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Topic: Avoid Audigy's internal resample (Read 7121 times) previous topic - next topic
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Avoid Audigy's internal resample

I need some advices before buying a new soundcard. I have a Creative Inspire T7700 7.1 speaker system, and i want a soundcard that supports all these channels.
The Soundblaster Audigy 2 ZS seems to be the adequate soundcard: The integration with my speaker system might be better than other brand soundcards (since my speaker system is also from Creative), and it is compliant with almost every audio technology standards that exist (DirectSound, DirectSound3D, EAX 2.0, EAX 1.0, EAX 3.0, Dolby Digital 5.1, Digital Theater Systems (DTS), EAX, Dolby Digital EX, ASIO 2.0, THX, EAX 4.0, Digital Theater Systems Digital Surround, OpenAL, Digital Theater Systems Extended Surround (DTS-ES)).
However, its internal resample from 44 to 48 kHz made me have a look at other options, such as M-Audio Revolution 7.1 which do not resample internally.
I think i would feel more confortable if buy the audigy 2 zs. I mean... the main purpose of my soundcard would be music listening, dvd video and some gaming. If the internal resample of audigy 2 zs could be avoided, i'm sure i'd buy it, even if M-Audio Revo is said to be better.
Is the resample possible to avoid, maybe with some drivers tweaking? What should I buy?

Thanks in advance

Avoid Audigy's internal resample

Reply #1 –
Quote
Is the resample possible to avoid, maybe with some drivers tweaking?

Yes, if you disable all effects/upmixes/whatever in drivers, then will the sound be played thru p16v device (aditional chip which supports everything up to 24-bit/192Khz) and it won't resample.

Avoid Audigy's internal resample

Reply #2 –
Seriously i think this issue is over-emphasized. I'm not sure anyone on this board can actually hear the resampling on regular music.

Avoid Audigy's internal resample

Reply #3 –
What are the audible consequences of it? Hissing?

Avoid Audigy's internal resample

Reply #4 –
I believe that the k-mixer resampling issue is avoided*** by using the Soundblaster (Live!/Audigy/Audigy2) compatible KX drivers...which appear to be ASIO (or kernel mode).

For further details, see...
http://kxproject.lugosoft.com/index.php?skip=1

xen-uno

***maybe not (according to this)...
http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/index....topic=17842&hl=
No one can be told what Ogg Vorbis is...you have to hear it for yourself
- Morpheus

Avoid Audigy's internal resample

Reply #5 –
Quote
Yes, if you disable all effects/upmixes/whatever in drivers, then will the sound be played thru p16v device (aditional chip which supports everything up to 24-bit/192Khz) and it won't resample.

Are you certain of this? Will 44.1 KHz data be played without any resampling? I had heard the additional chip in Audigy2 cards would only be used at sample rates of 48 KHz and more, but not at 44.1 KHz. Has this changed in later models?

Avoid Audigy's internal resample

Reply #6 –
I think this was discussed way back when PP created his SSRC enabled output plugins for WinAMP 2.xx.

If you were to set the quality of the resample (done in the Multimedia settings) to as high as possible (default is highest quality on Win2K based systems XP Included and low on Win9X system) there is no audible difference... if you were hearing one ABX it then I will believe you. To do this use the standard plugin to let the Creative card resample to 48khz and then switch plugins to let the SSRC do the resampling. I did it and didn't hear a difference when the resample was set to high quality.

Regards

AgentMil
-=MusePack... Living Audio Compression=-

Honda - The Power of Dreams

Avoid Audigy's internal resample

Reply #7 –
Quote
Yes, if you disable all effects/upmixes/whatever in drivers, then will the sound be played thru p16v device (aditional chip which supports everything up to 24-bit/192Khz) and it won't resample.

It will be played through the P16V chip, but from research i did last year into it. AFAIK it will *still* resample.

Avoid Audigy's internal resample

Reply #8 –
OK, I might be wrong on this. I have no expirience with Creative drivers 'cause I don't use them.

With kX drivers and Audigy2(ZS) there is aditional "kX Wave HQ" device, which is actually p16v chip - that is - no DSP, no effects, no upmixing; but it supports 24-bit (padded to 32-bit for KS; for DS it should work with any bitrate) and samplerates upto 96Khz (not sure about 192Khz, as Creative's marketing claims).

EDIT: I was wrong; it seems that p16v chip produces noise at 44.1Khz; no problems with 48Khz and 96Khz. It looks like it was supposed to support 44.1, but that wasn't done correctly.

Avoid Audigy's internal resample

Reply #9 –
Well, I just re-did some tests with udial.wav (post here) and at least for an Audigy 2, it appears that you can't bypass it's internal resampling. Wether or not you can actually hear a difference with real music is something I can't answer (in fact I'm almost positive I wouldn't be able to hear any differences!)


Cheers, Joey.

Avoid Audigy's internal resample

Reply #10 –
I dug up my old files from the resample blind test. I just post the original and the SB live one. Here's the original (44100 Hz), the compression format is Lpac.

Avoid Audigy's internal resample

Reply #11 –
Here is the same file played with Windows98 WaveOut device, in an SB Live soundcard, to the SPDIF output.
It was recorded with the Marian Marc 2 digital input. Thus it is a lossless capture of the resampled digital output of the SB Live.

Avoid Audigy's internal resample

Reply #12 –
this is how you unlock 24/96 playback on an Audigy 2.  A friend has an Audigy 2 so I did her the favor of finding and applying this workaround.  It really does work... her A2 can now produce frequencies of up to 48khz (waves, not sampling rate :)) with any application including Winamp.

however, I don't know if her A2 upsamples to 96khz or what.  As for me, I have an M-Audio Revolution, which does not have the resampling problem.

and thanks for posting those files Pio2001
seanny.net

Avoid Audigy's internal resample

Reply #13 –
Is everything above 48KHz left alone, or is it resampled as well?
Can you avoid resampling by simply convert any 44.1KHz audio to 88.2KHz with the SSRC Direct Sound output in Winamp?

Avoid Audigy's internal resample

Reply #14 –
Quote
Is everything above 48KHz left alone, or is it resampled as well?
Can you avoid resampling by simply convert any 44.1KHz audio to 88.2KHz with the SSRC Direct Sound output in Winamp?

Yes, it can be avoided by resampling to 48Khz; 88.2 isn unnecessary.

Avoid Audigy's internal resample

Reply #15 –
Quote
Yes, it can be avoided by resampling to 48Khz; 88.2 isn unnecessary.

But wouldn't 88.2KHz (= 44.1 * 2) be more accurate to the original wave since you only double the samples? Converting to 48KHz (= 44.1 * 1.0884...) seems harder to replicate the original wave since you have to shift the samples, not just double them.

Avoid Audigy's internal resample

Reply #16 –
Quote
If you were to set the quality of the resample (done in the Multimedia settings) to as high as possible (default is highest quality on Win2K based systems XP Included and low on Win9X system) there is no audible difference... if you were hearing one ABX it then I will believe you.


Sample here.

I resampled la_river_441.wav to 48khz with foobar's resampler, and I can ABX that wav file vs. the original 16/16 with my Audigy 1, latest drivers, XP home, resampling quality set to best.  (With foobar's DSP off when ABXing of course.)

I'm curious what other Audigy owners can hear.  Is the resampling better with an Audigy 2?