus Yellow book) for storing purposes? In this case I would recommend you the second option (data CDs/DVDs) as it implies a better error correcting system.

You're welcome!

Burning vs. Drag and Dropping?

Reply #2 –
Quote from: loft on
Excuse me Aaron5604, but I don't understand what you mean by the title of this topic. As I know burning is the operation by which you put some date on an optical media and drag&drop is a easy way tu manipulate files on a visual (not command line) operating system. They are quite different concepts.

Do you mean burning audio CDs versus data CDs (Red Book versus Yellow book) for storing purposes? In this case I would recommend you the second option (data CDs/DVDs) as it implies a better error correcting system.

You're welcome!


CD+R's for example.  In the past, I have just cut and pasted all kinds of files into the CD/DVD drive rather then using a program to burn the data into the disc, whether that's; audio, pictures, videos, or small games.  Later, I would just simply access the drive once more and pull/delete what I chose straight off the disc -  using it all over again as if the CD+R was never used in the first place, regardless to what I added.  When I burned anything onto a CD+R though, all that information was forever on it.  There was no deleting, moving around files, or re-transferring them back onto the pc.  You wrote it on the disc once, and that was it, as it should be since they aren't +RW's. 

Basically, I just am trying to ask if that's really necessary in forever embedding data into the disc, when all I have to do is just drag and drop like an old a:/ floppy in the past.  For storage purposes, if I can re-use, delete files individually, and transfer them back and forth as needed when I choose when using a CD+R, why use a separate program to burn anything permenantly?  What advantages (if any) does one have over the other in method? 

Thanx!

Burning vs. Drag and Dropping?

Reply #3 –
Quote from: Aaron5604 on
CD+R's for example.  In the past, I have just cut and pasted all kinds of files into the CD/DVD drive rather then using a program to burn the data into the disc, whether that's; audio, pictures, videos, or small games.  Later, I would just simply access the drive once more and pull/delete what I chose straight off the disc -  using it all over again as if the CD+R was never used in the first place, regardless to what I added.  When I burned anything onto a CD+R though, all that information was forever on it.  There was no deleting, moving around files, or re-transferring them back onto the pc.  You wrote it on the disc once, and that was it, as it should be since they aren't +RW's. 

Basically, I just am trying to ask if that's really necessary in forever embedding data into the disc, when all I have to do is just drag and drop like an old a:/ floppy in the past.  For storage purposes, if I can re-use, delete files individually, and transfer them back and forth as needed when I choose when using a CD+R, why use a separate program to burn anything permenantly?  What advantages (if any) does one have over the other in method? 

Thanx!


1. What OS do you have? WinXP? It has built-in burner.
2. You cannot delete anything from CD/DVD-R. You can only hide some files.
Basically, built-in burner does the same things as any third-pary software.

Burning vs. Drag and Dropping?

Reply #4 –
Quote from: lvqcl on
Quote from: Aaron5604 on

CD+R's for example.  In the past, I have just cut and pasted all kinds of files into the CD/DVD drive rather then using a program to burn the data into the disc, whether that's; audio, pictures, videos, or small games.  Later, I would just simply access the drive once more and pull/delete what I chose straight off the disc -  using it all over again as if the CD+R was never used in the first place, regardless to what I added.  When I burned anything onto a CD+R though, all that information was forever on it.  There was no deleting, moving around files, or re-transferring them back onto the pc.  You wrote it on the disc once, and that was it, as it should be since they aren't +RW's. 

Basically, I just am trying to ask if that's really necessary in forever embedding data into the disc, when all I have to do is just drag and drop like an old a:/ floppy in the past.  For storage purposes, if I can re-use, delete files individually, and transfer them back and forth as needed when I choose when using a CD+R, why use a separate program to burn anything permenantly?  What advantages (if any) does one have over the other in method? 

Thanx!


1. What OS do you have? WinXP? It has built-in burner.
2. You cannot delete anything from CD/DVD-R. You can only hide some files.
Basically, built-in burner does the same things as any third-pary software.


