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Topic: Advice on Bookshelf Speakers and an Amplifier (Read 4232 times) previous topic - next topic
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Advice on Bookshelf Speakers and an Amplifier

I am looking to buy some bookshelf speakers and an amplifier for hookup to a computer. I had done some searching on this forum and apparently the Infinity Primus 150's were good for their money, and Boston Acoustic (which, I admit I had not heard of previously) are also good (I am thinking something along the lines of CR67) . Are these conclusions valid? Unfortunately I don't readily have access to every speaker on the planet for listening tests, so I am attempting to do as much research as possible.

The other consideration is amplifiers, I was at Future Shop today looking at them, and it seems I am looking to spend around $300 CND for a decent one. Is the brand of amplifier a big consideration? Or for the speakers I am looking at, should I just pick one that has the neccesary inputs/outputs. I was looking at a Yamaha HTR5830S earlier today which seemed to satisfy my requirements and then some (I really don't need the video features at the moment, but eventually I may want them)

What I am looking for is a speaker/amlifier combination which will hook up to my computer (I have an Audigy 2 running on Debian Linux) and provide me with decent sound quality. Another factor is that I have a pair of Sennheiser HD500's that I listen to everything with, any amp which I choose would have to have a plugin for my headphones. My current sound card is not enough to drive them to any appreciable volume when I plug them directly into the sound card. If I plug them into my stereo system the stereo applies its filters and the music comes out heavily bassy and quieter than if I plug it into the sound card.

What I currently have for a stereo system is a panasonic all in one deal (tape deck, cd player and radio) which I am pretty sure is marketed to 13 year olds who feel that more bass is better. The speakers aren't bad and I may sell everything or use the speakers as rear speakers.

Anyways, can anyone give me some advice on this? Thanks

Advice on Bookshelf Speakers and an Amplifier

Reply #1 –
Most amp/receiver combos will sound the same.  There is not a lot of magic left in circuit design for audio applications.  Speakers still have a lot of black magic involved.  You ears are the final arbiter.  I am always  impressed by the Candian Paradigms.  They make sweet bookshelf speakers, too.  Give 'em a listen.  Our neighbo(u)rs to the north have something with these guys; for sure, eh.   
Nov schmoz kapop.

Advice on Bookshelf Speakers and an Amplifier

Reply #2 –
How 'bout some powered near fields (e.g.: Mackie 824's - $700 U.S. from B&H or 624's or shop around for some that won't mess with your monitor if it's a CRT) and a headphone amp from headroom? It is possible that the headphone output of an amp is gonna have problems with your headphones, too.

Note: I know the Mackie's may be out of your budget (~ US$900 for pair of 624's), but there are other nice powered speakers...

I'm not that picky about my peecee speakers since I listen to music elsewhere - I only use 'em so I can hear the screams in Quake.

Mark

Advice on Bookshelf Speakers and an Amplifier

Reply #3 –
I bought these bookshelf speakers about a year ago based on a recommendation here at HA, and I've been very happy with them.

Advice on Bookshelf Speakers and an Amplifier

Reply #4 –
I can recommend you Dali Concept 2 speakers, I have them, they are excellent.

And for the amplifiers, you may look at NAD and Rotel brands.

Advice on Bookshelf Speakers and an Amplifier

Reply #5 –
Thank you for all the advice, I really appreciate it.

In the end I think I am going to go for the Ascend Acoustics CBM170's it seems that they are excellent speakers with a great warrenty and excellent customer service.

Now to just pick out a amplifier ....

Advice on Bookshelf Speakers and an Amplifier

Reply #6 –
Quote
Thank you for all the advice, I really appreciate it.

In the end I think I am going to go for the Ascend Acoustics CBM170's it seems that they are excellent speakers with a great warrenty and excellent customer service.

Now to just pick out a amplifier ....
[a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=315951"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]


I second the CMB170, if it's used in a near or mid-field capacity, and within it's optimum bandwidth[>80Hz]. It's 3rd party measurements demonstrate a very smooth response up to +/- 30 degrees off axis. If you intend on using the speakers farfield, however, the Primus 150 is a better candidate, as it has superior off axis response, extending smoothly at even +/- 60 degrees off axis. However, the Primus 150 seems to have a slighty audible cabinet resonance, which if the highest quality reproduction is desired, should be corrected[this is easily done by removing the midranges and applying enough layers of roof patch peel-n-stick to reach about 1/3"-1/2" inside the cabinet walls]. The Primus 150 also has a less effective low frequency response[5.25" vs. 6.5" woofer] as compared to the Ascend Acoustics speaker. However, the Primus 150 is also much cheaper.

