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Poll

A DVD player with MPC decoder ... Would you buy one, and how much would you be willing to spend for it ?

  • I would buy this DVD player at once, and pay 100,- € for it
    16 (10.5%)
  • I would buy this DVD player at once, and pay 150,- € for it
    18 (11.8%)
  • I would buy this DVD player at once, and pay 200,- € for it
    19 (12.4%)
  • I would buy this DVD player at once, and pay 300,- € for it
    15 (9.8%)
  • I am interested and would maybe buy it later, for 100,- €
    12 (7.8%)
  • I am interested and would maybe buy it later, for 150,- €
    25 (16.3%)
  • I am interested and would maybe buy it later, for 200,- €
    7 (4.6%)
  • I am interested and would maybe buy it later, for 300,- €
    4 (2.6%)
  • What is MPC ?? Never heard of it ....
    10 (6.5%)
  • I am using MPC, but i am not interested in a hardware player
    27 (17.6%)

Total Members Voted: 203

Topic: MPC hardware support ! How much would you pay .. (Read 15836 times) previous topic - next topic

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  • ChristianHJW
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MPC hardware support ! How much would you pay ..
Hi,

one wish out front to the Vorbis and AAC users : Please keep out of this thread, ok ??

This poll here is not to discuss about patent problems, technical feasibility, and whether you think there is value for such a unit or not. It is only ment to give voice to MPC users who would be interested in such a unit, and how much they would be willingly to pay for it, thats it !

Background information :

We are talking to several companies right now who are manufacturing DVD players with MPEG4 support about a matroska implementation into these units. At least with one of these companies our conversations have reached an interesting level.

Most of these units do support Ogg Vorbis already, thanks to the tremor library. I was talking to them lately about adding MPC SV7 support also and was pointing them to Frank's L-GPL libs in C, which would compile fine on their µC Linux development environments once some modifications had been made to it, like replacing all floats, etc.

About potential patent problems :

We have not been discussing this in detail yet with them, but these are the points to consider :

1. Is a decoder also subject to patent violation, or is it mainly the encoder ?
2. MPC is not known in the industry at all, so who cares ?
3. These guys pay MP2 licensing fees anyhow ( for VCD/SVCD/DVD support ), so maye all formats derived from it are covered in this licensing already ?

Again, please lets not start a flame war here about if these considerations are true or not, we are not in this state yet. This poll has only one purpose, to show to them if there was interest in such a unit. Period.

Christian
MPC and matroska project admin
Support matroska - the bestest vapourware project ! http://www.matroska.org

  • sony666
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MPC hardware support ! How much would you pay ..
Reply #1
100 $/EURO is the absolute maximum I would fork out for any kind of standalone player

  • kode54
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  • Administrator
MPC hardware support ! How much would you pay ..
Reply #2
I sort of agree with sony666, to a certain extent. I may be willing to pay more in the future.

God damn, I said MTRH. Too many fucking cat avatars. :B


Quote
I am using MPC, but i am not interested in a hardware player   [ 3 ]

Peculiar...
  • Last Edit: 21 October, 2003, 08:31:06 AM by kode54

  • ChristianHJW
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MPC hardware support ! How much would you pay ..
Reply #3
Quote
100 $/EURO is the absolute maximum I would fork out for any kind of standalone player

You are aware that this player will also play your DivX/XviD/MPEG4 movies, plus Ogg Vorbis and maybe even AAC files ? Again, this is not only a MPC player, and not only a normal DVD player ..... the one i wanted even had a network connection for my local LAN  ....
Support matroska - the bestest vapourware project ! http://www.matroska.org

  • niktheblak
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  • Members (Donating)
MPC hardware support ! How much would you pay ..
Reply #4
I would consider it even if it was only implemented on high end (300 - 500 euro) MPEG-4 DVD players.

I'm mostly interested in high end DVD players because of the progressive scan feature. I've entered that world few months ago and never want to go back to interlaced image

Most of the current MPEG-4 DVD players offer progressive scan, and are firmware upgradeable. If one of those players got Matroska or just MPC SV7 support, I'd be really interested. Most of my music is in MPC format, and it would really mean lot to me to be able to play these MPC CD's on a DVD player.

@ ChristianHJW

Are you referring to the KiSS DP-500 player
  • Last Edit: 21 October, 2003, 08:34:53 AM by niktheblak

  • kode54
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  • Administrator
MPC hardware support ! How much would you pay ..
Reply #5
Quote
You are aware that this player will also play your DivX/XviD/MPEG4 movies, plus Ogg Vorbis and maybe even AAC files ? Again, this is not only a MPC player, and not only a normal DVD player ..... the one i wanted even had a network connection for my local LAN  ....

Not directed at me, but...

I am aware of this. I won't be piping my spare 25ft of cat5 cable from the den to the living room to network my DVD player. I'd probably also buy my first portable player before I buy a DVD machine that supports these formats.