1.  No, I have Vista Premium. 
2.  When I burn stuff through, say WMP, it's 100% permenant.  I would have to literally destroy the disk if I were to get rid of what was on it.  When I am just dragging/pasting straight to the drive w/ out any additional program, the file then becomes very flexible.  Meaning; when I decide to delete/exchange all the files afterwards in bulk, or just one at a time, it allows me too as if I were making a change on the pc itself. I doubled checked the disc, the amount of storage space, and then used it on a completely different computer to see in whether I'm actually involving the CD+R - the disc shows no evidence in having anything on it at all, as if it were just a fresh/newly packaged disc from the start.  Having said that though, what exactly are you referring to when saying you can only "hide" some files?  Is that like saying digital foot prints are still leaving their remains after the vast majority of the file has been erased or moved elsewhere? 

I'm just confused, because there has to be a catch?  CD/DVD+R's are exactly as you say - ONE time discs when sent through the whole burn process.  I understand for CD-A playback, because that's the only way to re-encrypt redbook standard and create .cda short cuts.  For storage/back up purposes however, I fail to the see the whole point when I can go an alternative route which seems to be much quicker and just as effective. 

Thanx!

Burning vs. Drag and Dropping?

Reply #5 –
I'm really lost as to what you're trying to say, if you're talking about the inbuilt Windows burner; when you copy files to the CD, they aren't put onto the CD til you "write" them to the CD.

If you were to write them to the CD then the files will stay on the CD-R til the CD-R is destroyed, you can't rewrite on a CD-R.

Burning vs. Drag and Dropping?

Reply #6 –
1) You are actually using a CD-RW.
2) Nothing has been written to the disc in reality. All files still reside on HDD waiting for a "write" command to be invoked.

I've never used Windows built-in software myself though. It seems to go strange routes to acomplish the most simple things.

If you have a read only disc you can't possibly selectively erase parts of it. Some software products offer the possibility to write a new file system without references to logical blocks where the old 'deleted' files are stored. When this modified disk is inserted in a computer only the last file system is read and it would appear that some files are gone. In fact you can use special software (like IsoBuster) to access any existing session on that disc. Not only creating another section does not reclaim disk space, a big amount of space is wasted for the new file system itself and the pause between two tracks containing previous and current session.

Burning vs. Drag and Dropping?

Reply #7 –
Quote from: j7n on
2) Nothing has been written to the disc in reality. All files still reside on HDD waiting for a "write" command to be invoked.


I think that's what really happened with Aaron5604. 

Burning vs. Drag and Dropping?

Reply #8 –
Quote from: lvqcl on
Quote from: j7n on

2) Nothing has been written to the disc in reality. All files still reside on HDD waiting for a "write" command to be invoked.


I think that's what really happened with Aaron5604. 


I too agree.  In Windows Vista, you must complete the burn command.  You can drag-and-drop files all you want and even delete files until you finalize the burning process.  Once you do that, Windows Vista will then actually burn the files to the CD-R (remember, there is no such thing as a CD+R), DVD+R, or DVD-R disc.  Once the files are actually burned onto -/+R media, that is it.  The R stands for writable (in a way), -/+RW discs are a different in that you can burn and delete data.

So Aaron5604 isn't finalizing the whole process.  That means that they aren't really backing anything up.  I believe Windows XP has sort of the same feature in that you must actually click the burn option near the top left of the window.  So, in Aaron5604's case, there is a huge difference between burning with a 3rd party program or burning (drag-and-drop in their words) with Windows in that the 3rd party program is actually backing up the data onto an optical format while Windows isn't.  I hope they didn't delete any files off of their computer that they thought were backed up.

Burning vs. Drag and Dropping?

Reply #9 –
I didn't read about the option to use packet writing in this thread. For me packet writing software in combination with DVD-RAM media has proved to be a very convenient reliable backup method.

Burning vs. Drag and Dropping?

Reply #10 –
Let me see if I can simplify this better.  I thought I was being precise in explanation, but apparently not.  And for that, I appologize to those trying to assist me here. 

For example:

Last week or so, I had 10 or 12 files in which I thought might be worth keeping for a while.  Some were songs, short clips, (.avi's, .mp4's) and a few random pictures (.jpg's, .bmp's, etc...) however nothing critical.  Anyways, I took those files and just (Cnt. + X'd, then Cnt. + V'd them all into my E:/ drive (CD\DVD) w/ a CD-R loaded.  They ALL went w/ no problem and transferred from my C:/ over.  From there, I could do as I pleased - delete, play/run, transfer, etc... as if it were burnt directly from a supporting program. 

