Skip to main content

Poll

Poll closed. Apparently both are overly coloured completely overpriced and a HD6XX with mini-DSP will perform better.

Sennheiser HD800s
[ 0 ] (0%)
Sony MDR-Z1R
[ 0 ] (0%)

Total Members Voted: 0

Topic: Headphone Poll: HD800s vs Sony MDR-Z1R for Classical (Read 2560 times) previous topic - next topic
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Re: Headphone Poll: HD800s vs Sony MDR-Z1R for Classical

Reply #25
The ODAC is still a fine DAC absolutely audibly transparent, but you can get similar or better (improved tech specs, more inputs etc.) DACs for the same price or cheaper. Especially if you would have to import the ODAC from the US.

If you only need USB input, the Topping D10 matches or outperforms the ODAC on tech specs, and is €90 on Amazon.

Regarding headphone amps, the Objective2 is still available, but JDS Labs (the main maker/seller of ODACs and Objective2s) now makes the Atom, which has improved ergonomics and design, and can also be used as a preamp/volume control for powered speakers.

Re: Headphone Poll: HD800s vs Sony MDR-Z1R for Classical

Reply #26
Especially if you would have to import the ODAC from the US.
Yeah, that is an issue. Also one of the reasons why I decided not to buy the Jotunheim. At Schiit Europe they basically charge you all the import duties on top of the price, which makes their products 100€ more than in the US. And I hear their EU customer service is atrocious, don't even think about returning a product or claiming your warranty.

I would like the JDS labs Element. But JDS labs stuff is also hard to get in Europe.
At thomann.de I can get various fostex headphone amps, the Lake People G105, Lake People HPA RS 02 Reference Series and Swissonic dacs.
Hhhmmmm Croissants.....

Re: Headphone Poll: HD800s vs Sony MDR-Z1R for Classical

Reply #27
Thomann also sells the Focusrite Scarlett 2i2, which is a very good choice, too. The built-in headphone amp is decent.

Re: Headphone Poll: HD800s vs Sony MDR-Z1R for Classical

Reply #28
Frequencies below 60 Hz are attentuated but "bass" starts a lot higher than that.
   
Could you elaborate more on that for a layman like me, please?

   
As a musician, there's not a lot of uses for frequencies that low. Technically a person can hear them, but they can't hear anything about them or what's going on with them. Theres only really the presence of absence of one sound that can be produced down there and it's a low muddy rumble. You can almost always High Pass all of that range of frequencies out of your music and nobody would ever know you did. In fact a lot of people wouldn't be able to hear it if you left it in because most systems can't even display most of those frequencies because you don't need to unless you're trying to display the sound of an earthquake or something.
 
 

That's what I suspected it was, initially.

Thank you both for helping me making sure I was on the ball.
Listen to the music, not the media.
Qualidade em MP3

 

Re: Headphone Poll: HD800s vs Sony MDR-Z1R for Classical

Reply #29
Literally 80% of the time I see professionals in studios engineering music I see them wearing Sennheiser HD600 headphones. And I could never understand why they weren't wearing more expensive headphones. I chalked it up to budget concerns, but now I realize how dumb that is. Like these celebrity billionaires who own different Lamborghinis for every day of the week couldn't afford some 1700$ headphones. Now I realize they don't use those headphones because they're a downgrade rather than an upgrade.

Professionals use or used a variety of headphones. The HD-600 is among them, yes. But so are Beyerdynamic, Sony (7506 is still used often despite being ancient; it just has a pretty good seal and is robust), Audio Technica and AKG (K240 or variants). Once you realize that those aren't among the most expensive headphones, it'll give you some perspective.

On the other hand, professionals also use B&W for speakers. And those aren't exactly the most neutral ones. Neither is the Yamaha NS10 which was (and sometimes still is) all the rage once.

So professionals can be as ill informed as your common audiophile.

You know, it's funny. Knowing what I know now, when I go back and listen to the people who I listened to before I really start to notice the marketing BS they throw in. All the scummy tactics and made up vocabulary.
It's like wearing the sunglasses from the movie "They live". Once you put them on you suddenly see who all the alien infiltrators are.

Reading audiophiles arguing on forums becomes the funniest thing you'll ever hear once you realize those are basically two adults getting irate and insulting each other over what EQ setting they prefer.

Companies selling High End audio products are there for just one reason: they want to make money. Magazines (who review their products) are helping them. They don't even need to get paid, they only need to be friendly, perhaps an interview or a guided tour through one of their facilities will be the result. So they're working hand in hand to sell a product. It's nothing more.

You can see this beautifully on https://www.innerfidelity.com/

When Tyll Hertens retired, the audiophile salesmen reviewers took over. Tyll wasn't the most objective reviewer but at least he had some practical sense (and he measured). Since he's gone, the reviewed products have gotten a lot more expensive and "boutique": small companies selling audiophile-targeted stuff. And they don't have measurements anymore. They constantly write that they'll include them in the future again but that they have problems coming up with the best ones (-> painting the reviewed products in the best light possible). Sure, as if measuring headphones is so difficult.

A few months ago I commented on one of their reviews which was ridiculous and used audiophile speak throughout, reminding them how industry-abiding they had become; it wasn't even cleared (they monitor and moderate the comments). So IMO they know exactly what they're doing and that one cannot take any recently published review seriously.
marlene-d.blogspot.com

Re: Headphone Poll: HD800s vs Sony MDR-Z1R for Classical

Reply #30
You can see this beautifully on https://www.innerfidelity.com/
 
One needn't even torture him/herself by delving into their overly biased reviews (assuming one has the stomach for it):
Their home page - with all its usual run-of-the-mill hocus pocus phone cables, so-called hi-fi fuses ::)  and even a gold-plated DAP ::) ::) will give any mere mortal an idea of how out-of-touch their wacky reality is.
Listen to the music, not the media.
Qualidade em MP3

Re: Headphone Poll: HD800s vs Sony MDR-Z1R for Classical

Reply #31
Actually I'm dirt poor. But considering the enjoyment I get out of music and the amount of time I invested in ripping my CDs. I thought I deserved to splurge just once in my life.

