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Topic: MP3 Pro at 128 kBit/s (Read 5042 times) previous topic - next topic

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  • milhouse
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MP3 Pro at 128 kBit/s
I use the Program "My MP3 Pro" from Steinberg. I tried to encode a File with 128 kBit/s and with 64 kBit/s. With both Rates I have 2 Files with the same Bandwith, both go up to 15-16 kHz. It seems that the SBR is only wotking at 64 kBit/s. But why can I trigger the Encoder up to 128 kBit/s, when hi produces the same Quality as the normal MP3-Codec???
Can anybody help me???


sorry for my bad english ....

Milhouse

  • indybrett
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MP3 Pro at 128 kBit/s
Reply #1
How are you determining the bandwidth?

I think you need a decoder that support mp3pro to get the "extra" bandwidth. With a standard mp3 decoder it would look and sound just like any other mp3 file. Maybe I have misunderstood the question.
  • Last Edit: 07 August, 2003, 05:27:43 PM by indybrett
flac>fb2k>kernel streaming>audiophile 2496>magni>dt990 pro

  • saratoga
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MP3 Pro at 128 kBit/s
Reply #2
Quote
I use the Program "My MP3 Pro" from Steinberg. I tried to encode a File with 128 kBit/s and with 64 kBit/s. With both Rates I have 2 Files with the same Bandwith, both go up to 15-16 kHz. It seems that the SBR is only wotking at 64 kBit/s. But why can I trigger the Encoder up to 128 kBit/s, when hi produces the same Quality as the normal MP3-Codec???
Can anybody help me???


sorry for my bad english ....

Milhouse

I didn't think 128k mp3pro was possible.  What would be the point?  At that bitrate you wouldn't need pro.

  • ff123
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MP3 Pro at 128 kBit/s
Reply #3
I think mp3pro vbr 100% (which averages about 130 kbit/s, according to Cool Edit Pro 2.1) can sound better than lame --alt-preset 128.  At least on waiting.wav, it sounds much better to my ears.

So I think the jury is out on the idea that mp3pro is not useful for bitrates like 128.  This may be another myth waiting to be disproved, just like the idea that MPC is not useful for 128.

ff123

  • rjamorim
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MP3 Pro at 128 kBit/s
Reply #4
I plan to test several MP3 encoders at 128kbps. It would be interesting to include MP3pro in this test. This test would happen later this year.

Of course, this test might not happen if I give up being a masochist and stop conducing tests. :B
Get up-to-date binaries of Lame, AAC, Vorbis and much more at RareWares:
http://www.rarewares.org

  • guruboolez
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MP3 Pro at 128 kBit/s
Reply #5
Last year, I performed a blind listening test on one entire track (Metallica - One), cut on 12 parts (OK, it wasn't the best choice, to take 12 samples from a same track - that's partially why I didn't publish the results). I opposed mpc --radio, PsyTEL --streaming, Vorbis -b 4, lame ABR, mp3pro VBR max, wma and two atrac3 codec (ACM & Real).
MPC won the test. Second, close : PsyTEL AAC. If I remember correctly, LAME was third and Vorbis 4th. The very worse challengers were WMA and MP3PRO, far behind all challengers.
MP3PRO, on loud metal rif, sounded very muffled, despite of a full spectral reproduction... very strange. Stereo imaging seemed to be reduced ; I even suspected myself to ruin the encoding by wrong settings (IS, near stereo ?)

Anyway, I didn't keep good memories from mp3pro at ~130 kbps, especially when compared to lame.

  • milhouse
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MP3 Pro at 128 kBit/s
Reply #6
ok, maybe its not very useful to use MP3 Pro @ 128 kBit/s, but it seems that the SBR is not working at this rate, only at 64 kBit/s. Is that so or is this an characteristic for "My MP3 Pro"?????
The Frequency-analyser shows the same bandwith at both rates (128 and 64), and then is the question that why can I trigger the Encoder to 128 kBit/s when I get no Advantage?????


Milhouse

  • amano
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MP3 Pro at 128 kBit/s
Reply #7
SBR is only working with very low bitrates. technically it would be working with higher bitrates, but you wouldn't gain any additional quality with it.

the same applies for aac HE.
the aac HE main developer ivan dimkovic pointed out several times that SBR is of no use with higher bitrates, so AAC HE is limited to bitrates up to 96kbps. beyond this rate, "normal" aac is used.

that's the problem with mp3pro. most hard and software players don't support the sbr part and without it, it's technically not superior to most other codecs.

at bitrates beyond 100 kbps it should be inferior to both lame and the fraunhoffer codec (here you can believe to guruboolez golden ears, I think, but only a broad listening test can verify this objectively). I heard from many people that at 128 kbps the fraunfoffer codec should be the one of choice, although at higher bitrates lame should be clearly superior.
  • Last Edit: 08 August, 2003, 09:38:29 PM by amano

  • ff123
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MP3 Pro at 128 kBit/s
Reply #8
Actually, In Cool Edit Pro 2.1, there is the capability to encode with mp3pro VBR quality 100%, which is supposed to yield bitrates which average about 130 kbit/s.  So apparently, SBR can be used at bitrates higher than 96 kbit/s.  I also notice that the spectral view of these files shows frequencies higher than 16 kHz, implying that the base frequency is higher than 8 kHz.

It is definitely superior to lame --alt-preset 128 on waiting.wav (to my ears).

ff123

  • amano
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MP3 Pro at 128 kBit/s
Reply #9
well, might be (I won't touch mp3pro - it's evil)

but that's just one sample...
never judge a codec by just one.

  • rjamorim
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MP3 Pro at 128 kBit/s
Reply #10
That's why I plan to conduce an MP3 listening test by the end of the year.
Get up-to-date binaries of Lame, AAC, Vorbis and much more at RareWares:
http://www.rarewares.org

  • AtaqueEG
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MP3 Pro at 128 kBit/s
Reply #11
Quote
That's why I plan to conduce an MP3 listening test by the end of the year.

Unless you decide to stop being a masochist, right?     

Two mentions of such test on a single thread... that's too much of a tease for you to not deliver...
I'm the one in the picture, sitting on a giant cabbage in Mexico, circa 1978.
Reseñas de Rock en Español: www.estadogeneral.com

  • rjamorim
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MP3 Pro at 128 kBit/s
Reply #12
Quote
Unless you decide to stop being a masochist, right?     

Actually, the 64 kbps test will only happen if I stop being a masochist :B

The MP3 test would be scheduled around november or december. There would be several tests before.

Quote
Two mentions of such test on a single thread... that's too much of a tease for you to not deliver...


Actually, it's because the opportunity came

Who knows, this thread will probably be forgotten until then anyway...
Get up-to-date binaries of Lame, AAC, Vorbis and much more at RareWares:
http://www.rarewares.org