Now, if none of these were TRUELY on disc, then wouldn't it of been impossible to have played these files back on outside equipment - cars and other computers in which had no affiliation w/ any of the files to begin with?

Burning vs. Drag and Dropping?

Reply #11 –
I can't see the CDs you are describing and don't know if they're written to or not. But I'll try to answer your original question: Is it better to use a burning software or use Windows built-in functions. Rewritable optical discs were not designed for random access, you can't really erase single sectors easily. Proper CD/DVD authoring, such as Nero 5 or 6 gives you control over the process. You gather files to be burnt and start the process exactly when you are ready. If burning was to start as soon as you pasted a selection of files to drive E:, you would not have the opportunity to assemble the compilation from multiple sources.

Concerning WinXP IMAPI recording engine, I have heard that during assembly of the compilation all files are physically copied deep inside the system directory. This copying is redundant in my opinion and would crash the whole process if not enough space was available on system disk.

Burning vs. Drag and Dropping?

Reply #12 –
Even so your original question doesn't make sense, whether you use a 3rd party program or the Windows interface, you're still "burning" the data to disc.

Burning vs. Drag and Dropping?

Reply #13 –
Quote from: Aaron5604 on
Last week or so, I had 10 or 12 files in which I thought might be worth keeping for a while.  Some were songs, short clips, (.avi's, .mp4's) and a few random pictures (.jpg's, .bmp's, etc...) however nothing critical.  Anyways, I took those files and just (Cnt. + X'd, then Cnt. + V'd them all into my E:/ drive (CD\DVD) w/ a CD-R loaded.  They ALL went w/ no problem and transferred from my C:/ over.  From there, I could do as I pleased - delete, play/run, transfer, etc... as if it were burnt directly from a supporting program.


I am sorry but that is impossible.  A file burned to a CD-R disc is there forever unless you physically damage the disc.  There are no if's, and's, or but's about it.  You simply cannot delete data that has been burned to a CD-R, DVD-R, DVD+R, or DVD+R DL disc.  That is not how those discs work.  With R discs, the data is burned onto them once and it can only be read.  You can use whatever you want to read the data but that is it.  There is no deleting of the files.  So either you are using RW discs or you have found some loophole in the computer universe that specifically allows your computer (and your computer alone) to delete files off of R discs.  If the later is the case then I really must see this computer in person as it is the first ever in all the world.  Hell, it could probably even delete tracks off of audio CDs or delete files off of studio produced DVDs.  I don't mean to sound sarcastic but I hope you understand the impossibility of what you are saying.

Burning vs. Drag and Dropping?

Reply #14 –
Quote from: j7n on
I can't see the CDs you are describing and don't know if they're written to or not. But I'll try to answer your original question: Is it better to use a burning software or use Windows built-in functions. Rewritable optical discs were not designed for random access, you can't really erase single sectors easily. Proper CD/DVD authoring, such as Nero 5 or 6 gives you control over the process. You gather files to be burnt and start the process exactly when you are ready. If burning was to start as soon as you pasted a selection of files to drive E:, you would not have the opportunity to assemble the compilation from multiple sources.

Concerning WinXP IMAPI recording engine, I have heard that during assembly of the compilation all files are physically copied deep inside the system directory. This copying is redundant in my opinion and would crash the whole process if not enough space was available on system disk.


Verbatim CD-R's are what I'm using, as clearly advertised on the front. 

I Just don't understand, because if what you're saying is true, as we're on the same page here in just strictly working information into the E:/ drive itself, then why are what I put in, running elsewhere just fine?

*edit*

My ACTUAL drive has RW capabilities, does that factor in any way?

Burning vs. Drag and Dropping?

Reply #15 –
In reply to your edit, only if the discs you are using are CD-RW discs. CD-R discs are one-shot and cannot be re-written to over the same physical area of the disc under any circumstances. It's a physical impossibility.

Cheers, Slipstreem. 

