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Topic: Do iPods now *require* iTunes? (Read 6804 times) previous topic - next topic
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Do iPods now *require* iTunes?

I've done some searching on the board, but can't find what I'm after.

I'm sure I remember hearing that recent iPods require you to use iTunes - something about a special tag that the player looks for and other applications cannot replicate.

Can anyone confirm or deny this please?
I'm on a horse.

Do iPods now *require* iTunes?

Reply #1 –
You don't need iTunes unless you want or need to upgrade the firmware.
Many software have updated their code to get compatibility working again with the 2007-GEN iPod. Winamp, foobar2000, MediaMonkey, etc... I believe that Linux users can use as well new iPods.

I don't use iTunes even for my iPod. Unfortunately alternative iPod softwares don't manage some feature as well as iTunes (examples: Nero AAC encodings aren't gapless with foobar2000+foo_dop; other app don't handle album art, etc...). That may be a problem.
Wavpack Hybrid -c4hx6

Do iPods now *require* iTunes?

Reply #2 –
libgpod supports iPod Classic (6G) and the Video Nano as of version 0.6.0, and I have been using my iPod Nano 3G successfully using GTKpod and amaroK (which both uses libgpod).
It requires an extra (one-time) configuration however. See the README.SysInfo file for more information.

I haven't tried this in Windows, however, not sure how well it works there.
iPod nano 8GB (3G) | Nero q0.45
ZEN Stone | LAME -V 2 --vbr-new

Do iPods now *require* iTunes?

Reply #4 –
Many thanks for the responses so far.

Quote from: guruboolez on
You don't need iTunes unless you want or need to upgrade the firmware.
I presume a normal user would not need to upgrade the firmware?  I suppose it would be nice to know you could if the loaded firmware was bugged; however in such a situation I wouldn't feel too agrieved installing iTunes.

Quote from: guruboolez on
Many  software have updated their code to get compatibility working again  with the 2007-GEN iPod. Winamp, foobar2000, MediaMonkey, etc... I  believe that Linux users can use as well new iPods.
Do I take it then that there was a problem?  Did Apple introduce this tag that other players needed to decrypt?  I guess I'm after the background story.

Quote from: Eli on
I think the iPod touch is still locked to iTunes, though I may be wrong.
Hmm, a spanner in the works.  Can anyone confirm or deny?
I'm on a horse.

Do iPods now *require* iTunes?

Reply #5 –
Quote from: Synthetic Soul on
I presume a normal user would not need to upgrade the firmware?  I suppose it would be nice to know you could if the loaded firmware was bugged; however in such a situation I wouldn't feel too agrieved installing iTunes.

I don't think so! The last firmware updates (iPod Classic) were important - also for the normal user - because it had a major bug which caused battery drain since the harddisk didn't turned off correctly. But bugs like this are really rare and I didn't have such problems with any of my ipods (4G, 5G, 6G). But also the performance of the menu was really slow before the last two updates - before it was really annoying. So personally I think that firmware should always be applied to ipods. And Apple probably thinks the same as iTunes for example reminds the users automatically when a new firmware is avaliable.

Quote
Do I take it then that there was a problem?  Did Apple introduce this tag that other players needed to decrypt?  I guess I'm after the background story.

Yes, Apple introduced a a checksum-protection for the database so that other programs than iTunes could sync but the data was not visible on the ipod. I don't remember where the story was published but I'm sure you find something in google. Fortunately this protection has been reverse-engineered after about 1-2 weeks so now all known programs like Winamp, MediaMonkey support the new generations.

Quote
Quote from: Eli on
I think the iPod touch is still locked to iTunes, though I may be wrong.
Hmm, a spanner in the works.  Can anyone confirm or deny?

That's not completely true since the new iPhone-firmware (or the upcoming?) allows to connect to your iPhone on your pc like a normal USB-Drive. Before you dion't have access to the drive itself. As far as I read with Winamp there's now some way to get the songs to the iPhone but it's not official and completely easy to do yet.
One of the MediaMonkey-devs also gave a hint that they're working on iPhone-support.
We have to wait!

Do iPods now *require* iTunes?

Reply #7 –
No problem!

And here some additional informations about iPhone-support in ml_ipod (alternative ipod-plugin for winamp) and also the 'problem' in general.

Big_Berny

Do iPods now *require* iTunes?

Reply #8 –
Quote from: Big_Berny on
Quote from: Synthetic Soul on
I presume a normal user would not need to upgrade the firmware?  I suppose it would be nice to know you could if the loaded firmware was bugged; however in such a situation I wouldn't feel too agrieved installing iTunes.

I don't think so! The last firmware updates (iPod Classic) were important - also for the normal user - because it had a major bug which caused battery drain since the harddisk didn't turned off correctly. But bugs like this are really rare and I didn't have such problems with any of my ipods (4G, 5G, 6G). But also the performance of the menu was really slow before the last two updates - before it was really annoying. So personally I think that firmware should always be applied to ipods. And Apple probably thinks the same as iTunes for example reminds the users automatically when a new firmware is avaliable.



Especially with the new iPods, FW updates are absolutely necessary.  Last year, I bought the 80GB 5.5G (for me) and the 2G 8GB Nano (for the wife).  Among the issues that have been fixed through 3 or 4 software updates since 10/06 are gapless issues, lockup issues, and on-the-go-playlist issues.  All of these are issues that I experienced that ranged from annoying to features that just plain didn't work. 

Though old iPods benefit from updates too.  Remember when gapless playback was added in 10/06, it was brought into the older lines as well via a firmware update (and iTunes).

Anyway, over a year later, these have stabilized.  I'm sure it will be the same with the 6G Classic and the 3G nanos.  Just the nature of the beast.

So, at least at first, I think you will want the ability to upgrade FW on the iPod.

Do iPods now *require* iTunes?

Reply #9 –
I use floola, gtkpod and rhythmbox on my 2nd gen nano without any problems. fw revision 1.1.3
You might like floola as it's cross-platform, requires no installation and works. It's also free

Do iPods now *require* iTunes?

Reply #10 –
Whatever happened to Red Chair? They've yet to support the iPod Classic, which has been out for months. They do not answer support emails, although the site is still up and I bet they'll still take money from anyone dumb enough to buy their obsolete software. Anyone know what the deal is with them?

I don't buy overpriced 128Kbps DRM trash from anyone, ever, and I never will. None of my MP3s are crippled with DRM. They're just plain MP3s, the way they were intended to be.

I'm uncertain what player to get, especially as the software can be so horrible. I don't want Apple or anyone else monitoring what I listen to, what I have on my hard drive, how many CDs I burn, etc.

While I like how the iPod Classic works, I can't stand the software. It's worse for the Shuffle, with its automatic syncing. I don't want playlists shoved down my throat. I don't want syncing shoved down my throat. And if I I were to buy music from Apple, things would get even more intrusive. The last thing I would ever put up with is some company having remote access to and control over my music.

I like the simplicity of drag-n-drop. Playlists would be nice, so long as I have control over how they interact with the hardware. Other than that, I don't care about videos, photos, podcasts, wireless anything, or buying DRM-crippled media.

I thought the Zune would be a good alternative to the iPod, but it seems unable to work with Windows any better than the iPod, and the software is wildly unstable.

If there was a good way to manage the various iPods without Apple software, I'd go buy the biggest one I could get right now. I have no idea how well WinAmp really works with iPods. I'll look at floola and gtkpod, but I'm not getting my hopes up.

Do iPods now *require* iTunes?

Reply #11 –
Winamp and the new MediaMonkey 3.0 work great with the new ipods...