I may spend more time in front of my computer than I do outside of my house, but a portable player does come in handy for those few times each month that I may be out on an extended trip.

A stand-alone player would be nice, but I don't see myself buying one in the immediate future. It might be a step towards portable player support, though. It all depends.

  • sthayashi
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MPC hardware support ! How much would you pay ..
Reply #6
Damn you ChristianHJW, I had to go looking around online to see how many Euros there are in a US Dollar (a figure I don't keep track of since I never go to Europe)  .  At any rate, I put down I MIGHT by one later at $150.  The biggest reason for that was that earlier this year, I realized it would be much more prudent to purchase and build a small media center computer that should be able to play back any format that has windows development.

Truthfully, I would prefer a portable hardware MPC player.  Not for the audio portions of movies, but for music.  But you didn't askd about that.

  • tigre
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MPC hardware support ! How much would you pay ..
Reply #7
Quote
You are aware that this player will also play your DivX/XviD/MPEG4 movies, plus Ogg Vorbis and maybe even AAC files ? Again, this is not only a MPC player, and not only a normal DVD player ..... the one i wanted even had a network connection for my local LAN  ....

I will build such a DVD player - not now but later - and will most likely spend more than 300 € for components: Silent PC, good Soundcard, TV out, digital TV card, big HDD(s), DVD drive, remote controll ... as sthayashi said:
Quote
I realized it would be much more prudent to purchase and build a small media center computer that should be able to play back any format that has windows development.


Probably I would buy a portable with MPC support.
Let's suppose that rain washes out a picnic. Who is feeling negative? The rain? Or YOU? What's causing the negative feeling? The rain or your reaction? - Anthony De Mello

  • sony666
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MPC hardware support ! How much would you pay ..
Reply #8
Quote
Quote
100 $/EURO is the absolute maximum I would fork out for any kind of standalone player

You are aware that this player will also play your DivX/XviD/MPEG4 movies, plus Ogg Vorbis and maybe even AAC files ? Again, this is not only a MPC player, and not only a normal DVD player ..... the one i wanted even had a network connection for my local LAN  ....

Yes, I am aware of that...

Look, my local gas station is selling standalones for like 59 Euro with mp3/WMA, Kodak photoCD and whatnot support. From a consumer point of view, that fancy mpeg4 stuff and mpc would justify a price increase of max. 5 Euro imho. Its just another chip from Taiwan for a few cents

  • ChristianHJW
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MPC hardware support ! How much would you pay ..
Reply #9
Quote
Look, my local gas station is selling standalones for like 59 Euro with mp3/WMA, Kodak photoCD and whatnot support. From a consumer point of view, that fancy mpeg4 stuff and mpc would justify a price increase of max. 5 Euro imho. Its just another chip from Taiwan for a few cents

So lets wait until someone in Taiwan makes a chip that decodes MPC  .....

The company we are talking to are working hard to differentiate their units from exactly these cheapo units, by implementing support for a huge variety of different audio and video formats, as well as offering new services that are unknown for typical standalone units so far.

This is only possible because they are using a platform that does allow to add new formats by compiling existing sourcecode on a kind of Linux platform, but in a special version for a small programmable unit. Needless to say that such a unit has to have a much higher price than other, simple DVD players with a standard, unflexible one-chip solution.

Anyhow, i am quite happy about the results of the poll so far. Its not even one day old, and there are a couple of people with a real interest in such a unit.

What i will do now, i will contact the guys and offer them to order 50 units on my own costs, if they implement MPC SV7 decoding based on Frank's decoder library. I will ask them for a nice discount for the units, and we start distributing them here amongst the MPC fans. To make sure i get rid of the 50 units we will hold the MPC firmware upgrade back until i sold all 50 of them .....  ... what you think  !!!
Support matroska - the bestest vapourware project ! http://www.matroska.org

  • ErikS
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MPC hardware support ! How much would you pay ..
Reply #10
Btw, I hope you don't forget the integerized version of the decoder that cb2000 made. Could save some work for your hardware friends.

  • sony666
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MPC hardware support ! How much would you pay ..
Reply #11
Ok, some people are the cheap consumer type, and some don't mind spending a little dough to live on the bleeding edge of home entertainment....

Of course I wish you all the best for your enterprises

  • ChristianHJW
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MPC hardware support ! How much would you pay ..
Reply #12
Quote
Btw, I hope you don't forget the integerized version of the decoder that cb2000 made. Could save some work for your hardware friends.

    !!!

ErikS, you're a star ! I downlaoded them from rarewares and sent it to the developers of the company. Its only 27 KB as sourcecode, and 17 KB compiled  !! Great, just great ! Thanks a lot, i had no idea !!
Support matroska - the bestest vapourware project ! http://www.matroska.org

  • Eli
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MPC hardware support ! How much would you pay ..
Reply #13
Christian,
I would be very interested in this as I would like to stream from a central medai center.