(...)

But I do think that with headphones you get what you pay for (at least up to a point).

Actually, especially headphones are prone to audiophile BS. You buy an expensive headphone; you'll need an equally expensive headphone amp; if you have both and want to "enter the highest spheres" you'll also need equally expensive cables (whether it's a power cable or headphone cables). And it goes on and on.

What you need to do: you have to look at frequency responses. Doing that you'll see that either HD-800 or the Sony are coloured headphones. Many very expensive headphones are coloured messes (there are few exceptions). You have to ask yourself if you want to spend the extra money for a headphone that has a built-in equalizer that's always active and cannot be switched off or if you want something cheaper you can tune to your personal desires.

I have heard the HD-800, I didn't like it. Its sound had too much treble and lacked bass. Built quality is top notch though. I have owned a HD-600 for roughly 15 years and whatever headphones I try in store, I always come back to it, it simply is one of the most neutral headphones on the market. Having said that, using a certain software (Sonarworks), I was able to make an ATH-M50x almost sound like the HD-600. You'd also be able to make a HD-600 sound like a HD-800. Or, in effect, the ATH-M50x sound like the HD-800 (or the Sony). You just need to know their respective frequency responses and whatever phase distortions they create.

When Harman researched how people prefer to listen to music over headphones they did exactly that: they used a cheap headphone (HD-518 I believe) to mimic much more expensive ones. Did it work? Of course it did. Don't believe the crap you read on Head-Fi. It's a commercial forum that's bent on selling as much as possible and whose people are very, very friendly (obedient?) to manufacturers.

I won't give you any recommendations, what I prefer may be your nightmare. To me, the seat is important. I sold the ATH-M50x because its earcups were too small for long-term listening (I like them big and space-y). I bought the HD-380 Pro instead. Compared to the HD-800 it's dirt cheap. Can I mimic the more expensive headphone? Yes I can. But why would I do that when the HD-380 Pro sounds good enough on its own and can be equalized to be neutral?

EDIT: of course, the HD-800 can also be equalized to sound neutral. But why would I spend almost 2000 Euros if I can do the same with headphones costing a tenth?

Easy to mimic a much more expensive when in reality, its just slightly better up to $300 headphone driver/FR wise. Some AKG's can come very close to the HD800 sound for only $150. EQ'd ER4S/SR can have more clarity than hyped up TOTL stuff with allot of drivers.




Re: Headphone Poll: HD800s vs Sony MDR-Z1R for Classical

Reply #34
Lol this thread.
Can't you guys get it into your head that Summit Fi purchases are from the heart and never from logic?

They're basically the same as buying a supercar, very dissuaded, but people who do hear and use them daily, appreciate what they got when they came back from work and put it on, using it for hours.
That's, their job.

Neutral headphone can't do that. Yes you can always add EQ and DSP for every change you want but that's more time spent on you playing around with software, some people think they're not worth it and prefer others doing it for them, just plug and they sound the same on anything they put it on. There's an allure in that.

Even try you might, DSP has its limits. It's not software that makes sound it's the physical object, the driver, the enclosure.

Worse is people that says and claim stuffs here most probably never heard what they're talking about, like at all.

The things said here, lol headphone ain't that simple.
Build, longevity, comfort, isolation, resell value, etc. Are different.

Every luxury goods has a price, and just lt those that have the means to enjoy what they want.
I do agree if you don't have the leeway to NEVER go and stretch your budget.

Just stick to HD600? That's actually a good advice, but really the reasoning behind it is just too exaggerated here..

Tho when I read OP's posts I can't help but think he made this just to dissuage himself, or crack some jokes with people.

Re: Headphone Poll: HD800s vs Sony MDR-Z1R for Classical

Reply #35
Lol this thread.
Can't you guys get it into your head that Summit Fi purchases are from the heart and never from logic?

They're basically the same as buying a supercar, very dissuaded, but people who do hear and use them daily, appreciate what they got when they came back from work and put it on, using it for hours.
That's, their job.

Neutral headphone can't do that. Yes you can always add EQ and DSP for every change you want but that's more time spent on you playing around with software, some people think they're not worth it and prefer others doing it for them, just plug and they sound the same on anything they put it on. There's an allure in that.

Even try you might, DSP has its limits. It's not software that makes sound it's the physical object, the driver, the enclosure.

Worse is people that says and claim stuffs here most probably never heard what they're talking about, like at all.

The things said here, lol headphone ain't that simple.
Build, longevity, comfort, isolation, resell value, etc. Are different.

Every luxury goods has a price, and just lt those that have the means to enjoy what they want.
I do agree if you don't have the leeway to NEVER go and stretch your budget.

Just stick to HD600? That's actually a good advice, but really the reasoning behind it is just too exaggerated here..

Tho when I read OP's posts I can't help but think he made this just to dissuage himself, or crack some jokes with people.

What so hard about it?, that most summit-fi gear is FR trickery with DSP. If anything a netural headphone would be the easiest to EQ/tweak if the drivers can cope with it. The AKG K702/712 are £150+ headphones yet are the closest to the HD800 on wide soundstage.






 
SimplePortal 1.0.0 RC1 © 2008-2019