-Chris

Advice on Bookshelf Speakers and an Amplifier

Reply #7 –
Quote
Speakers still have a lot of black magic involved.


Sean Olive, Floyd Toole, and other scientists/researchers associated with the field of loudspeaker acoustics have demonstrated, in controlled experiments, that designing a hi-fidelity loudspeaker is a matter of quantifiable/measurable parameters.  What you mean by "black magic"?

-Chris

Advice on Bookshelf Speakers and an Amplifier

Reply #8 –
If there were a simple engineering solution they would all sound pretty much alike, wouldn't they?  Just like cheap cars all pretty much look alike: there is a known formula which will yield the same thing every time for the same parameters.  Just like two plus two is always four.

There is still enough voodoo in designing speakers they there are differences in performance, sensitivity, dispersion, etc.  When it is a pure science one speaker in one enclosure with one crossover attached to a tweeter will sum the possibilities.

But, we have sealed box, bass reflex, ducted port, folded horn, infinite baffle, air suspension and so on.  The there are the electrostatics, field effect, ion drivers, magnaplanar and so on.

No, I do not yet believe it to be a science.   
Nov schmoz kapop.

Advice on Bookshelf Speakers and an Amplifier

Reply #9 –
Quote
If there were a simple engineering solution they would all sound pretty much alike, wouldn't they? 


This statement is confusing. How or why would they all be alike, since in any case, different engineering compromises would be chosen to fit a speaker to specific application(s) and/or budget(s)?

Quote
Just like cheap cars all pretty much look alike: there is a known formula which will yield the same thing every time for the same parameters.  Just like two plus two is always four.


Well, a high-quality loudspeaker[according to known important parameters] will almost always be judged as a high-quality loudspeaker[if the listener does not have hearing defects, which tend to make their judgements unreliable and inconsistant] in blinded [1]tests. The speakers judged to be high quality in such tests have remarkable similar response measurements.

Quote
There is still enough voodoo in designing speakers they there are differences in performance, sensitivity, dispersion, etc.  When it is a pure science one speaker in one enclosure with one crossover attached to a tweeter will sum the possibilities.

But, we have sealed box, bass reflex, ducted port, folded horn, infinite baffle, air suspension and so on.  The there are the electrostatics, field effect, ion drivers, magnaplanar and so on.


What "voodoo"? Every item you list is merely a different way to achieve a result. Nothing unquantifiable or mysterious about the differences between an ESL vs. dynamic driver, or bass reflex vs. air suspension, for examples. The technical/performance differences are well understood and quantifiable. The only 'voodoo' here, is not voodoo[which IMO infers some unquantifiable technical parameter], but a lack of standards to record, mix, master or play back recordings so that the process can be accurate. The voodoo is more accurately, the experimentation by designer or user achieve a specific effect for playback purpose.

You might find this summary paper by Dr. Floyd Toole[one of the most significant scientists/researchers in the feild of loudspeaker reproduction] on the state of the technology to be interesting:

http://www.harman.com/wp/pdf/AudioScience.pdf

-Chris

[1] Loudspeaker Measurements and Their Relationship to Listener Preferences: Part 2
Floyd E. Toole
JAES, May, 1986, Vol. 34, pages 227-235

Advice on Bookshelf Speakers and an Amplifier

Reply #10 –
Quote
The only 'voodoo' here, is not voodoo[which IMO infers some unquantifiable technical parameter], but a lack of standards to record, mix, master or play back recordings so that the process can be accurate. The voodoo is more accurately, the experimentation by designer or user achieve a specific effect for playback purpose.

I sort of agree, and I'll go you one further - since artists can (even though most probably do not choose to exercise this) have some input into the recording, mixing, and mastering process, and since we only have control over the playback process, that's where any voodoo occurs. I.e.: the first three are part and parcel of the performance itself, IMHO.

OTOH, until we really quantify some of this stuff and actually make standards to which all adhere, it does remain somewhat voodooish and we're left with trying out systems (mostly speakers) until we find some we like, and most folks have a hard time putting a finger on what it is they like about something. Add snake oil salesmen into the mix at every stage (manufacturing, distribution, sales), and it sure seems tempting to consult a palm reader to help one decide...

Mark

Advice on Bookshelf Speakers and an Amplifier

Reply #11 –
Quote
I second the CMB170, if it's used in a near or mid-field capacity, and within it's optimum bandwidth[>80Hz]. It's 3rd party measurements demonstrate a very smooth response up to +/- 30 degrees off axis. If you intend on using the speakers farfield, however, the Primus 150 is a better candidate, as it has superior off axis response, extending smoothly at even +/- 60 degrees off axis.


This works out well since I am going to be using them in a medium-small room (my bedroom) and will be sitting more or less right in front of them the entire time.