Burning vs. Drag and Dropping?

Reply #16 –
Ok, I think I see what's going on...

At first glance the file appears to be deleted, but according to the capacity chart through properties, the bit of memory still shows as clearly missing, and that by dragging files into the drive was still the same burn process as you guys stated.  I must of just over looked that some how.  But, if I didn't truely delete the file, why can I no longer access it, nor see it at first glance?  What did I do, just delete the short cut to the file?  And, if it's still there, how do you properly restore it to where I can use it once more?

Burning vs. Drag and Dropping?

Reply #17 –
You could simplify it that way, I suppose. I explained it to you in my post above. To really see all data on the disc a special software product is necessary. I am using and recommend IsoBuster (paid software, v1.9).

Burning vs. Drag and Dropping?

Reply #18 –
Quote from: j7n on
You could simplify it that way, I suppose. I explained it to you in my post above. To really see all data on the disc a special software product is necessary. I am using and recommend IsoBuster (paid software, v1.9).


You did, but I needed someone to first identify for me w/ what I was doing exactly before I could understand anything else.  Files were still being burnt (which some have said) but some were saying the whole drag and drop/cut and paste thing wouldn't of been feasible in even making them work else where, which is at first what hung me up.  They went in just fine, they worked, and when you highlighted the folder/text to delete, it would show up as being removed.  I just didn't realize that was the the byte sized short cut and not the actual meat of the file, very similar to .cda's. 

So, the way I've understood it now, is that the whole burnt process is really the same idea in how music industries make CD-A's.  Only, they don't burn, they stamp it into, and the dye is for the burning process in controlling the amount of heat.  But, this here is more or less just getting a little off topic. 

My appologies for if anyone found my posts argumentative, (for they weren't meant to be) I just like to understand things as exact as possible.

Burning vs. Drag and Dropping?

Reply #19 –
The dilemma is that most of us here have likely cut our teeth on burning prior to the existence of Windows XP and its built-in burning capabilities.  We used (and still use) various 3rd party CD authoring programs.  The older and more technical of which required that we understand burning at a lower level, including things like layout types, data modes, sessions and file systems; things to which people only familiar with Microsoft's built-in burning have not been exposed.

Burning vs. Drag and Dropping?

Reply #20 –
Quote from: Aaron5604 on
Ok, I think I see what's going on...

At first glance the file appears to be deleted, but according to the capacity chart through properties, the bit of memory still shows as clearly missing, and that by dragging files into the drive was still the same burn process as you guys stated.  I must of just over looked that some how.  But, if I didn't truely delete the file, why can I no longer access it, nor see it at first glance?  What did I do, just delete the short cut to the file?  And, if it's still there, how do you properly restore it to where I can use it once more?


I also used drag and drop with (Veritas) DLA in Win XP. I can "delete" the files, but they are just merely hidden as what is said above, you won't be able to see the files anymore in Windows Explorer. If you look at the bottom of the CD, you'll see that the inner parts would still be a different colour to the outside parts, meaning data is still present.

Burning vs. Drag and Dropping?

Reply #21 –
...and they are still accessible with any program capable of looking at a previous session.

Of course there's always this...
http://www.plextor.be/products/PlexEraser....oice=PlexEraser

Burning vs. Drag and Dropping?

Reply #22 –
Is there much of a reason anymore though to use CD's for back up purposes?  Wouldn't a portable HD of some kind be better - more durable as a whole, more storage capacity, and longer lasting?  I'm actually just thinking of doing that instead, find one that uses a USB to connect.  I mean, just about every comp. within the last 10 years or so is compatible, right?

Burning vs. Drag and Dropping?

Reply #23 –
I'm not sure how "more durable" applies. And there have been concerns that HDDs can't be stored for years unused.

For backup purposes CDs are now obsoleted by DVD.

Burning vs. Drag and Dropping?

Reply #24 –
Quote from: j7n on
I'm not sure how "more durable" applies. And there have been concerns that HDDs can't be stored for years unused.

For backup purposes CDs are now obsoleted by DVD.


So, over time it's quite possible for an external HDD of some kind to just go bad, when all it's mostly done is just sit there and collect dust, more so than a DVD?