I am even more interested in a portable MPC player. Maybe you should be in contact with RCA as their new lyra product supports an awful lot and I would gladly pay a premium for MPC support.

MPC hardware support ! How much would you pay ..
Reply #14
Well, due to the price of a good power supply and good converter, plus the fact that there is not a very huge market... I have voted for $/€300 option. Not that I'm willing to pay more but because it seems for me more realistic for a good-sounding device - and if one needs MPC, this should be to have a good sound, IMHO.

-ec

  • sthayashi
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MPC hardware support ! How much would you pay ..
Reply #15
Quote
The company we are talking to are working hard to differentiate their units from exactly these cheapo units, by implementing support for a huge variety of different audio and video formats, as well as offering new services that are unknown for typical standalone units so far.

This is only possible because they are using a platform that does allow to add new formats by compiling existing sourcecode on a kind of Linux platform, but in a special version for a small programmable unit. Needless to say that such a unit has to have a much higher price than other, simple DVD players with a standard, unflexible one-chip solution.

If you could get DVD-A on there as well, I would consider spending the equivalent of 300 Euros.
Quote
What i will do now, i will contact the guys and offer them to order 50 units on my own costs, if they implement MPC SV7 decoding based on Frank's decoder library. I will ask them for a nice discount for the units, and we start distributing them here amongst the MPC fans. To make sure i get rid of the 50 units we will hold the MPC firmware upgrade back until i sold all 50 of them

I really hope that you were just joking with this part.

  • clintb
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MPC hardware support ! How much would you pay ..
Reply #16
What kind of network support are we talking here?  If it did something like what a slimp3 or audiotron does along with having the disc player built in, I'd buy it in a minute for even more money.

Features I want:
MPC decoding
Audiotron drive mapping or SliMP3 type of streaming server support.
DVD Playback w/progressive
CD/CD-RW playback of mp3/mpc
IR control

Features I don't care about:
Built-in hard disk.  (That's what my server is for)

  • thop
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MPC hardware support ! How much would you pay ..
Reply #17
I don't think there is much interest. I'm sure that not even 0.1% of the general public even heard about MPC and probably only 10% of the tech savy guys.

I don't know how many people on HA use MPC, but i'm betting it's less than 30%, and they are the codec freaks!! 

Not to discourage you or anything but i think the monetary perspective looks rather slim. I don't think thats what drives you though. You know what they say: If it feels right, do it!

  • sthayashi
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MPC hardware support ! How much would you pay ..
Reply #18
Quote
I don't know how many people on HA use MPC, but i'm betting it's less than 30%, and they are the codec freaks!!

STFU

http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/index....showtopic=2404&
  • Last Edit: 21 October, 2003, 02:20:20 PM by sthayashi

  • smok3
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  • Moderator
MPC hardware support ! How much would you pay ..
Reply #19
that would depend on the release date, i guess in a year or two i would pay 50 euros for a 'standalone' pc with all this features... (and more)
PANIC: CPU 1: Cache Error (unrecoverable - dcache data) Eframe = 0x90000000208cf3b8
NOTICE - cpu 0 didn't dump TLB, may be hung

  • CiTay
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  • Administrator
MPC hardware support ! How much would you pay ..
Reply #20
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that would depend on the release date, i guess in a year or two i would pay 50 euros for a 'standalone' pc with all this features... (and more)

How should this be possible with a quality product? Good components always cost money, and they will also cost money in 2 years. 50 Euro is way too optimistic if you ask me.

Me, i would pay 150 Euro for a DVD player with these features, good audio & video quality and the necessary output connections.

  • smok3
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  • Moderator
MPC hardware support ! How much would you pay ..
Reply #21
i was thinking more in the line of 'are standalone black boxes with play button really a future' ?
PANIC: CPU 1: Cache Error (unrecoverable - dcache data) Eframe = 0x90000000208cf3b8
NOTICE - cpu 0 didn't dump TLB, may be hung

  • mtth.th
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MPC hardware support ! How much would you pay ..
Reply #22
I have (sadly) nothing really interesting to add, but I can say than I will be really happy if such a player ever exists, and I will buy it in weeks !
  • Last Edit: 21 October, 2003, 05:42:34 PM by CiTay

  • snek_one
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MPC hardware support ! How much would you pay ..
Reply #23
i vote for the portable player with mpc support..

don't really need a dvd player which does that since my computer is my entire entertainment system.. it's got everything in one little case
[..:: West Coast Electro Sound of Holland ::..]

  • ty1er
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MPC hardware support ! How much would you pay ..
Reply #24
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i vote for the portable player with mpc support..


I would love an portable/car mpc player. Something like the kenwood music keg.
for the last two years i have been encoding most of my music collection into the mpc format, and all a long having wishfull thinking that eventaully there will be hardware support for musepack SV7 and up 

-ty1er
  • Last Edit: 28 October, 2003, 03:57:01 PM by ty1er